What else do you need byond your toolbox?

Gerry Seymour

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The

- throat push,
- under chin push,
- whole face push,
- forehead push,
- side head push,
- ...

are all good contact points. It can be combined with "leg skill" such as cut, hook, spring, ... as throw.
Good contact points, yes. But not nearly the be-all of control he suggested.
 

jobo

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I'd be surprised if that worked anywhere near as often as you suggest.
try it, I challenge you to find anyone who won't concentrate on getting your hand off when their eyes start popping and they are turning blue. The more they pull your hand away. The more pull there is on the Adams apple. It's like they are choking themselves
 

Gerry Seymour

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try it, I challenge you to find anyone who won't concentrate on getting your hand off when their eyes start popping and they are turning blue. The more they pull your hand away. The more pull there is on the Adams apple. It's like they are choking themselves
First, you have to get it there, past their awareness, blocking, and movement...and get an actual grip. Then you have to deal with the fact that many people can counter it with one hand (since you're only using one hand). Then you have to deal with the people savvy enough to counter it by ignoring it and striking. Then you have to deal with the people who will gladly use both arms, because you've provided a great connection where they can control your structure and balance.
 

jobo

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First, you have to get it there, past their awareness, blocking, and movement...and get an actual grip. Then you have to deal with the fact that many people can counter it with one hand (since you're only using one hand). Then you have to deal with the people savvy enough to counter it by ignoring it and striking. Then you have to deal with the people who will gladly use both arms, because you've provided a great connection where they can control your structure and balance.
all whilst choking to death
 
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Kung Fu Wang

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all whilst choking to death
How to deal with a "front throat double hands choke" was the 1st MA technique that I had learned when I was 5.

- Hold both hands into a big fist.
- Use forearm as a wedge to strike through the space between your opponent's arms from under and up.
- After you have separated his both arms throat choke, you use both hands to grab on top of his head.
- You then pull his head down and strike your knee into his groin.
- You and him then live happy ever after.
 
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Gerry Seymour

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How to deal with a "front throat double hands choke" was the 1st MA technique that I had learned when I was 5.

- Hold both hands into a big fist.
- Use forearm as a wedge to strike through the space between your opponent's arms from under and up.
- After you have separated his both arms throat choke, you use both hands to grab on top of his head.
- You then pull his head down and strike your knee into his groin.
- You and him then live happy ever after.
He's not even talking about using 2 hands.
 

jobo

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Ah, so your one-handed choke is invincible, is it?
invincible is to strong a word,like all techniques' it relies on you having certain atributes, certainly a strong grip is a strict requirement, both to shut off the air supply and to resist them pulling it off. It isnt to squeeze the wind pipe rather to force your fingers round it so you have a large round object( Adams apple) in your hand. That makes it difficult to remove as you have a good degree of purchase. You only need to hang on for about 20 seconds before they start to pass out. So it then dependent on what both they and you are doing with you hands. Their life preserving instinct with be to use both hand to pull your hand off. If they instead manage to over ride that and say start punching you. Then it become a case of taking what they can throw till the lack of air takes , you of course have a free hand to throw you own punches, / block or whatever
 

Gerry Seymour

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invincible is to strong a word,like all techniques' it relies on you having certain atributes, certainly a strong grip is a strict requirement, both to shut off the air supply and to resist them pulling it off. It isnt to squeeze the wind pipe rather to force your fingers round it so you have a large round object( Adams apple) in your hand. That makes it difficult to remove as you have a good degree of purchase. You only need to hang on for about 20 seconds before they start to pass out. So it then dependent on what both they and you are doing with you hands. Their life preserving instinct with be to use both hand to pull your hand off. If they instead manage to over ride that and say start punching you. Then it become a case of taking what they can throw till the lack of air takes , you of course have a free hand to throw you own punches, / block or whatever
Again, assuming you manage to sink the technique. Until that point, it's just a hand. After that point, it's a matter of whether they have better skill AND the ability to put it to use.
 

jobo

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Again, assuming you manage to sink the technique. Until that point, it's just a hand. After that point, it's a matter of whether they have better skill AND the ability to put it to use.
is that not true of any and all techniques, I've used it to take out much bigger. Stronger opponents' than myself, its very much a leveler , Steve the marshal arts expert might have an answer to it. Bill the 18 stone body builder most probably will not. When you let go or someone breaks it up, they start calling you a phyco and saying you were trying to kill them, well yea, The throat is very much the main target in the animal kingdom, but an oft neglected one in human conflicts
 
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JP3

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Steve the marshal arts expert might have an answer to it. Bill the 18 stone body builder most probably will not. When you let go or someone breaks it up, they start calling you a phyco and saying you were trying to kill them, well yea, The throat is very much the main target in the animal kingdom, but an oft neglected one in human conflicts
Agree the throat is under-utilized by some systems, and I was wondering who it was that you were using this technique on to such good effect. Every single grappling art I've even messed around with has a simple answer/solution to the simple, front one-hand choke, and they work fine, even for a 90-lb pound female against a 200-lb guy when applied. I grant you, the implied "correctly" should be understood to be after the word applied.

Which brings me to this question? Why are you picking on 18 stone bodybuilders? What did they ever do to you? You meanie.
 

JP3

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To respond to Wang's O/P, for me what I'd say I need is fluidity and mental/coordination gility to switch between ... "games" for lack of a better term while on the fly and in the moment. Figure out that you have a striker coming in with super fast combos, flow into defensive positioning and grappling to close that down and some good infighting strikes once tied up maybe, or slip and take down mutually to be doing groundwork witht he stand-up person... but if you end up down there and find out that the dude was playing with you and he was secretely a BJJ black belt, having the ability to defend, get distance and get the heck back up and away from that rolling ball of steak knives....

Yes, tactical fluidity I think. Just add that to movement skills and I'm good with that toolbox.
 
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Kung Fu Wang

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you have a striker coming in with super fast combos, ...
Agree! The defense ability is also important such as how to

- block a punch,
- block a kick,
- defense a take down,
- defense a joint lock,
- defense in ground game,
- ...

For example, if your opponent sweeps your leg, all you need to do is to bend your leg and let the sweeping leg to go under it. If you then use the same escaping leg to sweep his attacking leg, you can reverse your defense into offense. This kind of defense and counter skill is not in your original toolbox.
 

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