Election Dilemma

Bob Hubbard

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Phoenix44 said:
I'm trying to understand your viewpoint. I honestly feel that our number one priority right now is to oust this greedy, dishonest, repressive, bellicose regime...we can deal with the nuances on 11/3.

I strongly believe that after all the dust settles, that we will have at least 4 more years of the Bush regime. Call me paranoid, call me nuts, hell, call me anything but late for dinner. :) But, I feel it is fixed, and that GW will still be Reich Fuhrer. It may be through rigged voting machines, miscounts, etc.

Now, lets say for a moment that I am dead wrong, and Kerry wins, is sworn in, and GW moved outta that lil white house in DC.

So what?

Kerry still will have to face a hostile congress and court. He lacks the credibility and in my opinion ability to truely dig us out of this mess, and I'll be honest, why would he really want to?

Both the Dems and the Reps are so similar it is scary. They say the same things, just a little bit different. The debates were rigged, hell there -were- no debates, just memorized responces to questions they knew about well in advance.

If I was, let's say, a Green Party supporter right now, I'd vote for the major party candidate who is closer to my stance--Kerry--vote out the current anti-environmental administration, give my time and money to the Green Party immediately after the election, and start applying pressure to the new administration to be more pro-environment. I'd be looking toward 2008 immediately.

Why do you feel that they "may not have the ability to wage the fight come 2008"? There have been third parties for many, many years.

If they do not maintain X number of votes, they lose the ability to be automatically included on the next ballot. This will require them to do more leg work, spend more money, etc that would be much better used to get their message out.

Why do both the Reps and Dems have war chests of 300 MILLION while the Libs are struggling with less than $100,000? The deck is stacked against the third parties and unless "We The People" throw our voices behind them, they will never be able to overtake and then defeat the "Big 2".

As a matter of fact, I AM kinda green...I grow my own organic vegetables, compost, recycle, drive a very economical car, and I'm in the process of investigating alternative fuel for my home. But I am NOT voting for Nader...not in this election.

I'd vote for Cobb before I vote for Nader. Cobbs on more ballots I believe. :D
 

Phoenix44

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are you also getting rid our your legislation representatives and senators as well? Or are they doing a good job protecting your pork barrel interests
"MY" pork barrel interests? Excuse me, do you know something about me that I don't know? To my knowledge, I don't have any "pork barrel" interest. I'm not necessarily voting for individuals or policies that benefit ME.

I work in the health care field. Quite frankly, it'll ALWAYS be a lot easier for ME and MY family to get health services than for a lot of other people. But I vote for universal health coverage.

I have a job, and it pays CONSIDERABLY more than minimum wage. And when I owned a business, I paid CONSIDERABLY more than the minimum wage to my workers. But I favor a minimum wage that is higher than 5 bucks an hour.

At my age, the likelihood of ME having an abortion is nil. But I will vote for women's choice.

Does a cleaner environment benefit ME PERSONALLY? No more than it benefits anyone else.

So spare me the "pork barrel" comments. I'm just not that selfish.
 

michaeledward

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Someone in this thread suggested the 'Bush Administration must be held accountable'.

I suggest the only viable accountability available is to cast a vote for John Kerry, the only candidate that has a chance to supplant Bush. Even if your state is firmly in the 'Bush Column' electorally, a popular vote win might cause the Supreme Court to behave differently if presented with a decision this year.

For further consideration, I submit this article from 'The Nation' magazine ... .yeah yeah, I know ... they are almost as evil and unamerican* as Michael Moore.

http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=20041108&s=facts

* I listened to an interesting article with Noam Chomsky today. He put forth the theory that to even argue that such a thing as 'unamerican' requires an strong acceptance of a totalitarian government. Think about it.
 

Rich Parsons

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Phoenix44 said:
"MY" pork barrel interests? Excuse me, do you know something about me that I don't know? To my knowledge, I don't have any "pork barrel" interest. I'm not necessarily voting for individuals or policies that benefit ME.

I work in the health care field. Quite frankly, it'll ALWAYS be a lot easier for ME and MY family to get health services than for a lot of other people. But I vote for universal health coverage.

I have a job, and it pays CONSIDERABLY more than minimum wage. And when I owned a business, I paid CONSIDERABLY more than the minimum wage to my workers. But I favor a minimum wage that is higher than 5 bucks an hour.

At my age, the likelihood of ME having an abortion is nil. But I will vote for women's choice.

Does a cleaner environment benefit ME PERSONALLY? No more than it benefits anyone else.

So spare me the "pork barrel" comments. I'm just not that selfish.

Pheonix44,

My comment was not directed to you on purpose, I used your post as a thought starter.

It was meant for people to think, for I have heard this before, we have to get rid of that guy in this other disctrict or the other state since they voted for a bill that helped their local supporters. What they do not realize is that, almost every legislator ends up with something (s)he can hang their hat on to say they are helping the locals.

Just commenting, on the general apathy and phrases I hear as excuses on why people do not change or why people do not care to help to change.

Peace
:asian:
 

Tgace

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I agree with Rich P. Just Vote...all of the argument, debate etc. thats been goin on here is all well and good. In the end, all that matters is that you vote. In person Ive gotten to the point of just telling people "you vote for who you like, Ill vote for who I like" instead of getting into debates with them. If the guy I dont like wins, fine. Thats the way our system, and life in general, works.

Just vote.
 
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