Becoming better then your instructor...

[Makalakumu]

I was told a long time ago by my instructor that his goal was to make me a better martial artist then him. At first glance, this seems like a good idea.

I think about my instructor...Mid forties, fit, fast, and furious. Thirty years of MA experience. 4th dan in Tang Soo Do. 1st dan in Takeda Ryu Aikijujutsu. Maestro in Arnis De Mano. 22 years experience as a jail warden with thousands of fights under his belt.

That is a lot to live up to. And, honestly, it might be a goal that I never attain...

Then I think about my own students...I practice MA about 10 hours a week outside of class on top of running and lifting weights. I work constantly to improve my skill level. I do this because I believe that the students I teach should have an instructor that always holds the edge in class. As a result, I've never been faced with a situation where a student has walked into my class and there skills have outstripped mine. High ability students only make me want to work harder. In the end, as I raise the bar for my students, I also raise the bar for myself.

So, how can my instructor's goal ever be attained? Should it be?

upnorthkyosa :asian:

 

[Enson]

well it falls under

"the law of the lid" by john maxwell. "if you are not learning you are not leading."

what that means is you can only take people where you have been. so if you pass your instructor its because they have failed to get better.

peace

 

[Brother John]

I was told a long time ago by my instructor that his goal was to make me a better martial artist then him.
I think about my instructor...Mid forties, fit, fast, and furious. Thirty years of MA experience. 4th dan in Tang Soo Do. 1st dan in Takeda Ryu Aikijujutsu. Maestro in Arnis De Mano. 22 years experience as a jail warden with thousands of fights under his belt.
That is a lot to live up to. And, honestly, it might be a goal that I never attain...

Maybe...
but won't it be fun tryin??

Your brother
John

 

[ThatWasAKick]

I would say a more worthy goal is to be the best that you can be. Personally, I can never become better than my instructor, but I'm not my instructor - I'm me. I need to become better than me.

 

[Makalakumu]

Brother John

The striving makes it worthwhile. Fun or not.

As a teacher of the martial arts, I have been thinking about this goal. Should I strive to help my students surpass my own abilities? What happens to a student when this happens? Is it even possible when I raise the bar for myself and my students at the same time? Has anyone ever had the experience of passing up their own instructor?

upnorthkyosa

 

[Sin]

I am a Jounior instructor at my school and right now I am the only other instructor outside of my sensei.....anywho...Whenever there is another student that is a lower rank than me in the Dojo...i try to set a good example by showing up on time....dressing in correct uniform (The Top of my Gi was ripped from a tournament..so latly i haven't been wearing a top...only a white tank top with my belt...i still wore my bottoms) and performing all the moves that I know effectivly and effecently...my kata gets tighter when other students are around and my sparring gets fiercer.....My motivation to do better is that i know someone is watching me... to know how to do the move correct....If I mess up he will mess up and it won't be fun for him later when he dose the move incorrectly. .......its all about setting a good example :asian:

 

[Danny T]

I don't try to be better than my instructor I only try to better myself. That being said after almost 20 years of training with him I am better than he is some areas and still learning in others. Does that mean he is no longer worth training with? Of course not. Over the years we have both learned from each other. I also have some students who are better than I in some areas. I have also learned from them. I strive to better myself as well as my students. The greatest thrill I get is when a student gets to the point they no longer need me yet continue to train with me because we continue to learn from each other. It takes respect of each others ability and a lack of ego. We help each other grow. As to students getting to the point of being better. At my age being twice the age of many of my students, strength, speed, reflexes, eyesight, and many other attributes are beginning to wane where as the 20-25 year olds are peaking. What I have over them is experience. One of my instructors is almost 20 years older than I and many of his physical martial abilities left years ago however his ability to teach and coach continues. What he has over me is experience.

Danny

 

[Makalakumu]

I don't try to be better than my instructor I only try to better myself. That being said after almost 20 years of training with him I am better than he is some areas and still learning in others. Does that mean he is no longer worth training with? Of course not. Over the years we have both learned from each other. I also have some students who are better than I in some areas. I have also learned from them. I strive to better myself as well as my students. The greatest thrill I get is when a student gets to the point they no longer need me yet continue to train with me because we continue to learn from each other. It takes respect of each others ability and a lack of ego. We help each other grow. As to students getting to the point of being better. At my age being twice the age of many of my students, strength, speed, reflexes, eyesight, and many other attributes are beginning to wane where as the 20-25 year olds are peaking. What I have over them is experience. One of my instructors is almost 20 years older than I and many of his physical martial abilities left years ago however his ability to teach and coach continues. What he has over me is experience.

Danny

I agree with what you are saying.

Yet, I hear stories of old men doing phenomenal things, especially in CMA circles. And then there is the attitude that one needs to desert an instructor if you are better then them...

That is not the martial arts tradition I grew up with.

 

[OULobo]

Isn't this really all about self-confidence and inner security? If you are secure in your abilities and confident in your self, so you really need to be "better" than your instructor?

 

[MichiganTKD]

Of course you should aim to be better than your Instructor. This is the only way martial arts will improve and evolve. Whether or not you become better is different, but try.
For years, it was conventional wisdom among Native Americans that, out of respect for your parents, you did not get more education than them. This resulted in decades of poverty and a population with, at best, a grade school education. It was only after attitudes changed and Indians realized that it is no crime to be better educated than your parents, that education should be pursued, that tribes finally began to prosper.
My goal is to become better than my Instructor in every way. However, I shall always be grateful for him providing guidance.
Years ago, our Grandmaster brought his free fighting coach from Korea to attend one of our testings. Our Grandmaster is 9th Dan, his coach is still 3rd Dan I believe. However, the coach was an honored guest since our GM would not be where he is now without him. Much like a student who surpasses his high school teachers and earns a Ph.D. He still owes them a debt of gratitude.

 

[kenpo tiger]

Years ago, our Grandmaster brought his free fighting coach from Korea to attend one of our testings. Our Grandmaster is 9th Dan, his coach is still 3rd Dan I believe. However, the coach was an honored guest since our GM would not be where he is now without him. Much like a student who surpasses his high school teachers and earns a Ph.D. He still owes them a debt of gratitude.

Nice analogy following your anecdote, Mich.

However, having trained with an instructor who professes to be a 5th Dan (I know for a fact he is NOT) and who is almost useless teaching anyone past green belt, I'd have to say that it depends upon the situation. Of course I'd rather surpass my instructor in this respect. Who wouldn't, if teaching is one's goal? However, I think most of us are fortunate enough to be training with legitimate Masters who draw out of us every ounce of spirit and willingness to learn. I joke with mine and tell him when I'm 90 and he's awarding me my 10th degree...

 

[shesulsa]

I can't imagine ever being better than my instructor. He will know things I can't know as he continues to season as a person and teacher. What I do hope is that he has imparted parts of his knowledge and spread it out amongst several of us, his students, so that we can carry it on to others in his name. I'll just keep trying to get better than I am and keep trying to learn as much as I can (I gotta keep it all straight in my head, which is a challenge for me).

KT - You seriously need another instructor, IMHO.

 

[8253]

It should be any instructors goal to make the student better than the teacher through teaching the knowns and letting the student open up to other trains of thought, thus empowering them to learn more than the teacher. At the same time, a person is only as good as they can be at the moment when it is called for. However as I have said before, you may be the best on Monday, but on Tuesday, against the same opponent, you may be beat.

 

[Andrew Green]

There is a difference between being Better then someone, and being more knowlegable

Sometime you can't be better, simply because of physica; abilities.

But you should always end up more knowledgable then your instructor, if you commit to it as much as they do.

Lets say they train for 20 years in various places and things. If they are a good instructor they should be able to streamline and improve upon things to get you to about that point in far less time. Giving you a head start.

That's just the way things work, as we move forward, we find better ways, and people get to higher levels faster.

Compare Olympic times from 50 years ago with today. You might find that todays High School athletes are beating gold medal scores from 50 years ago.

Martial arts is the same... well in theory, and for some in practice... It's just harder to measure.

 

[Han-Mi]

A saying that has developed in my school is, "You will never be better than me, as long as I continue to train but, if I do my job right, you will be better than I am today when you are at the same place in your training."

I think it pretty much explains itself.

 

[Hwoarang_tkd26]

A saying that has developed in my school is, "You will never be better than me, as long as I continue to train but, if I do my job right, you will be better than I am today when you are at the same place in your training."

I think it pretty much explains itself.

There is a lot of truth in that saying, I like it.