Why do Japanese arts use the Japanese language?

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Talk' started by skribs, Oct 7, 2019.

  1. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    i've not gone off at a tangent, you brought america and atomic bombs in to the discussion..

    wheeling out all the old justifications, that didn't have much validity in the first place and non at all now, only shows the culture hasn't changed as much as i might hope

    governments certainly democratic governments can only do that which is culturally acceptable, if you want to call that socially acceptable rather than culturally acceptable feel free they are the same thing.

    what is accepted by a society is the same as what that society is culturally prepared to accept
     
  2. geezer

    geezer Grandmaster

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    Not sure how Chris's "wheeling out all the old justifications..." shows that we Americans haven't changed. Not that we have or anything... but still, Chris is an Aussie. So he's viewing America from afar. And Japan from a-near. If that's even a word. ;)
     
  3. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    well that makes it somehow worse
     
  4. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    The confirmation bias is strong in this one.
     
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  5. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    It matters not to me.
     
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  6. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    That’s probably overstated, but not entirely inaccurate. What I study isn’t actually a Japanese MA. It’s the American expression (derivation?) of a Japanese MA. The principles and practices were adjusted to American culture when the art came over.
    However, since the dojo in Hokkaido actually started the process of using English terminology, the Japanese names of techniques apparently are not an integral part of the art.
     
  7. Buka

    Buka Grandmaster

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    Key word in your question, at least for me is "your" karate school. If it's mine, yeah, sure okay. Especially since there would always be a United States flag beside it. Always.

    If it's a friend's school I'd do it out of respect. Same thing if it was a stranger's school, out of respect and protocol.

    I really don't like bowing or saluting any foreign flag without our flag next to it.
     
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  8. pdg

    pdg Senior Master

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    Pics or it didn't happen.
     
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  9. hoshin1600

    hoshin1600 Senior Master

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    i can actually see Little Boy being an extension of American culture. we are all about instant gratification, very impatient and tend to run roughshod over others.:wacky:
     
  10. geezer

    geezer Grandmaster

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    Huh? I'm reading this drinking my instant coffee, and wondering what my being impatient and craving instant gratification has to do with dropping the A-bomb.
     
  11. hoshin1600

    hoshin1600 Senior Master

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    Of course I was being tongue in cheek, but I was making an anology comparison of the instant wiping a city off the map with your instant coffee. We Americans don't have time for all that storming the shores and rolling tanks, you know all that marching the troops......one little boom ..instant... while I'm sitting on the other side of the ocean drinking coffee.
     
  12. Mitlov

    Mitlov Blue Belt

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    I'm not sure the Marines who fought on Guadalcanal, Peleliu, and Iwo Jima would agree with that summary of the fighting in the Pacific Theater.
     
  13. geezer

    geezer Grandmaster

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    ...Or those scientists like Oppenheimer who worked day and night on the Manhattan Project, knowing that if they didn’t get there first, ...well, did anyone watch “The Man in the High Castle”?
     
  14. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    well that doesn't hold up to scutany, the Germans weren't even close to having a nuclear bombs, they effectively gave up any serious attempt to make one in 1941 , d coding to concentrate resources on conventual weapons.

    in fact the Americans didn't have one either when the war in Europe finished, so it was developed just to bomb Japan, who were not even trying to make one, so the suggestion they had to get there first is nonsense
     
  15. geezer

    geezer Grandmaster

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    Of course you are correct about the Germans not being close to having an A-Bomb. But in 1942 when the United States, Canada and the U.K. initiated the project, they could not know this. They did know that there was a real danger that the war could be lost. So what’s your point?
     
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  16. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    I suspect with the amount of intelligence they had they had a good idea, but my point is that even if they believed they were in a race with the germans, then must have known that this race was over when the germans imploded and surrendered. but they carried on developing the bomb, JUST to drop on Japan. who nobody thought had an a bòmb

    just to be clear, they didn't have a bomb, when Germany surrender, it was built solely for japan, what did oppenhiemer think he was doing then ??
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2019
  17. hoshin1600

    hoshin1600 Senior Master

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    [​IMG]
     
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  18. geezer

    geezer Grandmaster

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    Maybe he and his colleagues thought they were working on something that would put an end to the war, and be a deterrent to others that would come after?

    I’m not a historian. If you want to know what those guys were thinking, you research it. The decision to drop the bomb ...twice, is subject of legitimate debate. The making of the bomb ...by someone, was inevitable. Personally, I’m glad it was the Anglo allies, not the Axis, and not the Soviets.

    Now maybe we can get back to the OP???
     
  19. Mitlov

    Mitlov Blue Belt

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    It was most of the way through development when Germany surrendered. It was developed for use against either.

    As for its use atheist Japan, setting aside whatever peoples' personal motivations were, given our tactics and technology of the time, a ground invasion of Japan would have killed even more civilians than the atomic bombings did. Keep in mind that during the invasion of Okinawa, somewhere between 15% and 50% of the island's civilian population was killed (as well as 15,000 American combatants and 100,000 Japanese combatants).

    Battle of Okinawa - Wikipedia

    That does not make targeting civilians morally okay. By 21st standards, the atomic bombings of cities are an atrocity. But the question of "if not this, than what" is a hard one, and eliminates this characterization that it was an act of lazy, comfortable Americans.
     
  20. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    but you were TELLING me what he was thinking, you know when he was slaving away thinking "got to beat the germans, oh we did great "
     

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