Boot to the Head - Myth, Fantasy, and Facts

[loki09789]

Many arts include the infamous "Boot to the Head", through their inclusion of high targeted kicks to the head area.

Some people believe they are the 'fight stopper', others believe they are little more than useless 'show-off' moves.

What is your position on the idea of a kick to the head, would you use it, if so where, and if not, why?

The only 'high kicking' system that I have any real knowledge about is TKD. The best explanation that I got about the high kicking thing was that it was an application of an 'overtraining' model. If you can kick really well in practice to the head then a knee kick in reality is going to seem VERY easy to pull off. I don't know if this is the common view in TKD, but it sounded sound as a training tool - as long as you clearly communicate this to students AND create training that allows students to switch from High Kick (HK) mode to self defense/Low Kick (LK) mode to see the training benefit.

I just don't trust them - know matter how well I can pull them off - in a real world situation when the terrain can really work against you when you are pitching your center around/up/down so much to pull it off - gravel, ice, uneven green, woodlands....risk/reward balance sheet doesn't justify it for me.

 

[TigerWoman]

I just don't trust them - know matter how well I can pull them off - in a real world situation when the terrain can really work against you when you are pitching your center around/up/down so much to pull it off - gravel, ice, uneven green, woodlands....risk/reward balance sheet doesn't justify it for me.

I agree with you, about those that train it and know they can do it. Just has to have the right time and place. 99% of the time though, I would go for the knee or groin. Also agree that it is risky on uneven terrain, ice, gravel, etc. TW

 

[punisher73]

I agree with most of what has been said. Considerations of environment, skill level of both parties involved, etc.

I remember one of my instructors one time talking about fighting a guy and he never believed in kicks above the waist although he had trained some higher kicks and out of no where he found himself throwing the high kick and knocking the guy out with it (crescent kick to the side of the neck). He knew enough though and had trained properly and through that his response was instant and his body responded with that high kick at the right time and place.

I think this is the thing, all of the success stories are people who understood the time and place for such and knew they were capable of doing so. I think some people use the high kick almost for every situation and always try to use it no matter what and that is what gets people in trouble (aside from getting in the fight in the first place).

The other thing to consider is time invested in training it to be effective. I have more techniques that are higher percentage moves that I would rather improve on before I would work on those. Maybe after I get those moves down I would add lower percentage moves to give me more tools available.

 

[Zepp]

Something else to consider: when you kick to the head for self-defense, what part of the head are you targeting?

Personally, I think of the lower jaw as being the preferred target. Fracturing someone's jaw should certainly cause them enough pain to give you time to get away. Failing that, there's still a good chance of causing their head to snap back, disorienting them, or even causing unconsciousness.

 

[TigerWoman]

Something else to consider: when you kick to the head for self-defense, what part of the head are you targeting?

Personally, I think of the lower jaw as being the preferred target. Fracturing someone's jaw should certainly cause them enough pain to give you time to get away. Failing that, there's still a good chance of causing their head to snap back, disorienting them, or even causing unconsciousness.

The side-temple. In the Olympics, think it was the heavyweight bout, where a spin heel to the temple caused real confusion, eye problems but didn't knock him out. He couldn't go on though with the match. TW

 

[psi_radar]

The only way I'd use one is if he was already reeling as a coup de grace. Even then I'd put him on the ground first. I would just feel way too vulnerable against an alert opponent.

Someone threw a roundhouse to my head as a fight opener years ago, before I had any MA training besides wrestling. I easily scooped the base leg and dumped him HARD on the cement, and that was pretty much it. A valuable lesson learned.

 

[TigerWoman]

That's interesting. From day one in sparring training we are taught not to attack with a round kick. But it is all too common to see the underbelts coming at you round kick round kick, using both legs alternately and they leave themselves open to so much. Also, one could just slip to the side and sidekick their knee. TW

 

[psi_radar]

I'm not professing this person was particularly skilled or experienced, that's just what he did. It felt like I had all day to shoot. If somebody did that today, well it sort of reminds me of that scene in Animal House where the playboy bunny lands on the teenage kid's bed and he looks to the sky and says "thank you, God!"

 

[TigerWoman]

Chuckling...understood...I didn't think it would be an experienced move.TW

 

[Cruentus]

That's interesting. From day one in sparring training we are taught not to attack with a round kick. But it is all too common to see the underbelts coming at you round kick round kick, using both legs alternately and they leave themselves open to so much. Also, one could just slip to the side and sidekick their knee. TW

Most people are trained to not throw a round kick first.

So....I worked on opening with a round kick all the time when I sparred, and it worked well. Keep in mind that this was more of a TKD round kick that comes up like a front kick first...we called it a turning kick or turning snap kick.

Humerously as a teenager, I stopped a fight with a snap turning kick as well.

Of course now a days that I am an adult, and more tactically aware, I am more in agreement with Loki in that I don't trust them, and would rather do something safer yet more effective.

 

[Makalakumu]

Kicks to the head work great when they are used in combination with low kicks. I've seen some Thai boxing matches ended with low/high kicking combos...

Plus, a high front kick doesn't require that much flexability. I've been able to pull those off when I'm sick and training when I shouldn't be. (looks around sheepishly) :idunno:

Also, check out the value of kicking or high kicks in general when doing empty hand vs weapon drills. If your object is to immobilize the weapon and disable the attacker, kicks, which can include high kicks may be one of your best options.

A boot to the head isn't a magic bullet. It is just another tool to be developed and sharpened.

 

[psi_radar]

On further thought, I can't see that a stand-up kick to the head would be practical in any street fighting scenario, at least for me. If I was Benny the Jet, or incredibly proficient at TKD, maybe then it would seem more plausible, or maybe practical is the better word. High kicks should be reserved for dueling, like tournaments or NHB. Range closes just way too fast "on the street". Too much vulnerability, too much risk in a chips-down situation when there may be more than one opponent involved. I'd rather rely on my hands and lower kicks. Plus, a high kick drastically reduces mobility, if even for a second.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Rebumping this old topic by reasking the original question:


Many arts include the infamous "Boot to the Head", through their inclusion of high targeted kicks to the head area.

Some people believe they are the 'fight stopper', others believe they are little more than useless 'show-off' moves.

What is your position on the idea of a kick to the head, would you use it, if so where, and if not, why?

 

[Steel Tiger]

Rebumping this old topic by reasking the original question:


Many arts include the infamous "Boot to the Head", through their inclusion of high targeted kicks to the head area.

Some people believe they are the 'fight stopper', others believe they are little more than useless 'show-off' moves.

What is your position on the idea of a kick to the head, would you use it, if so where, and if not, why?

I like kicks, but prefer them lower than, say, shoulder height. I also recognise that we are designed to stand on two legs so when we lift a foot high off the ground we seriously affect our balance.

Kicking someone in the head is always effective in someway, so its not useless, but I prefer not to do it.

 

[Callandor]

If I'll get the chance to do it (high kick), I'll do it. If not, I won't. (Assuming, of course, that I can. At this point in my training... Nah!)

 

[CuongNhuka]

Cuong Nhu standard response to high kicks. "You can if you hit hard enough, you could knock the guy out. Just remember, in a fight, theres nothing stoppong the other from kicking you in the nuts. Or in class."
We allow kicks to the groin, so if you can get it off before the guy lands one in your groin, go ahead. But be careful!

 

[IcemanSK]

My initial thought is, "it's not the best plan." However, if the guy who took my wallet is on the ground from the kick to the solar plexus...A boot to the head seems quite appropriate.:ultracool

 

[Balrog]

Heh. I'm an old fart with arthritis. The only way I will ever be able to kick someone my own height or taller in the head would be to first kick them in the belly. Then when they double over, I've got a chance.

But even then, I probably wouldn't take it. At that point, they're pretty much not thinking about rumbling with me any more. If they still are, I've got some breathing room, so to speak, and I can line up a good shot on the common peroneal.

 

[whitedragon_48]

Cut 'em down to size! I mean a good low kick tends to make people "shorter", then a kick to the thinker and its "Miller Time"!

 

[Xue Sheng]

Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ti Kwan Leep. Approach me that you might see