The notion that you have to throw/submit yourself in Aikido or get your wrist broken

Discussion in 'Aikido' started by Alan Smithee, Nov 22, 2019.

  1. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    In this case specifically styles that don't compete vs styles that do.

    Because for the discussion you will find MMA tends to draw from styles that have fighters in them.
     
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  2. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    In multiple threads, you dismissed (pretty much ignored, in one thread) videos that showed types of attacks you said weren't valid - just wouldn't happen.
     
  3. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    Thanks. That'll help me avoid confusion. The terms don't have universal definitions, of course.
     
  4. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    Using it specifically for this discussion because Jow Gar was throwing the term around.
     
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  5. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    So multiple threads?

    Look you are making the accusation you should back that up with some evidence rather than just start suggesting multiple threads.

    Second time you pulled this stunt on this thread by the way.
     
  6. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    Nope. Can't really be bothered to search through threads looking for it. If you don't remember it, it's not that important.
     
  7. Martial D

    Martial D Senior Master

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    Sport is when TMA gloves up, under some conditions that allow for winning or losing. Any TMA can be a sport under these conditions.
     
  8. dvcochran

    dvcochran Senior Master

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    Holmes could do about anything she wanted to in that fight.
     
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  9. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    I like that distinction. It's pretty clean. So, when folks do that, it ceases to be "TMA" for the purpose of this discussion.
     
  10. JowGaWolf

    JowGaWolf Grandmaster

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    I don't know if this will help you with WC but my understanding of trapping the hands is to do it before your opponents arm is fully extended and that this is actually close range. I can't think of an situation where trapping a punch at the end of the punch is a good idea or functional.

    If I want to trap my opponent's hands I would do it at the beginning of my opponents punch and not at the end. If I were to take WC that's where my trapping would begin. Anything outside of that 50% range would be longer strikes until I can get into range.Within that 50% range punches will not land as hard , I can now start jamming and striking and take advantage of my shorter ranged punches.

    In the context of a 4 sided ring. Having my opponent pinned in the corner on the ropes would force my opponent to play my game. In the middle of the wring, he would be forcing me to play his game. So I have to change from close quarters to distance and mobility.

    Also if I wanted to learn WC, I wouldn't spar with another WC practitioner unless he pretty much abandon's WC and turns into a brawler. My Jow Ga sparring partners did that a lot so me using my techniques against them was more like what I would be against in the street in terms of the types of strikes I had to deal with.
     
  11. JowGaWolf

    JowGaWolf Grandmaster

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    good job finding that one. with Holly Holmes
     
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  12. JowGaWolf

    JowGaWolf Grandmaster

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    That's a real possibility, We don't fight the same as we get older or injured. I've seen Wing Chun systems that use a wider stance that looks more like the common fighting stance that we see, so I'm always curious about the strict determination to ALWAYS keep a narrow stance.

    I would like to know when the narrow stance came into play, who started it, and what was their physical condition, was it age or an injury.
     
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  13. JowGaWolf

    JowGaWolf Grandmaster

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    yeah so much was wrong about that fight. Ronda's coach, the effort to get her to switch to boxing, the training. Ronda went in with an untested skill set and Holmes took advantage of that , rightfully so.
     
  14. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    It is ironically common but also super hard to find because it is mostly a disruptive move rather than a finish move. So it will never be in a highlight reel.
     
  15. Hanzou

    Hanzou Grandmaster

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    Interesting fight theory. However, we have multiple examples of WC fighters being unable to apply that theory when strikes are raining down on them.
     
  16. Martial D

    Martial D Senior Master

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    Ya. It just doesn't work when the other guy knows how to fight. The only time hand trapping is worth even thinking about is on the ground, or if you are already clinching(and there are better options even there)

    I feel like if you went and trained MMA for a month a lot of what you believe would change.
     
  17. Martial D

    Martial D Senior Master

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    I don't know that TMA and sport are mutually exclusive.

    We have sport karate, tkd, judo. Even tomiki aikido has a sport version.
     
  18. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    Lomenchenco does it. But he learned it from boxing.

    That other obscure TMA that MMA draws from.
     
  19. JowGaWolf

    JowGaWolf Grandmaster

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    Not sure what to say about that. To me this is basic. I don't think this would be difficult.
     
  20. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

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    Agree! Even if one just has one golden glove boxing experience, he will understand how important it is to deal with left hook, right hook, left hook, right hook, … that most TMA people don't train how to deal with it.
     
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  21. JowGaWolf

    JowGaWolf Grandmaster

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    It wouldn't change anything. These are the same thing I use to coach my brother who is an amateur Muay Tai and MMA fighter. This type of stuff doesn't have an thing to do with TMA or MMA. It's my understanding of the mechanics of punching. If I don't understand this, then it would mpossible for me to be successful with my crazy Jow Ga techniques.
     

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