History of Tracy's Kenpo

KenpoDave

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It looks like the only reason that Al took those stories off of his site, is because Will put up his own and published them there instead.

No, Al Tracy took them down in 1999, when he began hosting the Tracy's site instead of Will. They reappeared on Will's site about 3 years ago.

But they were up for a long time. Either way, Al must have agreed with the content for them to stay up there on his webpage for so long.

They were up for two years, 10 years ago, when the site was published and hosted by Will Tracy.

You are still trying to drag Al Tracy into your opinion of the things his brothers have written, as if there is some Tracy's agenda against Ed Parker. And since you don't have facts, you are making them up.

How exactly, Dan, are Will and Jim Tracy involved in the Tracy System of Kenpo? Seriously. Will Tracy hosted the Tracy's site starting in about 1995 as a favor to Al Tracy because Will owned the servers and had the expertise. When Al Tracy got to that point, he took it over. Will's writings reflect his memories of kenpo, Ed Parker, and his feelings on the state of American Kenpo today, not Al Tracy's feelings. I asked Al Tracy about 10 years ago what his brother Jim was doing, and he told me that Jim had not been involved in the martial arts for 20 years. 10 years ago.

Here's the deal...Al Tracy's stuff is on Al Tracy's website. Will Tracy's stuff is on Will Tracy's website. And guess where Jim Tracy's stuff is...Jim Tracy's website.

Is some of it controversial? You betcha. But stick to the facts.
 

ackks10

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you know what guys, a hundred years from now this will still be going on,:idunno: and you know something,all the talking and yelling and people saying this and that (myself also) will not change anything, why??? because it is what it is. btw i had a long conversation with this man about alot of tracy stuff
m_70b8dee2159cb96d1ef337f5dda8ee16.jpg
Ray Arquilla, and me with some of his Black Belts @ the WCG, i'm sorry i can't seem to make it larger.

 

Danjo

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No, Al Tracy took them down in 1999, when he began hosting the Tracy's site instead of Will. They reappeared on Will's site about 3 years ago.



They were up for two years, 10 years ago, when the site was published and hosted by Will Tracy.

You are still trying to drag Al Tracy into your opinion of the things his brothers have written, as if there is some Tracy's agenda against Ed Parker. And since you don't have facts, you are making them up.

How exactly, Dan, are Will and Jim Tracy involved in the Tracy System of Kenpo? Seriously. Will Tracy hosted the Tracy's site starting in about 1995 as a favor to Al Tracy because Will owned the servers and had the expertise. When Al Tracy got to that point, he took it over. Will's writings reflect his memories of kenpo, Ed Parker, and his feelings on the state of American Kenpo today, not Al Tracy's feelings. I asked Al Tracy about 10 years ago what his brother Jim was doing, and he told me that Jim had not been involved in the martial arts for 20 years. 10 years ago.

Here's the deal...Al Tracy's stuff is on Al Tracy's website. Will Tracy's stuff is on Will Tracy's website. And guess where Jim Tracy's stuff is...Jim Tracy's website.

Is some of it controversial? You betcha. But stick to the facts.

Well thanks for clearing that up. I guess since you always hear about "The Tracy Brothers" and their Kenpo system, and two of the three of them have negative things to say about Parker, it can get confusing. If Al Tracy never said anything negative about Parker publicly, and never hosted the negative articles on his website, then I appologize for making that statement.
 

Flying Crane

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Seems like I started commenting on a published story, and you started in defending Jim Tracy like he was your dad. When someone puts a story out there for the public to read, commenting on it is fair game. It doesn't have to be "personal".

no, I simply disagree with your interpretation of what was written. You keep stating your take on it, so I'll keep stating mine. I think you've made up your mind on the topic from the very beginning and you aren't willing to consider any other possibility. That's OK if you want to hold your position, but I'll keep contesting it when you speak up about it.

And as to the "Vendetta" thing you keep mentioning, That would require them to have done something to me personally. They haven't. But are you going to tell me that you only comment on things that you have some personal stake in? Or are you free to make observations on things that are out there for public consumption?

In my opinion, you seem to look for things to attack the Tracys on. This seems to go farther than simply commenting on something that was published. I keep trying to understand why this is. From what I know about your martial history, and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, you aren't and have never been, in either a Parker lineage, or a Tracy lineage. So why do you take such an interest in this? Was Mr. Parker a personal friend of yours? It just doesn't make sense to me that you are so intensly interested in the politics of an art that you aren't a part of. That's what I am trying to understand, and that's why it looks to me like you, or someone you are connected to, must have some kind of personal vendetta. It's the only explanation I've been able to come up with, but please correct me if I'm wrong.
 

HKphooey

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I guess it all comes down to, "Have you met the Tracys?" "Have they personally done anything to wrong you? " Have you ever trained with them?

If you have, you may have the right to judge them. If you have not, do not base your opinion of them on an article.

Again, we have all said things that we may not be proud of or are taken out of context.
 

Danjo

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I guess it all comes down to, "Have you met the Tracys?" "Have they personally done anything to wrong you? " Have you ever trained with them?

If you have, you may have the right to judge them. If you have not, do not base your opinion of them on an article.

Again, we have all said things that we may not be proud of or are taken out of context.

Yeah, this was pretty much dropped over a week ago and resolved via PMs.
 

SifuJohnson

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This argument is silly and does more to pull us apart than bring us together. The past is the past and I think a lot of fingers could be pointed at a lot of people over the years based upon “somebody doing someone wrong” but in the end analysis what difference does it make now? It would seem that all this comes down to is who gets to throw the last punch.

So who has or knows the true kenpo? Sorry to inform all of you but the answer is “none of us”. There is no “true kenpo” and never was. Kenpo is not something you can package and own. Chow knew this and though he tried to change it by creating American Kenpo so did Ed Parker. I have to think that deep down the Tracy’s know this too. Why? It is because when you teach someone something you cannot continue to own what they now know. You can pull their belt and tell the world of their misdeeds but you cannot take back their training.

Parker contributed a lot to what we now know, but so did the Tracy’s and for that matter many others. Kenpo is not just a fighting system it is also an evolutionary process tied to the defensive needs of the times. When things change so does kenpo. It has to or risk no longer being relevant.

So keep this fight going if you wish but know that your competition is using this to eat you alive. As for me, I wish to take the high road. I wish to build kenpo up not tear it down. We have so much we could learn from each other and we have such a wonderful platform from which to build on. Continue this silliness if you wish but when your schools are empty and your bank accounts are dry you might try and remember that you had a chance to really be a part of something that would contribute positively to the image of what we teach, but you chose to go down fighting your family and not the evil that our art was intended to counter.
 

Danjo

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This argument is silly and does more to pull us apart than bring us together. The past is the past and I think a lot of fingers could be pointed at a lot of people over the years based upon “somebody doing someone wrong” but in the end analysis what difference does it make now? It would seem that all this comes down to is who gets to throw the last punch.

So who has or knows the true kenpo? Sorry to inform all of you but the answer is “none of us”. There is no “true kenpo” and never was. Kenpo is not something you can package and own. Chow knew this and though he tried to change it by creating American Kenpo so did Ed Parker. I have to think that deep down the Tracy’s know this too. Why? It is because when you teach someone something you cannot continue to own what they now know. You can pull their belt and tell the world of their misdeeds but you cannot take back their training.

Parker contributed a lot to what we now know, but so did the Tracy’s and for that matter many others. Kenpo is not just a fighting system it is also an evolutionary process tied to the defensive needs of the times. When things change so does kenpo. It has to or risk no longer being relevant.

So keep this fight going if you wish but know that your competition is using this to eat you alive. As for me, I wish to take the high road. I wish to build kenpo up not tear it down. We have so much we could learn from each other and we have such a wonderful platform from which to build on. Continue this silliness if you wish but when your schools are empty and your bank accounts are dry you might try and remember that you had a chance to really be a part of something that would contribute positively to the image of what we teach, but you chose to go down fighting your family and not the evil that our art was intended to counter.

I think you should have read the date on the previous post before saying "Continue this silliness" since the argument had been dropped.
 

SifuJohnson

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Thank you for your reply. The subject may have been dropped but that does not mean that people have quit reading it. I have only added my 2 cents worth because I hear these types of discussions all the time and I just felt a need to say what I felt needed to be said. If you disagree with my statements I am willing to discuss it with you otherwise we will consider the subject dropped.
 

Flying Crane

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Thank you for your reply. The subject may have been dropped but that does not mean that people have quit reading it. I have only added my 2 cents worth because I hear these types of discussions all the time and I just felt a need to say what I felt needed to be said. If you disagree with my statements I am willing to discuss it with you otherwise we will consider the subject dropped.

Your observations are accurate in a general sense. But the disagreement between Danjo and myself has been cleared up thru some private discussions, and we understand and respect each others positions. With that regard, we don't have an argument continuing on here. Thanks for your thoughts.
 

Mr.NGMA

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I have been reading the Tracy's biography as well. Although I am only through a portion of of, I do find it interesting on their take of the arts from then to now.
 

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