I have a wing chun question

[JowGaWolf]

I have some questions about WC hand positions in reference to the hand positions shown below. Only focus on where the hands are making contact.

• Is there a technique in WC where the hand grabs over the wrist similar to what I'm doing in the picture below..
• Is there a technique in WC where the hand is placed under the arm similar to what I'm doing in the picture below

I'm asking because I followed up with a Jow Ga technique without actually realizing that I was doing a Jow Ga technique until I watched the video in slow motion. I took a look at Bong Sao which looks simiar, but that technique is done to the outside of the arm.

In the picture below, it appears as if I'm open but I'm really not. My right hand controls his left hand. If I need to protect my face I can turn my elbow upward like Bong Sao while still controlling my opponent's punching arm. I also have a connection with my right hand. In other words I can tell if he's going to punch with his right hand by what I feel from his left hand moving. You really can't tell from this screen shot but I can also redirect my opponent's outstretched arm, which is what I actually did.

My arms got into this position because of close range punching mixed with a little grappling. My theory is that close range turns into grappling due to punches and arms clashing against each other and close range punching when the arms aren't in the way. To me this makes sense with WC being a close range fighting system. It makes me think that you guys have more grappling than what is shown. I'm also thinking that WC practitioners forget about bridging when grappling is initiated, maybe too much focus is put on "punching the fastest" and not bridging.

I don't train WC, and I haven't tested my theory yet, but I would still like to hear what other's think about my theories for WC and close range fighting. Feel free to let me know if I'm wrong or way off and then share your thoughts of why I'm wrong.

 

[Danny T]

Looking at a still photo the position is similar to lan sao (bar arm). What a still photo doesn't do is show 'how' one got to that position, what direction the movement was going, or what pressure is being applied.

 

[JowGaWolf]

Looking at a still photo the position is similar to lan sao (bar arm). What a still photo doesn't do is show 'how' one got to that position, what direction the movement was going, or what pressure is being applied.

Change the settings on the youtube video to see it in slowing motion. Skip to 1:51. The clip is from when we were practicing close range fighting. We had to stay inside the box that we made. Rules were that we could either push, throw, or punch the other person out of the box. When played in slow motion you can see me hook my left hand under that arm and open him up. I've been looking up street fighting videos to see if I could find similar examples of pushing, punching, and grabbing within a close range.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

Were kicks allowed in that fight? I saw a throw earlier, but it didn't look like any kicks were done...at least any that were clearly 'kicks' and not an attempt at a sweep. In that point (1:51) and in one other (like 5 seconds later) you were controlling his hands, but it felt like he was at a distance where he could have thrown a kick without you defending, and used that to disengage than re-engage. What you were doing is not really my fighting style though, so I could easily be missing a way that you were preventing that.

I also had it at .25 speed, so who knows if I would have recognized the opportunity in the moment

 

[Danny T]

Nice.
Could have gone to bong sao (what is often call 'wrong side bong sao') It seems the pressure prevented that and you stayed in what in my wc is called Lan sao (bar arm) and then as pressure was released which was cause by your movement and the loss of his sticking you punched. Such happens often in wc.

 

[Danny T]

Were kicks allowed in that fight? I saw a throw earlier, but it didn't look like any kicks were done...at least any that were clearly 'kicks' and not an attempt at a sweep. In that point (1:51) and in one other (like 5 seconds later) you were controlling his hands, but it felt like he was at a distance where he could have thrown a kick without you defending, and used that to disengage than re-engage. What you were doing is not really my fighting style though, so I could easily be missing a way that you were preventing that.

I also had it at .25 speed, so who knows if I would have recognized the opportunity in the moment

"Rules were that we could either push, throw, or punch..."

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

"Rules were that we could either push, throw, or punch..."

Dang, I missed that . Saw the inside the box, then options of how and my eyes just glossed over that. JowGa-disregard my question then.

 

[DanT]

Arm on top would be considered either Fook Sau or Gum Sau depending on its action.

Arm on the bottom could be Lan Sau or Bong Sau depending on its action.

Remember wing chun techniques are verbs not nouns.

Either way I would avoid Bong Sau as much as possible as it leaves you exposed, there are more efficient techniques to use most of the time.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I have some questions about WC hand positions in reference to the hand positions shown below. Only focus on where the hands are making contact.

• Is there a technique in WC where the hand grabs over the wrist similar to what I'm doing in the picture below..
• Is there a technique in WC where the hand is placed under the arm similar to what I'm doing in the picture below

I'm asking because I followed up with a Jow Ga technique without actually realizing that I was doing a Jow Ga technique until I watched the video in slow motion. I took a look at Bong Sao which looks simiar, but that technique is done to the outside of the arm.

In the picture below, it appears as if I'm open but I'm really not. My right hand controls his left hand. If I need to protect my face I can turn my elbow upward like Bong Sao while still controlling my opponent's punching arm. I also have a connection with my right hand. In other words I can tell if he's going to punch with his right hand by what I feel from his left hand moving. You really can't tell from this screen shot but I can also redirect my opponent's outstretched arm, which is what I actually did.

View attachment 21121

My arms got into this position because of close range punching mixed with a little grappling. My theory is that close range turns into grappling due to punches and arms clashing against each other and close range punching when the arms aren't in the way. To me this makes sense with WC being a close range fighting system. It makes me think that you guys have more grappling than what is shown. I'm also thinking that WC practitioners forget about bridging when grappling is initiated, maybe too much focus is put on "punching the fastest" and not bridging.

I don't train WC, and I haven't tested my theory yet, but I would still like to hear what other's think about my theories for WC and close range fighting. Feel free to let me know if I'm wrong or way off and then share your thoughts of why I'm wrong.

By using the WC term, what you did is called "wrong Beng" that you use left Beng Shou to deal with left punch. The reason it's called "wrong Beng" because when you use left Beng Shou, your opponent can use his right hand to help your left elbow joint to move even higher. He can then follows by an elbow or shoulder lock.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

By using the WC term, what you did is called "wrong Beng". You use left Beng Shou to deal with a left punch which is a no no by using the WC principle.

2 things can happen here. The moment that you raise your left elbow, his right

1. punch can come toward your ribs.
2. hand can push your elbow joint even higher and lock your arm.