Long Form 1 Video Comments Please

Discussion in 'Kenpo / Kempo - Technical Discussion' started by seninoniwashi, Aug 19, 2007.

  1. kidswarrior

    kidswarrior Senior Master

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    Nor am I. I do know that in San Soo, we do forms much differently than we do practice. Forms are deliberately more exaggerated (flowery, as one of my teachers says), as for example what we call a down windmill block in a form covers the whole front of the body, while in partner practice, it may be a very small circle--just enough to trap/block the incoming. This video shows something similar, so it occurs to me this gent may be doing the form in the manner he was taught, but would modify the moves for real application.
    A reasonable response. Hard to tell what would be effective in the heat of battle just from this form. I will say the overhead blocks sometimes don't clear the top of the head, and the downward palm blocks (sorry, don't know the Tracy/EPAK name) would seem to redirect the attack right into ones own groin.

    But all in all, as some have said, I wouldn't judge someone's practice off of one 'snapshot' like this.
     
  2. Christina05

    Christina05 Green Belt

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    I found this long form with extensions check it out

     
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  3. Touch Of Death

    Touch Of Death Sr. Grandmaster

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    I'm not so happy with the forward bows, but this is closer to what I recognize as Long 1.
    Sean
     
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  4. michaeledward

    michaeledward Grandmaster

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    Thank you, Sean, for commenting.

    This certainly looks much closer to what I recognize as Long Form 1, as well.

    But, further, I see many things that merit 'correction'; aspects of the form that I do not believe are open to interpretation or lineage variation, aspects that are, in fact, incorrect.

    My best hope is that if I am ever captured on video, outside of a training lesson, that the performance of my body matches the performance in my mind. However, I think that is, at best, a long shot.
     
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  5. Christina05

    Christina05 Green Belt

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    There are so many videos and almost all of them have some type of variation.It seems like they were either all taught a different way or they miss calculated the technique. Just my opinion
     
  6. Touch Of Death

    Touch Of Death Sr. Grandmaster

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    Exactly! Every instructor teaches his concerns and experiences to their students at what ever level the student can handle. Given different body types and the personal experiences of the student, it is a given we won't see what we want to see when watching others do our beloved forms. I heared some where recently that a test tells you just as much about the tester as it does the tested; so, I think, specific comments are good to see wheather they are bad or good.
    Sean
     
  7. Christina05

    Christina05 Green Belt

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    I agree. After all its only constructive criticism
     
  8. Goldendragon7

    Goldendragon7 Grandmaster

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    Like Sean stated earlier... very primitive or poorly understood. He certainly "knows OF" the form but did not demonstrate "knowing" the form and surely doesn't "Understand" the form.

    :yoda:
     
  9. hongkongfooey

    hongkongfooey Black Belt

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    I've watched a lot of Kenpo on line. Why does everyone always do their forms so fast? There is a difference between flowing and speeding. Almost everyone tries to fly through the forms like their *** is on fire, making the form look like garbage. Watch a few more renditions of long 1. Watch the isolation moves at the end. Every video I have watched is the same, speeding right along until they come to the push downs, then it's so so slow, then BAM!, it's back to light speed for the punches. Why? Why not do the form with proper mechanics and meaning from the beginning?
     
  10. donald

    donald Black Belt

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    I thought the demo of the form application was pretty kewl. Although I was taught that the palm presses were defenses against knees to the groin. Again I thought it was...

    1stJohn1:9
     
  11. marlon

    marlon Master Black Belt

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    in the first form there is a lot of arm movement without center movement/ waist. Is this the norm with this form?

    Respectfully,
    Marlon
     
  12. Christina05

    Christina05 Green Belt

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    That is the hard part about video posting but I must say if your going to post it make sure to bring your A game to the table. And make sure you can eat all the criticism that come your way for posting your footage because there will be a million and one people telling you how you executed the technique poorly. ( In most cases anyways)
     
  13. ChadWarner

    ChadWarner Green Belt

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    There should be some noticeable waist movement (and there is some) but I think the timing is a bit off so it runs together with other movement giving the form a blocky or square appearance. It also seemed a little rushed which tends to cause the principles or laws to be overrun by body momemtum. When that happens movement stops and has to be restarted, the by product is mechanical looking movement.

    That's why the rule in Kenpo is 1000 times slow for one time fast. All those slow repititions help you feel things... it takes time and a lot of patience and also developes focus.

    hope this helped some
     
  14. Kenpojujitsu3

    Kenpojujitsu3 Master Black Belt

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    You almost sound like Max.
     
  15. KenpoDave

    KenpoDave 2nd Black Belt

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    I agree. Speedy is not better.
     
  16. Touch Of Death

    Touch Of Death Sr. Grandmaster

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    If you do it slow you can't possibly be doing it right.
    Sean
     
  17. Baphomet

    Baphomet White Belt

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    The video posted by the original poster looks very similar to a form I learned several years ago, though I can't remember if it was known as Long 1, or something different. As mentioned in the posts previous to my own, the practicioner's movements seem to be far too extended to be worthwhile. From my experience, you can generate far more power while still maintaining control when keeping your arms closer to your body.

    Previous posters also mentioned the fact that the practicioner appeared to be moving far too quickly, and I would have to agree. When I practiced this form, I was told to hold each stance for a minimum of 10 to 15 seconds, which made for a very long kata. However, I feel as though I am better for it, and after practicing the same kata hundreds of times, I have come to enjoy the sense of physical strength that comes with it.123
     

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