New belt for Second Dan?

[bondad]

I was talking to a few students before class last week about their second Dan belts. I asked if it was their first Dan belt with two gold bars added. They said no, they were given a new belt when they received their second Dan. But they commented that our Sabonim's belt (fifth Dan) is his original first Dan belt that he has added gold bars to over the years as he went up in rank.

Some of these students had grown since receiving their first Dan so it made sense that received a new belt. When my time comes, I'm thinking of asking my Sabonim if I can do as he has done and add bars to my original belt.

What are your thoughts on either approach?

 

[terryl965]

Seriously I have just a plain Black Belt and it has been with me for year, funny how it works fine just like that. Stripes are for those that have to have instant recognition. Sorry but that is how I feel about the subject.

 

[IcemanSK]

Since rank stripes on the belt are a part of your school, I'd ask your instructor if you can do the same thing that he did. If you want to do the same thing he did, it's worth asking.

 

[bondad]

Seriously I have just a plain Black Belt and it has been with me for year, funny how it works fine just like that. Stripes are for those that have to have instant recognition. Sorry but that is how I feel about the subject.

Well one of the rules in our school is we line up by rank. It could be difficult to distinguish black belt ranks if the bars were not on the belts. In time everyone knows but to a new student it could be confusing. Our blackbelt ranks have grown from about five to about 20 in the six years I have been attending.

But don't worry, I got the insult so you're good...Now you can go feel better about yourself.

 

[Manny]

I just love my first black belt, it has honest use but sadly does not fit me anymore (the way I like it, this is two wraps around my waist) so for my second dan I ordered a plain satin black belt from eosin panther.

In my dojang we can embroid our belt with our names and the name of or organization but can not put bars on the belt, my sambonims is 7th degree black belt and does not use bars on his belt, he says we don't need the bars.

If you wish to keep ypour black belt with you for some time then ad the bars it will need, I wish my original black belt still fits me but time has pased (24 years) and my belly has grow a little.

Manny

 

[bondad]

I just love my first black belt, it has honest use but sadly does not fit me anymore (the way I like it, this is two wraps around my waist) so for my second dan I ordered a plain satin black belt from eosin panther.

In my dojang we can embroid our belt with our names and the name of or organization but can not put bars on the belt, my sambonims is 7th degree black belt and does not use bars on his belt, he says we don't need the bars.

If you wish to keep ypour black belt with you for some time then ad the bars it will need, I wish my original black belt still fits me but time has pased (24 years) and my belly has grow a little.

Manny

Thanks for your insight Manny. I appreciate it.

 

[puunui]

Well one of the rules in our school is we line up by rank. It could be difficult to distinguish black belt ranks if the bars were not on the belts. In time everyone knows but to a new student it could be confusing.

It wouldn't be confusing because the new student would be a white belt and would line up in the back. If it is a new student who is a dan holder, the proper position for that new dan holder would either be as the last black belt, or even the last student after the white belts. The head instructor would then put the new black belt student where he felt the new student belonged in terms of seniority.

 

[terryl965]

Well one of the rules in our school is we line up by rank. It could be difficult to distinguish black belt ranks if the bars were not on the belts. In time everyone knows but to a new student it could be confusing. Our blackbelt ranks have grown from about five to about 20 in the six years I have been attending.

But don't worry, I got the insult so you're good...Now you can go feel better about yourself.

You ask a question on a chat line and I responded to your question, sorry Ido not believe in stripes on belts inside of my dojaang. We know who lines up where and have been doing it this way for twenty something years and it works for us. Now at competition or formal testing we have belts with stripes, but you ask about a everyday belt ot at least I took it that way. Sorry if you fely insulted by my comment, just the way I am.

 

[ralphmcpherson]

It wouldn't be confusing because the new student would be a white belt and would line up in the back. If it is a new student who is a dan holder, the proper position for that new dan holder would either be as the last black belt, or even the last student after the white belts. The head instructor would then put the new black belt student where he felt the new student belonged in terms of seniority.

What about in large clubs? we have over 4000 students and have club camps, club seminars, black belt classes, invite-only classes and we are always lining up in order of rank and are encouraged to ask our seniors for advice. That gets a bit difficult without stripes. I went to a club training camp 2 weeks ago and there were many black belts there I had never seen in my life. I needed some advice on my form at one point and I could easily pick out which other guys there were a higher rank so I could ask for some help. I can understand in small clubs where everyone knows everyone else but in large organisations its much easier if you can quickly identify someone's rank.

 

[ralphmcpherson]

I was talking to a few students before class last week about their second Dan belts. I asked if it was their first Dan belt with two gold bars added. They said no, they were given a new belt when they received their second Dan. But they commented that our Sabonim's belt (fifth Dan) is his original first Dan belt that he has added gold bars to over the years as he went up in rank.

Some of these students had grown since receiving their first Dan so it made sense that received a new belt. When my time comes, I'm thinking of asking my Sabonim if I can do as he has done and add bars to my original belt.

What are your thoughts on either approach?

Most black belts where I train keep the same belt. Each time they are promoted they rip off the old stripes and put new ones on, so all the stripes look the same. Only a few of the black belts have their dans embroided on, most use iron-on darn which lasts for years but can be easily removed when its to to re-dan.

 

[andyjeffries]

Some of these students had grown since receiving their first Dan so it made sense that received a new belt. When my time comes, I'm thinking of asking my Sabonim if I can do as he has done and add bars to my original belt.

This has been kind of discussed recently, but personally I prefer a fairly new belt. I don't like my belt to look like I've had it a million years and spent a lot of that time rubbing up against brick walls.

So personally, I would go with a new belt.

We have a fair bit of embroidery on ours including our name and our club's name in English and Korean, logos and, yes, we have dan bars (and I like our belts).

 

[poollshark]

I was talking to a few students before class last week about their second Dan belts. I asked if it was their first Dan belt with two gold bars added. They said no, they were given a new belt when they received their second Dan. But they commented that our Sabonim's belt (fifth Dan) is his original first Dan belt that he has added gold bars to over the years as he went up in rank.

Some of these students had grown since receiving their first Dan so it made sense that received a new belt. When my time comes, I'm thinking of asking my Sabonim if I can do as he has done and add bars to my original belt.

What are your thoughts on either approach?

I'd never given any real thought to this till I read your post, where I train a new belt is awarded at each Dan. I don't see any problem with you respectfully asking if you can follow your teachers lead.

Seriously I have just a plain Black Belt and it has been with me for year, funny how it works fine just like that. Stripes are for those that have to have instant recognition. Sorry but that is how I feel about the subject.

You ask a question on a chat line and I responded to your question, sorry Ido not believe in stripes on belts inside of my dojaang. We know who lines up where and have been doing it this way for twenty something years and it works for us. Now at competition or formal testing we have belts with stripes, but you ask about a everyday belt ot at least I took it that way. Sorry if you fely insulted by my comment, just the way I am.

Terry, IMHO your comment came across as condescending. We don't tell our teachers how to run their school or how to display rank, do we?

Respect for, or at the very least tolerance of others traditions is something we should all have. Live and let live brother.

George

 

[terryl965]

I'd never given any real thought to this till I read your post, where I train a new belt is awarded at each Dan. I don't see any problem with you respectfully asking if you can follow your teachers lead.





Terry, IMHO your comment came across as condescending. We don't tell our teachers how to run their school or how to display rank, do we?

Respect for, or at the very least tolerance of others traditions is something we should all have. Live and let live brother.

George

Well since both of you are new to the forum I would have to dis-agree with both of you, as far as listening since I runmy school with my GM permission the way I would like it is all good. As far as what he ask I gave my opinion about stripe beltsinside a dojaang for working out. I nor does both of my GM wears abelt with stripes on them for training, maybe it is just us but doubtful since alotof schools I go to does the same. If it came a croos condescending than I am sorry, it was meant to come a cross that this is what we do. Heck I even said this is the way I believe it should be done as in my belief. So in closing people will have there opinion about everything and will give there opinion on any subject that has been posted an a forum. I have had people be upset, mad and please over comments it is part of the board, respect I have for all in the arts not just mine and that goes all the way from a white belt with one day to a BB that has forty years or more.

Maybe next time I will put in qoutes just my way or my opinion so a few does not get upset over commits on a chatline.:asian:

 

[poollshark]

Well since both of you are new to the forum I would have to dis-agree with both of you,

You're going to disagree with us because we're new to the forum...your condescend-fu is strong sir

as far as listening since I runmy school with my GM permission the way I would like it is all good. As far as what he ask I gave my opinion about stripe beltsinside a dojaang for working out.

This is my only problem with your post......you did not give your opinion. He asked opinions on adding stripes to an existing belt or getting a new belt @ each dan. Instead of giving an opinion on that you told him, and I quote "Stripes are for those that have to have instant recognition". Not only did you not answer his inquiry, you basically insulted him.

I nor does both of my GM wears abelt with stripes on them for training, maybe it is just us but doubtful since alotof schools I go to does the same. If it came a croos condescending than I am sorry, it was meant to come a cross that this is what we do. Heck I even said this is the way I believe it should be done as in my belief. So in closing people will have there opinion about everything and will give there opinion on any subject that has been posted an a forum. I have had people be upset, mad and please over comments it is part of the board, respect I have for all in the arts not just mine and that goes all the way from a white belt with one day to a BB that has forty years or more.

Maybe next time I will put in qoutes just my way or my opinion so a few does not get upset over commits on a chatline.:asian:

I speak for no one but myself here, I am new to posting on MT but I am no rookie when it comes to internet message boards. I have been posting since the 90's back in the usenet days.
You misunderstand my disagreement with you as anger, I assure you there is nothing you could write here that would make me upset. I have much thicker skin than that.

George

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

I was talking to a few students before class last week about their second Dan belts. I asked if it was their first Dan belt with two gold bars added. They said no, they were given a new belt when they received their second Dan. But they commented that our Sabonim's belt (fifth Dan) is his original first Dan belt that he has added gold bars to over the years as he went up in rank.

Some of these students had grown since receiving their first Dan so it made sense that received a new belt. When my time comes, I'm thinking of asking my Sabonim if I can do as he has done and add bars to my original belt.

What are your thoughts on either approach?

I am not personally in favor of stripes on the belt. However, its just a belt. If the school uses belts with stripes then fine. Whether you receive a new stripe to attach to the belt or a new belt entirely is unimportant.

At KMA where I have trained for many years, KJN Kim issues a new belt with the appropriate quanitity of stripes. When I began instructing kumdo and hapkido for him, I received belt that had my name at one end and our kumdo and HKD association names on the other and no stripes.

If I'm running or training hapkido, that is the belt that I wear.
If I'm in taekwondo class, I wear my taekwondo belt with two stripes.
If I'm running or training kumdo, we don't wear a belt because the uniform is a hakama and uwagi.

Regarding the comment about a lack of stripes making it confusing at line up time, I suspect that the yudanja at any school know who is what rank and line up accordingly. Yudanja are generally mature enough to do this with or without stripes. Colored belts will line up according to color.

Daniel

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

This has been kind of discussed recently, but personally I prefer a fairly new belt. I don't like my belt to look like I've had it a million years and spent a lot of that time rubbing up against brick walls.

But if it were blue jeans, you could pay extra for that look!

Daniel

 

[sfs982000]

I was talking to a few students before class last week about their second Dan belts. I asked if it was their first Dan belt with two gold bars added. They said no, they were given a new belt when they received their second Dan. But they commented that our Sabonim's belt (fifth Dan) is his original first Dan belt that he has added gold bars to over the years as he went up in rank.

Some of these students had grown since receiving their first Dan so it made sense that received a new belt. When my time comes, I'm thinking of asking my Sabonim if I can do as he has done and add bars to my original belt.

What are your thoughts on either approach?

Where I currently train (ATA school) those that are part of the leadership/instructor trainee team get very nice embroidered belts for each dan rank. If you are not part of the leadership/instructor team you get a plain black belt. Years ago when I trained in Shotokan our instructors wore plain black belts. My personal thoughts are for day to day wear the plain black belt is just fine. I can see where in some schools if you have a number of black belts that the dan bars would be beneficial. Most of the black belts where I currently train are 1st or 2nd dan, the chief instructor is a 5th dan.

 

[miguksaram]

Personal thoughts is that a black belt is a black belt and I don't need the stripes on it to remind me of my place in the martial art world. At our school we have no stripes. When we line up it is by who gets to the line first. Personally I will move down the line and allow seniors to be placed to my left (higher position). However, that is just me. Overall it doesn't make a difference because we all sweat and bleed the same regardless of the number of stripes on the belt.

Now if your school hands out belts with stripes...cool. I would recommend getting the new belt with the stripes and using it for decoration and then ask if you can get your current belt embroidered with the correct amount of stripes.

To the OP...Terry was not trying to insult you. Just injecting his overall opinion on the matter. So, chill out and grow some thick skin.

To Terry...While I respect your overall opinion, I don't think the part about what you feel stripes represent was warranted as it had nothing to do with the OP's original question on which approach to take. So I can see where he might get a little annoyed with the input.

So the only fair way to decide this is that Terry must buy the first round.

 

[chrispillertkd]

I was talking to a few students before class last week about their second Dan belts. I asked if it was their first Dan belt with two gold bars added. They said no, they were given a new belt when they received their second Dan. But they commented that our Sabonim's belt (fifth Dan) is his original first Dan belt that he has added gold bars to over the years as he went up in rank.

Some of these students had grown since receiving their first Dan so it made sense that received a new belt. When my time comes, I'm thinking of asking my Sabonim if I can do as he has done and add bars to my original belt.

What are your thoughts on either approach?

We get new belts with each dan level. I can see wanting to keep your old belt, I suppose. I have certainly kept all of mine. But when I train in class I use my current belt which has Roman Numerals on the ends denoting my rank.

I've seen people use their old belts and add rank stripes as they advance in rank. I don't care for that practice. There is a certain aesthetic quality to a well worn belt, just like there is to many things that have been handled for years and years and have gotten a well used look to them. There is a certain beauty in imperfection, after all. But adding rank stripes to an old belt kind of works counter to that since you're adding something new to the belt.

IMO, it would be different if you were just wearing a belt that had no embroidery on it (except for maybe your name) or rank insignia. Then wear it to your heart's content. Better to take away (through training) than add (through new rank stripes), I think.

YMMV

Pax,

Chris

 

[terryl965]

Personal thoughts is that a black belt is a black belt and I don't need the stripes on it to remind me of my place in the martial art world. At our school we have no stripes. When we line up it is by who gets to the line first. Personally I will move down the line and allow seniors to be placed to my left (higher position). However, that is just me. Overall it doesn't make a difference because we all sweat and bleed the same regardless of the number of stripes on the belt.

Now if your school hands out belts with stripes...cool. I would recommend getting the new belt with the stripes and using it for decoration and then ask if you can get your current belt embroidered with the correct amount of stripes.

To the OP...Terry was not trying to insult you. Just injecting his overall opinion on the matter. So, chill out and grow some thick skin.

To Terry...While I respect your overall opinion, I don't think the part about what you feel stripes represent was warranted as it had nothing to do with the OP's original question on which approach to take. So I can see where he might get a little annoyed with the input.

So the only fair way to decide this is that Terry must buy the first round.

Point well taken and believe me after going back and reading my first post I can see where it might have been taken the wrong way. I was just inputing my opinion on the matter and yes when we meet the first round is on me.