EDverything about TKD seems to ne heading in the wrong direction, why is that? I guess times are changing and they are trying to compete with ISKA and the Kung Fu types of art.
TKD The dieing Art
- Thread starter terryl965
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StudentCarl
3rd Black Belt
I think it's too easy to get caught up in the big picture when it's not where we really live. My taekwondo is the school I attend, so the real key to my experience is my master. For me, taekwondo is a thriving vigorous art, where people seek a challenge to become more than they were. Some of us go to tournaments, some regularly, and some compete at JOs/Nationals, but what's outside our school doesn't really touch us like our master influences us each day.
You build the future of taekwondo every day you teach. I don't read apathy on these forum pages--just the opposite. Taekwondo isn't just the art--it's the people. The real measure of our art is what it produces: I know some great people through TKD, and I think you do too. There will always be people who take little away, but for the dedicated student our art is life changing.
If you think ours is a dying art, I suggest you watch a couple of things this week: your youngest class and your oldest dedicated student. Watch the heart they put into class. Dying art?? Just the opposite. Besides, watching the kids will lighten your mood and put the adult garbage back in perspective.
Carl
You build the future of taekwondo every day you teach. I don't read apathy on these forum pages--just the opposite. Taekwondo isn't just the art--it's the people. The real measure of our art is what it produces: I know some great people through TKD, and I think you do too. There will always be people who take little away, but for the dedicated student our art is life changing.
If you think ours is a dying art, I suggest you watch a couple of things this week: your youngest class and your oldest dedicated student. Watch the heart they put into class. Dying art?? Just the opposite. Besides, watching the kids will lighten your mood and put the adult garbage back in perspective.
Carl
Omar B
Senior Master
What's this wrong direction you speak of? Generalities really don't make a point. It's a thriving art, does good business and is represented in the Olympics. Exactly what is the wrong direction here? You personally may not like what you see in the art or how it is expressed, but you've not even mentioned that, just this general decline you did not illustrate.
well, it's a living thing, expanding and contracting.
In the last few years I have found that there was the urge to be too much to too many people, trying to catch on to the growing appeal of MMA due to the UFC going main stream.
There are things that complement and add value, and then I have seen the stuff that takes away (IMHO)
But by in large, TKD is alive and kicking (lol, the pun) and eventually will get back to were it was.
Historically there have been ups and downs in the acceptable level of 'violence' in society. I think we are at a pampered stage right now.
That influences how hard core TKD is being promoted. But I don't think it will ever go away completely.
In the last few years I have found that there was the urge to be too much to too many people, trying to catch on to the growing appeal of MMA due to the UFC going main stream.
There are things that complement and add value, and then I have seen the stuff that takes away (IMHO)
But by in large, TKD is alive and kicking (lol, the pun) and eventually will get back to were it was.
Historically there have been ups and downs in the acceptable level of 'violence' in society. I think we are at a pampered stage right now.
That influences how hard core TKD is being promoted. But I don't think it will ever go away completely.
I could not agree more. There is so much to do in your own school and so much to learn yes things are changing but so many oportunites for education, cultural exchange, the spiritual side, I want to visit with some of my students some of the sites realted to the creation of the bb forms, I want to promote taking an Eskimo dance group visiting the world Hanmadang games and eventually fund bringing traditional Korean dancers to the cultural dance festivals here in the villages.
Korea has or is finishing a billion dollar tkd park, it does not matter what is going on with national Olympic stuff there are so many smaller friendly tournaments freindship tournaments and events to go to. Create a demo team for going into the schools and start after school programs with grants.
Any one who is training under an original rooted master has much to learn and if your master is gone or dead there are some really great people who have the love of the traditional art.
Every time I get a new kid that is just lost and the day comes you see the light turn on and they have a better life because you took the time or an intermediate or advanced student all of a sudent progress and develop the ability to pass it along it all seems worth while.
The Art will never die because of its people the Koreans and thier spirit and anyone else who had that passed on to them.
ralphmcpherson
Senior Master
Most of what I know of the 'negatives' of tkd I have learned about by reading stuff on the internet, and I must admit it can get quite depressing. The 3 biggest clubs in my area all have in excess of a thousand members and are all 'stuck in the dark ages', which to me is a good thing. They all have a GM who came out here in the late 60's to early 70's and just refused to move with the times. They basically teach the same stuff now that they taught back then. If you guys at kukkiwon clubs saw me do koryo or keum gang forms you would probably laugh, from what Ive seen on the internet they have been chopped and changed so much over the years that they are virtually unrecognisable to me. Because the biggest clubs here still teach the old way the average person's perception of tkd here is a lot different to what it has obviously become in other places. I read somewhere that tkd is one of the arts that is not recommended for people training to become leo's and I just cant fathom that but when I see and hear what tkd has become in certain parts I can understand why. I have similar feelings when I hear people say "tkd is a great art, but it wont help you in a self defence situation", sadly this is becoming the common thinking with tkd. I know there are good clubs out there teaching traditional tkd the way it was and I just hope for the sake of the art that they remain there. I really think it is about time that 'sport tkd' is given a different name, I have nothing against the sport side but is has to be given its own identity so the lamen on the street can differentaite between the martial and sport sides, these days tkd has become too general a term which is leading people to think it is becoming a 'dying art', whereas its not dying, its just the one art going in different directions and both those directions need a separate identity in my opinion because I am a black belt in tkd yet if I walked into a 'sport tkd' club and started training I might as well throw on the white belt because what I do is about as similar to kukki tkd as horse riding is.
It can be quite disheartening for someone who grew up in traditional TaeKwon Do to see the amount of politics and BS that tends to get involved these days, as well as the current leaning towards sport TKD, but I think I'd prefer to call it a "changing" art as opposed to a dying one.
As for self defense and real world application: I grew up in traditional TKD. I'm 5'6", 162lbs, and I've put guys twice my size on their backs from a side kick, in sparring gear. I'd never do that if I hadn't learned to hit hard. The guys I know who come from sport TKD backgrounds can't kick hard enough that I can feel it.
"That's how people get hurt!" This is supposed to be a martial art. It exists outside of a points match. Put the art first, the sport comes second.
As for self defense and real world application: I grew up in traditional TKD. I'm 5'6", 162lbs, and I've put guys twice my size on their backs from a side kick, in sparring gear. I'd never do that if I hadn't learned to hit hard. The guys I know who come from sport TKD backgrounds can't kick hard enough that I can feel it.
"That's how people get hurt!" This is supposed to be a martial art. It exists outside of a points match. Put the art first, the sport comes second.
dancingalone
Grandmaster
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Hi, Terry. I'll echo the point everyone else is making that TKD is not a dying art, far from it actually. Personally, I have been reinvigorated by teaching my own vision of what TKD should be in my church group. We're free of organizational BS and we can focus exclusively on TKD as a method of self-defense, physical fitness, and spiritual growth and renewal. In fact, a restatement of this sentence is in our pastoral charter.
Manny
Senior Master
Because of the political thing and all the organizations trying to rule TKD this Korean Martial Art is loosing it's identity and is changin to some kind of full contact (not hands allowed) thing.
As I see here but the children of Terry, Gorila and very few other guys the majority of us are not into the sport side of TKD and are more into the martial art/self defense thing and with all the efforts to the sport side don't like us.
In my city as you know all the TKD dojos are WTF style and they amphaticed WTF/olimpic kyorugi leaving the self defense martial thing not in second or third place but maybe fourth place BUT when someone talks with the sambunims and even in tv/radio media these sambunims said TKD is an amaizing self defense martial art however rarely I see such a thing inside the dojangs, the kids and guys only do frentic kicking to focus mitt (palchaguis) and they don't have any clue of how to avoid, dodge,parry,block an atack or how to deal with more than one asailant.
The dojangs are not more than training centers where is cool or fashion meet with the guys and do some exercise.
Us, the old guys who knew TKD before the olimpics know TKD is not what today is taught in the average dojang, we know olimpic sparring is nothing more than a game and offcourse we are mad about it.
Yes TKD is a way of life but we don't have to forget it's also an outstanding Martial Art when taught and odone right.
Manny
As I see here but the children of Terry, Gorila and very few other guys the majority of us are not into the sport side of TKD and are more into the martial art/self defense thing and with all the efforts to the sport side don't like us.
In my city as you know all the TKD dojos are WTF style and they amphaticed WTF/olimpic kyorugi leaving the self defense martial thing not in second or third place but maybe fourth place BUT when someone talks with the sambunims and even in tv/radio media these sambunims said TKD is an amaizing self defense martial art however rarely I see such a thing inside the dojangs, the kids and guys only do frentic kicking to focus mitt (palchaguis) and they don't have any clue of how to avoid, dodge,parry,block an atack or how to deal with more than one asailant.
The dojangs are not more than training centers where is cool or fashion meet with the guys and do some exercise.
Us, the old guys who knew TKD before the olimpics know TKD is not what today is taught in the average dojang, we know olimpic sparring is nothing more than a game and offcourse we are mad about it.
Yes TKD is a way of life but we don't have to forget it's also an outstanding Martial Art when taught and odone right.
Manny
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I dont think its DYING, just evolving. and maybe not in the direction you or I approve, but it is evolving.
Just like music, it never died, just changed, to suit the current generation.... face it.... your getting old!!!:uhyeah:
and much like some of the crap music out now, we can still listen to OUR favorite music, so teach your way, but when the kids still go and listen to thier crap, its OK.
Just like music, it never died, just changed, to suit the current generation.... face it.... your getting old!!!:uhyeah:
and much like some of the crap music out now, we can still listen to OUR favorite music, so teach your way, but when the kids still go and listen to thier crap, its OK.
I don't find anything wrong with TKD/Sport TKD! We have a problem with some of the Organizations that are involved. The Sport side in the US (USAT) seems to be controlled by a few people trying to control competition for National Team Slots/Olympic Slots.
If the USAT were reorganized and a fair playing field established for all athletes then my frustration level would almost disappear!
If the USAT were reorganized and a fair playing field established for all athletes then my frustration level would almost disappear!
ralphmcpherson
Senior Master
I just think that these day "tkd" is just too broad a term. If little johnny wants to go to the olympics for tkd but trains at my club then he's no chance, but he wouldnt know this upon signing up because to him he is just joining a "tkd club". Just as someone who was recently mugged and wants to learn to protect themself and rolls up to a "tkd club" that unbeknownst to him focuses on the sport side and a year later he realises that while he is great at tkd sparring he really hasnt come a long way as far as self defence goes. I personally dont have a problem with either side of tkd but it really has got to a point where the for the sake of the general public a different name has to be given to the sport side so we can differentiate between the two.
