I realized why strength training and Taekwondo/KB/Karate do not go hand in hand

Acronym

Master of Arts
Joined
Jun 26, 2020
Messages
1,773
Reaction score
41
So I used to think that strength training could only add to ones martial arts proficiency and decided to try and interblend the two for the first time.

First thing I noticed is that my body is much stiffer for any transition, it both feels stiffer and moves slower. I did notice however that it might provide some aid in stability but the downsides are horrendous... It felt like moving up a weight class without putting on the weight!

Tell me your guys experience. Did you also feel that the downsides outweighed the good ones?

In my experience one word sums it all up: "upperbody stiffness".
 
Last edited:
OP
A

Acronym

Master of Arts
Joined
Jun 26, 2020
Messages
1,773
Reaction score
41
I heard that practitioners who are slow to begin with won't notice a difference but explosive ones will. I felt as if I moved up a weight class, and I'm very explosive.
 

Flying Crane

Sr. Grandmaster
Joined
Sep 21, 2005
Messages
13,505
Reaction score
2,934
Location
San Francisco
I currently do about 1 1/2 hours of strength training, three times a week to supplement my martial arts practice. I feel it has only been positive. However, I am not lifting for size development, I do sets of higher reps with lower weights, pushups, etc. maybe if I was getting significantly more bulky from it that might make a difference. But from my experience there has been no problem.

I don’t practice quickly after strength training. I am fatigued at that point and training is less beneficial until I have time to recover/
 
OP
A

Acronym

Master of Arts
Joined
Jun 26, 2020
Messages
1,773
Reaction score
41
I currently do about 1 1/2 hours of strength training, three times a week to supplement my martial arts practice. I feel it has only been positive. However, I am not lifting for size development, I do sets of higher reps with lower weights, pushups, etc. maybe if I was getting significantly more bulky from it that might make a difference. But from my experience there has been no problem.

I don’t practice quickly after strength training. I am fatigued at that point and training is less beneficial until I have time to recover/

It doesn't matter if I have several days off. I feel especially in my pecs that I'm stiffer. I don't fire off as fast, not as loose, etc
 

Flying Crane

Sr. Grandmaster
Joined
Sep 21, 2005
Messages
13,505
Reaction score
2,934
Location
San Francisco
It doesn't matter if I have several days off. I feel especially in my pecs that I'm stiffer. I don't fire off as fast, not as loose, etc
Well it is certainly possible that different people will have different results. Your approach to the training might make a difference, your underlying physical development from where you are starting could make a difference. I don’t think this is something that can be asserted as consistent for everybody.

Are you training for size growth or for endurance? Heavy weights with lower reps or lower weights with higher reps? How many sets of each exercise? Those are things that will affect how you are pushing your body and the results of your strength development and may also affect other activities such as martial arts training.
 
OP
A

Acronym

Master of Arts
Joined
Jun 26, 2020
Messages
1,773
Reaction score
41
Well it is certainly possible that different people will have different results. Your approach to the training might make a difference, your underlying physical development from where you are starting could make a difference. I don’t think this is something that can be asserted as consistent for everybody.

Are you training for size growth or for endurance? Heavy weights with lower reps or lower weights with higher reps? How many sets of each exercise? Those are things that will affect how you are pushing your body and the results of your strength development and may also affect other activities such as martial arts training.

That's what surprised me further. I'm only doing functional strength training with my own body and it still feels like a worse version of myself when I kick. I used to do machines as heavy as I could and it was the same sensation. So type of strength training doesn't matter, it's more the quantity of it. We obviously did functional strength training in the schools too but not a special focus to it.
 

Flying Crane

Sr. Grandmaster
Joined
Sep 21, 2005
Messages
13,505
Reaction score
2,934
Location
San Francisco
That's what surprised me further. I'm only doing functional strength training with my own body and it still feels like a worse version of myself when I kick. I used to do machines as heavy as I could and it was the same sensation. So type of strength training doesn't matter, it's more the quantity of it. We obviously did functional strength training in the schools too but not a special focus to it.
I guess the next question I would ask is, for how long have you been doing this? Are you starting over recently, and perhaps need to get through a transitional phase before your body begins to accept the strain?

Another thought, maybe you have some misalignment issues that could be causing your body to have a negative reaction to the training. Perhaps a consultation with a chiropractor?
 
OP
A

Acronym

Master of Arts
Joined
Jun 26, 2020
Messages
1,773
Reaction score
41
I guess the next question I would ask is, for how long have you been doing this? Are you starting over recently, and perhaps need to get through a transitional phase before your body begins to accept the strain?

Another thought, maybe you have some misalignment issues that could be causing your body to have a negative reaction to the training. Perhaps a consultation with a chiropractor?

When is the transitional phase over?
 

Flying Crane

Sr. Grandmaster
Joined
Sep 21, 2005
Messages
13,505
Reaction score
2,934
Location
San Francisco
When is the transitional phase over?
That depends on the individual, what is their initial state of fitness, and how hard they are pushing the training. I once ran eight miles the first night after not running at all for six months or more. I still had the cardio conditioning to do it, but my leg muscles seized up immediately after I stopped, and I literally almost could not walk up and down stairs for the better part of a week. It took a few weeks of much reduced running after that before I began to feel normal and capable as a runner again.

I find that after a period of inactivity that extends beyond a couple weeks, it takes me a couple weeks to begin to feel good again, and that is with a reduced training demand. I have to gradually build up again to what I was doing prior. If the inactive period is extended, like more than a month or for several months, then it takes several weeks again before I begin to feel good.

So it really depends.
 

Danny T

Senior Master
Joined
Sep 5, 2002
Messages
4,258
Reaction score
2,288
Location
New Iberia, Louisiana USA
Strength training is important. Muscle recovery is important. Dynamic Stretching is important. Muscle relaxation is important.
Strength training should be based upon the ability to increase performance and not just strength. If you are training strength then you should only train strength for a period of time. Of course staying loose and stretching is a must as well. Then go back to doing speed training without the strength training doing this in cycles.
The best strength training for explosiveness and speed is one where strength came be done without having to retain the weight. Greater performance enhancements happens when one can accelerate through the complete motion vs decelerating the last 25% of the motion.
Most weight training facilities don't have equipment that allows such so cycling your strength training and your speed training should help.
 

Buka

Sr. Grandmaster
MT Mentor
Joined
Jun 27, 2011
Messages
11,200
Reaction score
7,498
Location
Maui
I still had the cardio conditioning to do it, but my leg muscles seized up immediately after I stopped, and I literally almost could not walk up and down stairs for the better part of a week. It took a few weeks of much reduced running after that before I began to feel normal and capable as a runner again.

Sitting here over morning coffee, grinning, my head nodding up and down.

I remember the time I did that. Yup.
 

Flying Crane

Sr. Grandmaster
Joined
Sep 21, 2005
Messages
13,505
Reaction score
2,934
Location
San Francisco
Sitting here over morning coffee, grinning, my head nodding up and down.

I remember the time I did that. Yup.
I was in high school, I had been on the cross-country team in the fall, then didn’t run at all until track in the spring. Ugh. I had to get someone to give me a ride home after that run, I couldn’t walk the few blocks that it took. My bedroom was in the basement of the house, I had to drag myself up and down with the hand railing. It sucked.
 

Buka

Sr. Grandmaster
MT Mentor
Joined
Jun 27, 2011
Messages
11,200
Reaction score
7,498
Location
Maui
Strength training is important. Muscle recovery is important. Dynamic Stretching is important. Muscle relaxation is important.
Strength training should be based upon the ability to increase performance and not just strength. If you are training strength then you should only train strength for a period of time. Of course staying loose and stretching is a must as well. Then go back to doing speed training without the strength training doing this in cycles.
The best strength training for explosiveness and speed is one where strength came be done without having to retain the weight. Greater performance enhancements happens when one can accelerate through the complete motion vs decelerating the last 25% of the motion.
Most weight training facilities don't have equipment that allows such so cycling your strength training and your speed training should help.

I would have put what you said in your post on a chart on the wall of my dojo, in the weight area. I would have printed, boldly, just below it -

All You Need to Know.

Now, Get Your Butt to Work.
 

Danny T

Senior Master
Joined
Sep 5, 2002
Messages
4,258
Reaction score
2,288
Location
New Iberia, Louisiana USA
I would have put what you said in your post on a chart on the wall of my dojo, in the weight area. I would have printed, boldly, just below it -

All You Need to Know.

Now, Get Your Butt to Work.
Why Thank You Sir.
CD Salute.jpg
 

Buka

Sr. Grandmaster
MT Mentor
Joined
Jun 27, 2011
Messages
11,200
Reaction score
7,498
Location
Maui
You know, Danny, I think a lot of people have a preconceived idea of what weight training is. But as we know, there are a whole lot of different ways to weight train.

And sports medicine and sport science have helped and changed everything over the years. Knowledgeable trainers and coaches are so important. I've been blessed with having quite a few of them.

Amongst other things, I like teaching people how to weight train for speed. Some folks will say you can't teach strength, you can't teach speed. The hell you can't.
 

skribs

Grandmaster
Joined
Nov 14, 2013
Messages
5,676
Reaction score
1,358
Technique and strength go hand-in-hand. Technique multiplies strength. If you don't have strength, that technique has nothing to multiply.

Up to a point, muscle builds speed in addition to strength. Explosiveness is definitely based on your strength-to-weight ratio.

People who claim that strength makes you slow are looking for an excuse not to lift weights.
 

_Simon_

Senior Master
Joined
Jan 3, 2018
Messages
3,259
Reaction score
1,549
Location
Australia
As long as you maintain flexibility and mobility, it shouldn't have a detrimental effect (unless of course you injure yourself or have a pre-existing imbalance), but help in strength and power (depending on the sort of weight training you're doing).

I'm quite stiff from alot of weight training over the years, but that's only because I never really knew that I shouldn't overdo the weight training without balancing it out (and wasn't told this nor did I really come across it much unfortunately!).

Am nowadays working on my tightness and mobility issues :)
 

dvcochran

Grandmaster
Joined
Nov 7, 2017
Messages
6,216
Reaction score
1,852
Location
Southeast U.S.
It doesn't matter if I have several days off. I feel especially in my pecs that I'm stiffer. I don't fire off as fast, not as loose, etc
There is a "hump" you have not quite gotten over yet. Set and keep a routine until you feel the plateau, then you can evaluate what you are doing. If you already are feeling overwhelmed, take a step back in your routine.
 
Top