Importance of board breaking

[Azulx]

What is the importance of this practice in martial arts? What is it's purpose? What mentality should one have during this?

 

[Dirty Dog]

Breaking (of all sorts, not just boards) serves a number of purposes, says the guy breaking pavers in his avatar.
It's a good way to practice the body mechanics necessary to generate and deliver high levels of power in your strikes.
It's a good way to practice precision in your strikes. You can pound a bag with minimal accuracy, but if you smack a pile of bricks with poor technique, it hurts. A lot.
It's a good way to build confidence in ones ability to do the above.
It's fun.
The mentality needs to be committed. If you don't commit, the break will fail. And that hurts. Sometimes a lot.

 

[Flatfish]

Breaking (of all sorts, not just boards) serves a number of purposes, says the guy breaking pavers in his avatar.
It's a good way to practice the body mechanics necessary to generate and deliver high levels of power in your strikes.
It's a good way to practice precision in your strikes. You can pound a bag with minimal accuracy, but if you smack a pile of bricks with poor technique, it hurts. A lot.
It's a good way to build confidence in ones ability to do the above.
It's fun.
The mentality needs to be committed. If you don't commit, the break will fail. And that hurts. Sometimes a lot.

Yup yup yup he says and looks sadly at his rainbow-colored wrist, courtesy of a failed cinderblock break attempt......

 

[Bill Mattocks]

In Marine Corps boot camp, they had two courses of obstacles that we would run. The first was called, appropriately enough, the 'Obstacle Course'. We ran it every week. It was hard.

The second course, called the 'Confidence Course', looked much more difficult than the Obstacle Course. It was freaking scary-looking. We ran it only twice. Once when we first got to boot camp. The second time was just before graduation.

The first time we ran it, we had no skill and no confidence, which was natural. It kicked our butts. No one aced it, very few made it through without failing one or several obstacles, sometimes with spectacular results (falling from a great height into a pool of muddy water, for example).

The second time we ran it, we had been moving through boot camp for nearly 13 weeks. We were trained and ready. Everyone aced it; and in fact, it was MUCH EASIER than the Obstacle Course, despite looking like it would be worse.

It was as described, a 'Confidence Course'. We saw how far we had come and we had confidence.

Breaking is like that. You can't break without confidence. Skill, speed, power, focus, all of those matter too. But confidence is key. And when you see the pile of broken concrete at your feet, and your hand is intact, and people who don't do martial arts are standing with mouths agape, that's confidence-building right there.

 

[Tony Dismukes]

Dirty Dog and Bill have explained the purpose of the practice in those arts which use it.

On the importance of the exercise for martial arts in general - not much, really. Most arts don't include it and practitioners of striking arts which don't include breaking have shown themselves to be capable of just as much power and precision as practitioners of arts which do use it.

 

[oftheherd1]

Dirty Dog and Bill have explained the purpose of the practice in those arts which use it.

On the importance of the exercise for martial arts in general - not much, really. Most arts don't include it and practitioners of striking arts which don't include breaking have shown themselves to be capable of just as much power and precision as practitioners of arts which do use it.

At first I was going to disagree with you. Then I remembered my TKD training all those years ago. Long before we were allowed to break things, we were working on power/speed, accuracy, and focus of gi. You are of course, correct.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

I agree with those who say breaking is not necessary. Our dojo doesn't do it often, and when we do, it's just for fun. No one has to do it, promotions don't depend upon it, but it can be entertaining. It isn't required to develop martial arts proficiency, IMHO.

 

[Azulx]

So this is what happened to me in class, that sparked up my idea for this question. Yesterday we were doing board breaking I was the only one breaking in class because I was the only one allowed to. Only red stripes or higher are allowed to break wood. The boards are 3/4 of an inch thick, straight from Home Depot. They aren't any special made breaking boards or demo boards or anything like that. I was practicing because I need to do 4 power breaks for my testing to black stripe( 1st geup). I honestly couldn't break crap that day. I could only do one board with a knife-hand. My head just wasn't in the game, I couldn't focus.

I was pretty visibly disappointed in myself, so my instructor told he wanted to talk to me after class. He basically told me that if I couldn't do the power breaks it didn't make any less of a martial artist. He also said if it came down to it during testing, if I could't break the wood, he would just use the plastic re-breakable board for to me execute the technique through the board. At this point, I'm not worried about failing testing, I'm more worried about failing myself. I want to be ale to blast through the wooden boards, not the plastic ones.

In addition to my original question I would like to ask another: For those who have breaking as a part of testing, What are the breaking requirements for 2nd and 1st geup/kyu/etc. Board thickness and technique wise? This is merely out of curiosity to see what other schools do.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

At this point, I'm not worried about failing testing, I'm more worried about failing myself. I want to be ale to blast through the wooden boards, not the plastic ones.

The boards are already broken. You only have to understand that before you strike.

 

[Azulx]

The boards are already broken. You only have to understand that before you strike.

Interesting: Could you elaborate for me, what do you mean by they are already broken?

 

[Flatfish]

In addition to my original question I would like to ask another: For those who have breaking as a part of testing, What are the breaking requirements for 2nd and 1st geup/kyu/etc. Board thickness and technique wise? This is merely out of curiosity to see what other schools do.

In reference to my post above. I had a belt test last week for Deputy Dan as we call it (red and black, last belt before 1st Dan). I was supposed to break 5 boards with a power break but asked instead if I could try a cinderblock. My instructor warned me that she had only been able to find cinderblocks that are less porous than what she used to use and thus harder to break but I wanted to try anyway.

I tried twice, failed miserably, hurt my wrist and my ego. I did go ahead and break my five boards afterwards at least. Then we had to break single boards with a variety of kicks, front kick, side kick, spinning side kick and axe kick.

We never practice breaking in class. I think our instructor simply wants to see if we have the determination to try and go for it. A lot of the kids need more than one attempt most of the time but they don't fail their test.

To make you feel better I'll post a vid of my hurting my wrist. You should be able to get a good laugh out of that. I am disappointed that I couldn't do it but keep telling myself that at least I tried and challenged myself.

 

[WaterGal]

In addition to my original question I would like to ask another: For those who have breaking as a part of testing, What are the breaking requirements for 2nd and 1st geup/kyu/etc. Board thickness and technique wise? This is merely out of curiosity to see what other schools do.

For those geups, they get to choose their break from a list that includes back hook (turning heel) kick, turning roundhouse, flying side kick, and one or two others that I'm forgetting right now. The thickness is either a 1" board (actually 3/4", for the same reason a 2x4 is 1.5"x3") or a 1/2" board depending on their age/size and the kick.

 

[Azulx]

In reference to my post above. I had a belt test last week for Deputy Dan as we call it (red and black, last belt before 1st Dan). I was supposed to break 5 boards with a power break but asked instead if I could try a cinderblock. My instructor warned me that she had only been able to find cinderblocks that are less porous than what she used to use and thus harder to break but I wanted to try anyway.

I tried twice, failed miserably, hurt my wrist and my ego. I did go ahead and break my five boards afterwards at least. Then we had to break single boards with a variety of kicks, front kick, side kick, spinning side kick and axe kick.

We never practice breaking in class. I think our instructor simply wants to see if we have the determination to try and go for it. A lot of the kids need more than one attempt most of the time but they don't fail their test.

To make you feel better I'll post a vid of my hurting my wrist. You should be able to get a good laugh out of that. I am disappointed that I couldn't do it but keep telling myself that at least I tried and challenged myself.

That 5 board break was awesome! The thing is we barely practice breaking too, once maybe every three months, so it's difficult to get your mind right for it. This is the problem for me at least. I don't know how much teh size of the person influences the ability to break wood, but we have another red belt who is probably about 220 lbs, which is about 70 lbs more tan me, who just cremates the boards like they are butter. I want to be like that. I think I just have to focus, and not be hesitant.

 

[Azulx]

For those geups, they get to choose their break from a list that includes back hook (turning heel) kick, turning roundhouse, flying side kick, and one or two others that I'm forgetting right now. The thickness is either a 1" board (actually 3/4", for the same reason a 2x4 is 1.5"x3") or a 1/2" board depending on their age/size and the kick.

Can adults do the half a board? I thought those were just for kids?

 

[WaterGal]

Can adults do the half a board? I thought those were just for kids?

We teach both kids and adults. Adults would do the thicker board for most things, yeah.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

Interesting: Could you elaborate for me, what do you mean by they are already broken?

It's a mental thing.

Have you ever bent down to pick up a box that you thought was full, only to nearly fall over when you found it to be empty instead? This is your mind telling your body to prepare for something difficult, which is not actually what it appears to be.

Deciding that the board is already broken and really believing that, the body knows that it can simply pass the hand or foot through the spot the board broke, and it will be nearly effortless; the opposite of the 'empty box' expectation, but the same concept.

In reality, boards are not difficult to break. Your mind makes them so. What your mind makes difficult, it can make simple.

We're not talking about superhuman stuff here, or supernatural stuff either. The boards are actually quite easy to break. We humans have convinced ourselves that they are difficult.

Any parent who has ever walked down a shopping aisle with a toddler in their arms and had the toddler reach out and grab some passing anchored thing like a metal shelf understands this; the tiny child, not knowing that they 'cannot' be strong enough to pull the adult off their feet, does so with ease. It is only later that we learn what we cannot do, and therefore cannot do it.

The board is already broken. Just complete the action and you're done. The board has no choice in the matter, and your mind doesn't have any decisions to make other than to move your hand or foot through where the board used to be.

 

[Dirty Dog]

So this is what happened to me in class, that sparked up my idea for this question. Yesterday we were doing board breaking I was the only one breaking in class because I was the only one allowed to. Only red stripes or higher are allowed to break wood. The boards are 3/4 of an inch thick, straight from Home Depot. They aren't any special made breaking boards or demo boards or anything like that. I was practicing because I need to do 4 power breaks for my testing to black stripe( 1st geup). I honestly couldn't break crap that day. I could only do one board with a knife-hand. My head just wasn't in the game, I couldn't focus.

That's what our students break, too. Nothing special. Buy them at Loews, chop them up.

I was pretty visibly disappointed in myself, so my instructor told he wanted to talk to me after class. He basically told me that if I couldn't do the power breaks it didn't make any less of a martial artist. He also said if it came down to it during testing, if I could't break the wood, he would just use the plastic re-breakable board for to me execute the technique through the board. At this point, I'm not worried about failing testing, I'm more worried about failing myself. I want to be ale to blast through the wooden boards, not the plastic ones.

What sort of plastic rebreakable boards do you have? I ask, because the ones we have (from a company called UMAB - Ultimate Martial Arts Boards) are pretty well engineered. I've broken them in series and I cannot tell any difference between them and wooden boards. The company states that they measured the impact required to break a bunch of boards and designed these to be exactly average. They come in different colors to match belts, with green being the same as a regular board, orange yellow and white being progresively easier, and blue brown and black being progressively more difficult. Breaking their black board is the same as breaking 2.5" of pine.
So, if you're using something similar, the real difference would be... confidence...

My wife (who was promoted to 1st Dan earlier this month) used to hold back on boards, but blasted through the rebreakables. I started draping a towel over them so she didn't know which she was breaking. She'd blast through the rebreakables a few times, then I'd sneak in a wooden board. Fixed that...

In addition to my original question I would like to ask another: For those who have breaking as a part of testing, What are the breaking requirements for 2nd and 1st geup/kyu/etc. Board thickness and technique wise? This is merely out of curiosity to see what other schools do.

All promotions require a break of a minimum of 1 board. Students can ask if they want a thicker break, and sometimes we will suggest that they do more than one, but one is what is required. We do not use half boards or demo boards or baked boards or anything of the sort. Required breaks are all kicks. Breaking with the hands is limited to adults and Dan ranks.
9th geup - step behind side kick
8th geup - skipping side kick
7th geup - jump side kick
6th geup - standing side kick
5th geup - jump spin back kick
4th geup - axe kick
3rd geup - round house kick
2nd geup - spin hook kick
1st geup - 2-station, round house and spin hook kicks
Chodanbo - full turning back kick and a 3-station break of the students choice.
Dan ranks - Pick some stuff. Show off. Have fun.
My last promotion, I did a power break of 10 8x2x16" pavers, a speed break of 2 4x2x16" pavers, and a 4-station break consisting of a forward punch, then a rear elbow, a front snap kick and a back kick, all done as quickly as possible. The front snap to back kick was done without letting the kicking foot touch the floor. All were 2-3" pine breaks.

In reference to my post above. I had a belt test last week for Deputy Dan as we call it (red and black, last belt before 1st Dan). I was supposed to break 5 boards with a power break but asked instead if I could try a cinderblock. My instructor warned me that she had only been able to find cinderblocks that are less porous than what she used to use and thus harder to break but I wanted to try anyway.

Was that a cinder block or cement? Big difference...
From what I saw in the video, you need to raise the block higher, and use your body. You're only using your arm. That is NOT the best way to generate power.

Now, notice how the torque of the body is used to generate power for those breaks. Sure, it was only 5 (my personal record is 10), but the principles are the same.
I'm a worn out tired old fat man. A younger, fitter man should be able to do much better than me.

A word about spacers... use them.
Contrary to what people think, spacers do NOT make breaks any easier. What they do is protect your hand. If I slam my hand down on 10 blocks, with no spacers, and fail to break them, my hand goes from a million miles per second to zero in nothing flat. And becomes flat. And broken. And painful.
Now, do the same thing with spacers. If the break fails, the hand will decelerate relatively slowly. It still hurts, but it doesn't shatter.

That 5 board break was awesome! The thing is we barely practice breaking too, once maybe every three months, so it's difficult to get your mind right for it. This is the problem for me at least. I don't know how much teh size of the person influences the ability to break wood, but we have another red belt who is probably about 220 lbs, which is about 70 lbs more tan me, who just cremates the boards like they are butter. I want to be like that. I think I just have to focus, and not be hesitant.

We just promoted a 6 year old to 9th geup. He weighs about 8 lbs. He had no problem with the break. Confidence. Commitment. Good technique. That's all it takes, even for the big power breaks.

As for getting your mind right... it should always be right. This thing people do where they stand in front of the break huffing and puffing and all that is just silly. Watch the video I posted. This was shot in our beginner class, because we had a bunch of people going from 10th to 9th geup who had never seen any power breaking. I explain to them what I'm doing, I put my hand on the bricks to show them the strike I'm going to use, and I'm done. Same thing with the speed break. Confidence. Commitment. Good technique. There's no need to psych yourself up for that.

 

[Azulx]

What sort of plastic rebreakable boards do you have? I ask, because the ones we have (from a company called UMAB - Ultimate Martial Arts Boards) are pretty well engineered. I've broken them in series and I cannot tell any difference between them and wooden boards. The company states that they measured the impact required to break a bunch of boards and designed these to be exactly average. They come in different colors to match belts, with green being the same as a regular board, orange yellow and white being progresively easier, and blue brown and black being progressively more difficult. Breaking their black board is the same as breaking 2.5" of pine.
So, if you're using something similar, the real difference would be... confidence...

My wife (who was promoted to 1st Dan earlier this month) used to hold back on boards, but blasted through the rebreakables. I started draping a towel over them so she didn't know which she was breaking. She'd blast through the rebreakables a few times, then I'd sneak in a wooden board. Fixed that...

I don't know the brand to be honest, but they are about 8 years old. I don't know how much a difference taht makes. Most of our old things are MACHO brand so it could quite possibly be that brand.

We just promoted a 6 year old to 9th geup. He weighs about 8 lbs. He had no problem with the break. Confidence. Commitment. Good technique. That's all it takes, even for the big power breaks.

As for getting your mind right... it should always be right. This thing people do where they stand in front of the break huffing and puffing and all that is just silly. Watch the video I posted. This was shot in our beginner class, because we had a bunch of people going from 10th to 9th geup who had never seen any power breaking. I explain to them what I'm doing, I put my hand on the bricks to show them the strike I'm going to use, and I'm done. Same thing with the speed break. Confidence. Commitment. Good technique. There's no need to psych yourself up for that.

So this 8 year old broke the .75 inch board? Btw thank you for the advice it is very helpful.

 

[Dirty Dog]

I don't know the brand to be honest, but they are about 8 years old. I don't know how much a difference taht makes. Most of our old things are MACHO brand so it could quite possibly be that brand.

I don't think I've ever seen a MACHO labeled rebreakable. Peek at the back of one, or describe how they're built. The ones we use are from HERE. Note how they're built, with "fingers" from each side matching up to holes in the other half. The ones we have are 6-7 years old. They get broken regularly, and I still cannot tell any difference between them and wood. I've tried the 'tongue and groove' type boards, and they become ridiculously easy to break very quickly.

So this 8 year old broke the .75 inch board? Btw thank you for the advice it is very helpful.

He's 6, but yes, he did. He's not unique. We have a 5 (nearly 6...) year old 8th geup. We also have a pair of sisters who are currently 3rd geup. They're 12 and 14, and quite petite. They've been with us since the younger one was 6 or 7, and despite both their young age and tiny bodies, they always break their boards. They've struggled with the breaks, sure, but they've always succeeded.

 

[Azulx]

I don't think I've ever seen a MACHO labeled rebreakable. Peek at the back of one, or describe how they're built. The ones we use are from HERE. Note how they're built, with "fingers" from each side matching up to holes in the other half. The ones we have are 6-7 years old. They get broken regularly, and I still cannot tell any difference between them and wood. I've tried the 'tongue and groove' type boards, and they become ridiculously easy to break very quickly.

They actually look just like the ones in the link. But I break those so easily, I don't understand...