I'm Not Dude!

[MA-Caver]

Officer Suspended After Skateboarder Rant
http://www.abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=4282823&page=1

A veteran Baltimore police officer was suspended after a video appeared on YouTube showing him manhandling a 14-year-old skateboarder.
The video, which was reportedly shot during the summer and just recently appeared on YouTube, begins with Officer Salvatore Rivieri approaching a group of teens on skateboards.
"You're not allowed to ride your skateboards here," Rivieri tells two teenage skateboarders.
"We were just rolling by. … I didn't hear him because I had my iPod on," said Eric Bush, the teen who bore the brunt of Rivieri's wrath.
Don't Say 'Dude'
On the video, Bush is seen referring to Rivieri as "dude," and the officer responds with force, shoving Bush to the ground.
"I was scared. I didn't know if he was going to punch me," said Bush.
He wasn't scared speechless though, as Bush continued to refer to Rivieri as "dude."
"I didn't do anything dude," Bush says again on the video, this time inciting a rant from Rivieri.
"Obviously your parents don't put your foot in your butt quite enough, because you don't understand the meaning of the word respect. You better learn how to speak. I'm not 'man,' I'm not 'dude.' I am Officer Rivieri!" he shouts.
Reactions: "I was very upset," Bush's mother, Peggy Miller, said of watching the video.
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Watching the video, got this tightening in my stomach. The officer IMO was way out of line. Yelling and screaming and humiliating the kid for one thing.
Good Morning America (can't get the link) was talking about how they don't know how old is the video, and what were circumstances before and then after the video. Granted they're right.
But it seems to me that the kids were enroute to someplace and just didn't want to walk past the building when they could've easily skated past it. Interview with the kid (Bush) indicated that was their intent.
Officer Rivieri probably did see an ordinance violation and was putting the stop to the kids, most likely with the intent to warn them.
However; apparently he didn't like being called "Dude" and went off on that.
Teenagers are still learning the ins and outs of human relations. Knowing when to "shut-up" and when and how to speak to authority figures can be a tough task and must be taught. Officer Rivieri took it upon himself to teach them.

"Obviously your parents don't put your foot in your butt quite enough, because you don't understand the meaning of the word respect".

Made me wonder if Rivieri was a parent, because if he is then I'd feel sorry for HIS kids.

I dunno, were this my kid I'd be screaming for Rivieri's head. This is a 14 yr. old boy he was dealing with. That should've been taken in consideration. "Dude" is a word used to refer to EVERYBODY by these kids. I had a friend a few years ago who used "Dude" and even called his own mother "Dude", it is not a disrespectful moniker by any means. True, calling the officer "Officer" or (better yet) "Sir" would've gone over better for the kids but still, I think a little tolerance and understanding of kids would've been helpful here as well.
The site asks for people to vote on the rightness and wrongness of the Officer in question.
Lets do that here with comments from both LEO's on the board and non-LEO's.
DId the cop go too far? Was the kid being disrespectful?
The kid did resist the officer's taking of his skateboard but it was a natural reaction because in a kid's mind (going a thousand miles per second) "how am I gonna get home?" & "I didn't do anything wrong, I was just skating here" and the kid is scared as well with an burly officer yelling at him.
The cop was right in stopping the kids because they were in violation of a city ordinance (no skateboards) but he went beyond (personal) restraint, in yelling and verbally abusing the kid(s).

 

[arnisador]

Wish more of the initial tussle was on camera as it isn't perfectly clear how the kid reacted to the officer's approach. The phrase that comes to my mind is "assault under color of law". Perhaps that's too strong, but between the verbal abuse and the concomitant physical interaction, it looks just awful.

 

[terryl965]

Wish more of the initial tussle was on camera as it isn't perfectly clear how the kid reacted to the officer's approach. The phrase that comes to my mind is "assault under color of law". Perhaps that's too strong, but between the verbal abuse and the concomitant physical interaction, it looks just awful.

I agre I would need to see all of it before passing judgement

 

[BlackCatBonz]

You know, I was taught from a very young age to respect my elders and call them Sir or Ma'am, to speak when spoken to etc. etc.

I feel sorry for the cop because of the backlash that is going to come from lax parents that cannot or will not teach their kids to respect all adults (so as to avoid confusion, I do mean those adults that are teachers, police, other parents, etc.) because of bureaucratic BS liberals removing parental rights under the guise of political correctness.

I can't stand mouthy kids, or the ones that act like this kid.

I don't think the cop overstepped his bounds.....
I want kids to be scared to break the law or disrespect police.....isn't that the idea?

 

[Andrew Green]

I'd be more interested in kids respecting the law, and when LEO's act like that towards kids, that's just not going to happen.

 

[MJS]

I agree it would be helpful to see more, but all we have to go on is what we saw. IMHO, I think that the officer went a little over board with his actions. Is it possible that the kid really didn't hear him due to the Ipod? Sure. Is it possible he heard him an ignored him? Sure. Lets give the kid the benefit of the doubt and say he didn't hear him. Yelling and acting like the cop was doing, was not helping the situation.

Now, my Grandfather was a cop, so I was raised with that respect and I agree that its the parents job to teach their kids about it, as well as right from wrong. However, the reality of it is, many people don't. This guy is demanding respect, much like some martial artists demand that we respect their high rank or years in the art. We certainly can't force someone to respect us, thats common sense. But, its not helping the situation to yell. Even if there is no respect, having a calm attitude just may get you further than if you stoop to their level.

I think that you'll get further by being nice, than you will if you come off like an ***. An example. I was on a ride along with one of the officers from the dept. where I work. We got a call to a large apt. bldg because there were a group of kids outside, bouncing a basketball against the side of the bldg. Apparently this was disturbing the resident inside and they were afraid the ball may break a window. The cop got out of the car, called the kids over, explained things to them nicely, they excepted that, and moved along...to the basketball court. He didn't yell, he didn't rip the ball from the kids hand and make everyone line up with hands on the wall.

So I ask...why couldn't this officer do the same?

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Well was this cop professional in how he handled the situation?

I would say no.

I think he let his emotions and a bad day go to far and well now is probably paying the price.

We live in a global world now and your actions at anytime could be on video, tape, etc. and then broadcasted to the world. If you are in a position of control, power, authority you need to take that position very seriously and not allow your emotions to run you.

The officer here could very easily have asked the kid's to come over, tell them they cannot skate board there and that they need to move on. I do this all the time at my wife's office with skate boarders during the summer and the local LEO's do as well. If you treat them with respect they in general will do the same. Though of course there are always exceptions to the rule when they (the kid's) let their emotions run them.

You are the adult so:

Just do not let your emotions run you!

 

[MA-Caver]

Well was this cop professional in how he handled the situation?

I would say no.

I think he let his emotions and a bad day go to far and well now is probably paying the price.

We live in a global world now and your actions at anytime could be on video, tape, etc. and then broadcasted to the world. If you are in a position of control, power, authority you need to take that position very seriously and not allow your emotions to run you.

The officer here could very easily have asked the kid's to come over, tell them they cannot skate board there and that they need to move on. I do this all the time at my wife's office with skate boarders during the summer and the local LEO's do as well. If you treat them with respect they in general will do the same. Though of course there are always exceptions to the rule when they (the kid's) let their emotions run them.

You are the adult so:

Just do not let your emotions run you!

Yes, but how is it disrespectful to call a cop Dude? When it's commonly known that a lot of kids don't know better or don't THINK far enough ahead that they should be using more polite terms? If they were older kids yeah, chew 'em out for not knowing better, but at 14 ... they know but it's not yet moved to the front of the brain so it's the first thing on their minds to use "sir" or "officer". Takes time.

 

[CoryKS]

I couldn't figure out why the officer kept getting pissed off and shouting after he'd already finished yelling at the kid. It finally occurred to me that the kid was still talking but you couldn't hear it in the video. While I think that the officer behaved unprofessionally, I have a real problem with a kid who doesn't know the proper way to address police officers (or, for that matter, adults in general), and I have a problem with parents who don't teach their children these things.

I don't want to live in a society where the kids think the police are just a bunch of fellow "dudes" that don't need to be taken seriously. Consider that he told the officer that he was calling his mom. Does he honestly think his mommy is a higher authority than the police?

 

[Tez3]

Is being called 'dude' really that disrespectful? Admittedly it's not a word we hear much over here but surely that's a word used by them to each other in the way that older people call each other mate,pal etc? As a female I get more than my share of men calling me, pet, dear, love, hen, chuck, duck,flower, my love or whater depending on where they come from. It depends on the situation how you take it - as a normal figure of speech, an insult or as being patronising.
I don't think I've ever looked to be respected as such, I love chatting to teenagers, they have such an interesting outlook on the world. I think though perhaps British policing methods are more talk orientated than American police, we do enjoy a lot of banter with the public.
I noticed a longtime ago that Americans use 'sir' and 'maam' far more than we do which to be honest is hardly ever. We do however have a huge amount of words that can be equally polite but don't sound it so perhaps to me 'dude' isn't very bad.

 

[Andrew Green]

I imagine those kids called everyone "dude", friends more then anyone else. All I saw was a real life version of Eric Cartman demanding they "Resepect my Authorita!"

They where kids, and in his eyes had no rights and deserved no respect. Just that they obey his every word as if it was the word of God.

 

[Drac]

I agre I would need to see all of it before passing judgement

Same here...

You know, I was taught from a very young age to respect my elders and call them Sir or Ma'am, to speak when spoken to etc. etc.

Does that teaching still occure??? I think not.. I have been cursed out by the 16 and under crowd MORE OFTEN than by adults..They have that "You can't do **** to me cause I'm a juvie attitude..

I want kids to be scared to break the law or disrespect police.....isn't that the idea?

Same here...

 

[Andrew Green]

I want kids to be scared to break the law or disrespect police.....isn't that the idea?

Same here...

I think everyone would want kids to be somewhat afraid of the consequences, however I think it would be equally important that they trust and respect LEO's. That they are able to go to a cop when they need to, and expect to be treated with respect.

If that is the way kids view cops, they are not going to have that. Cops are going to be seen as "bad guys." When cops are seen as "the bad guys" there is a problem, a big one.

Chances are these kids where doing something wrong, at a minimum they where skateboarding where they shouldn't have been. However the proper way to handle that is not yelling, screaming and threatening with physical violence.

But is skateboarding really that bad of a crime? Is it worse then say speeding? Yet I can't picture many cops acting like that towards a 40 year old with a history of speeding, and that person is causing more danger and also knows they aren't supposed to be doing it.

 

[shesulsa]

I would want to see the whole thing before I judged too much ... but here are some things that bother me:

1. Fourteen. Male. 'Nuff said. When I was 14, my English teacher took me and a few others to her classroom at lunch for a few days to get us to stop saying "like" every other word, and ya know what? It was hard!

2. "If you were my kid I'd smack you ..." ... really? Lesson #1: Respect and Fear are not the same nor are they necessarily interdependent. There are several other things he said in that video that bother me.

3. Although we can't see the boy when the meter maid ... er, I mean officer ... physically addresses him, I'm wondering why exactly he needed to do this. Let's say the kid told him to **** off and flipped him off - he still could have gone about his job calmly, no? If the kid flashed a knife, gun, fistpack or anything else, the officer *should* have pulled his firearm and ordered him to the ground. So his insistence at going after the kid bothers me.

See, this is a good example of why kids don't and won't respect the law and law enforcement officers - this is not a good example.

AGAIN - caveat being that we did not see the entire incident.

AND - fair enough that this kid clearly did not know how to properly respond to an LEO.

 

[Archangel M]

That dude has issues.

Didnt he notice the video camera?

In the grand scheme of things though this is going to get blown way out of proportion. A suspension or time/money docked perhaps, but ya know theres gonna be calls for his termination.

 

[MJS]

In the Jena 6 thread, I posted a link to one of the suspects and how he beat someone up because he felt they did damage to his car. It was suggested that because he didn't think much of the police, basically he took the law into his own hands.

Now, in this case, you have some cop acting like a madman. Is that really the message that we want to send to someone who we're hoping will respect the cops?

Riding a skateboard isn't the crime of the century. Was there no other way to address these kids? Did the cop think that by acting like he did, he was re-enforcing respect? Does anyone here think that his actions will re-enforce respect? If so, how?

 

[Archangel M]

Oh dont get me wrong, this cop needs to be placed on a midnight beat somewhere where god lost his shoes and loose some money to boot. Somehow I wonder if his little electric car, shorts and shirt detail wasnt a way of shelving him somewhere.

If this is a pattern with this guy, then I would amend my previous post and say its time for him to go.

 

[MA-Caver]

In the Jena 6 thread, I posted a link to one of the suspects and how he beat someone up because he felt they did damage to his car. It was suggested that because he didn't think much of the police, basically he took the law into his own hands.

Now, in this case, you have some cop acting like a madman. Is that really the message that we want to send to someone who we're hoping will respect the cops?

Riding a skateboard isn't the crime of the century. Was there no other way to address these kids? Did the cop think that by acting like he did, he was re-enforcing respect? Does anyone here think that his actions will re-enforce respect? If so, how?

I can say that, knowing kids as I do, another question to ask is how will those kids feel after the cop has finished his tirade and left them? How are they going to feel to him and police in general. By saying "I am OFFICER Rivieri he's lumping every one who wears a badge with him... in these kids eyes. We're talking kids. Wanting to break out and be on their own and experience the world and take it through their (immature/inexperienced) eyes/senses.
So this experience with this officer over something this trivial (and yes it was trivial... wrong by society's standards, skateboarding where they shouldn't, but not a heinous crime by any means, at best a misdemeanor), this experience is going to leave a mark and as pointed out earlier it's going to have them as 18, 19, 20 somethings NOT trust the police when they need them. It's like that first-ever training with a bad sensei. Same concept.
The officer, was doing his job. I support him all the way on that. He saw a violation of a city ordinance and it's his job to enforce that. It was the WAY he did it. He was aggressive from the word go.
The kids... what I saw the kids' attitude (read their body languages) they were trying best to their inexperienced ability to be assertive. The Bush kid did try to explain that he didn't hear the officer the first time because he had his I-pod earbud on. After that the kids were submissive. Maybe they couldn't hold their tongues but when they did speak it wasn't yelling back at the officer and it wasn't threatening.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Yes, but how is it disrespectful to call a cop Dude? When it's commonly known that a lot of kids don't know better or don't THINK far enough ahead that they should be using more polite terms? If they were older kids yeah, chew 'em out for not knowing better, but at 14 ... they know but it's not yet moved to the front of the brain so it's the first thing on their minds to use "sir" or "officer". Takes time.

My inference was that in general "kids" can let their emotions run them not that these kid's let their emtions run them. As a matter of fact they were pretty much cooperative and respecting authority while the officer went about his yelling.

I would hope that kid's in general would call an authority figure sir or ma'am. However, I am a realist and from first hand experience know that this is not always the case.

My point is that the officer in question was unprofessional in his approach and could have handled it much better rather than letting his emotions run him.

 

[LuzRD]

IMO whatever preceeded the start of the video is irrelevant in regards to this dudes ego inflation.
everyone starts off calm until the dude doesnt like the way the kid says "yeah". (dude actually expects the entire group of teenage skaters to be respectfull?!?!?!)
the kid in question does seem to be the punk of the group, but that doesnt give dude ANY authority or reason to mistreat someones kid like that.
you dont agree with this kids outlook on life dude? well tough, your oppinion doesnt matter!

dude then flies off the handle, assaults the kid, berates him, and insults the kids family.

if the punk was MY kid i would be raising hell at the local PD (for the battery, not the hissy fit)!! after i raised hell for the boy (for not having the sense to smarten up when dude started flipping out).

"whats your name, where ya from, whats your address" i wouldnt want to give my information to an apparent psychopath either.

i did enjoy his last words "you got that camera on? if i find myself onl..." i think thats the point where he realized that he could get screwed for his overreacting but yet wasnt smart enough to investigate the camera. lol

pr***s like this make me sick, and are one of the reasons alot of people just wont trust the police.
my appologies to the good ones if this seemed like i was bashing more than the one dude, that was not my intent