What's wrong with the .380?

[chinto]

True, that bigger can be better, if we're talking about ball ammo. After all, a .357 magnum will make a hole about 0.357" wide, and will probably make an exit hole of similar size, while a .45 ACP will do the same with a 0.451" diameter hole.

However, with today's jacketed hollowpoint ammunition, the playing field has been equalized. Take a look at Winchetser's ballistic's:

http://winchester.com/lawenforcement/testing/testing_pg.aspx

Not much difference at all between a 9 mm and a .40.

Also, look at the Ranger T series:

http://winchester.com/lawenforcement/testing/testing_t.aspx

Not much of a difference between 9 mm / .40 / .45 ACP.

Similar premium ammunition from any of the major manufacturers (Remington, Speer, Federal, Hornady) should perform similarly, too.

actually a jacketed hollow point from a 9mm and from a .45 cal will tend to expand fairly closely in percentage of increase in diameter. but for self defense i would suggest you use a frangible ball like "mag safe" or similar... prevents over penetration and other problems that result in secondary casualty and collateral wounds to innocent bystanders. but the larger heavier slug will be more effective in most hit locations at incapacitating the attacker faster, and more effectively.

 

[KenpoTex]

...but for self defense i would suggest you use a frangible ball like "mag safe" or similar... prevents over penetration and other problems that result in secondary casualty and collateral wounds to innocent bystanders...

I'm not a big fan (not a fan at all actually) of MagSafe, Glasers, or similar...I want something that will penetrate.

Hanguns are anemic little weapons to begin with, no sense handicapping them any more.

On a somewhat related note...it cracks me up that police departments (and as a result, those that base their choices on what the cops carry) are always making so much noise about secondary penetration. Why is this amusing? because if they have a hit rate of 50%, they're doing well. What's the point in worrying about secondary penetration when you miss?

 

[chinto]

I'm not a big fan (not a fan at all actually) of MagSafe, Glasers, or similar...I want something that will penetrate.

Hanguns are anemic little weapons to begin with, no sense handicapping them any more.

On a somewhat related note...it cracks me up that police departments (and as a result, those that base their choices on what the cops carry) are always making so much noise about secondary penetration. Why is this amusing? because if they have a hit rate of 50%, they're doing well. What's the point in worrying about secondary penetration when you miss?

i do not base my selection on what the cops choose for ammo or a weapon. actually i figure the 3rd round out will be a jhp and the 4th and the next will be a fmj.. but face it, you will get it done with the first 3 rounds to 5 round in almost all self defense situation with a pistol or you are provably screwed!

but in the after math of a situation where you did use your weapon it looks better to the grand jury and the Jury at trial if it ever gets that far, when you say... I had Mag-safe round in my weapon, and I have done every thing I could to make sure that I would not have to use the weapon and that if i did I would use the minimum force to preserve my life!

On pistol versus other weapons.. well if I have to go to a gun fight, and can not opt out I am bringing at least a .30 cal rifle or a 12 bore shot gun ( depending on the terrain) but a pistol is not going to be my choice for that kind of thing if I know its coming!!

 

[LawDog]

A nice posted hollow cavity will work just fine. In most situations it's expasion in on the controlled side so that if there is an over penetration, for the most part, the round is spent.
The glaser type of round is not that accurate. After impact they will not create a good "shock" pattern, this is needed to create a very destructive cavity.
The key to success when using any hand gun is simply the putting of an effective round to where it will do the most damage.
:biggun:

 

[Grenadier]

i do not base my selection on what the cops choose for ammo or a weapon. actually i figure the 3rd round out will be a jhp and the 4th and the next will be a fmj.. but face it, you will get it done with the first 3 rounds to 5 round in almost all self defense situation with a pistol or you are provably screwed!

Staggering ammunition like that really doesn't help. You're better off loading your magazine with a proven hollowpoint load.

Some folks have asked why not keep FMJ in the magazine to use against vehicles. I'll simply say this: JHP that doesn't expand, will act the same as a FMJ will.

but in the after math of a situation where you did use your weapon it looks better to the grand jury and the Jury at trial if it ever gets that far, when you say... I had Mag-safe round in my weapon, and I have done every thing I could to make sure that I would not have to use the weapon and that if i did I would use the minimum force to preserve my life!

Ammunition choice isn't an issue. Anyone can simply say "I used what the police recommended and use for themselves."

 

[chinto]

Staggering ammunition like that really doesn't help. You're better off loading your magazine with a proven hollowpoint load.

Some folks have asked why not keep FMJ in the magazine to use against vehicles. I'll simply say this: JHP that doesn't expand, will act the same as a FMJ will.




Ammunition choice isn't an issue. Anyone can simply say "I used what the police recommended and use for themselves."

true.. that does tend to put the DA on the defensive if you use what your local cop shop uses... but I also have to agree that gun control in the instance of being able to hit the target at the point of aim is the most important!! but bore diameter will make that hit regardless of where more effective in any situation concerning a pistol/handgun!!!!!.

 

[Deaf Smith]

If you want the max out of the .380, Buffalo Bore makes a .380 load, 90 gr JHP, at 1175 fps or higher.

http://www.buffalobore.com/ammunition/default.htm#380

Just in case you want that little extra bit of power.

Deaf

 

[AzQkr]

I just had delivered Monday-60 rds [ three boxes of 20 ] BB in their posted 90 gr. Speer Gold Dot J.H.C. @ 1175 fps 276 ft. lbs.

In my ppk/s, they travel 1200fps. Bonded core bullet, it's not going to break apart but will expand. They state expect about 10" of penetration with that loading. Though I like a little more penetration, when carrying this load in these guns, I'm good with that data. Some of the 38spl loadings for SD don't make 276 ft lbs out of the snubs.

I'm good with the above load when I carry the pkk/s or ppk. I'm also good with Fiocchi ball in 380 [ a little hotter than american ammo ].

Brownie