The process of developing systems

[skribs148 168]

I think the word "system" is fairly common in BJJ, but let me define specifically what I mean. A system is a pre-programmed series of if-then-else statements that serves as the basis of your gameplan from Point A to Point N. For example, you may have a DLR system which encompasses your gameplan for entering DLR from various positions, for off-balancing your opponent and transitioning between DLR variations or supporting guards, and your ultimate plan to sweep your opponent and/or submit them. It might be something along the lines of:

• Start in DLR
• If your opponent steps back, switch to deep DLR and take the back with a crab ride
• If your opponent drops to their knees, switch to deep DLR and berimbolo
• If your opponent steps forward, switch to reverse DLR and attack the wrestle-up

This is obviously a very simplified version, which would be appropriate for a blue belt getting a competition gameplan ready. But what I'm interested in is when black belts develop their systems for instructionals. There are often so many techniques off of so many reads with so many details. I'm thinking of many of the instructionals or seminars I've seen, as well as free content on youtube (especially the systems by Jordan Teaches Jiu-Jitsu or Jon Thomas BJJ, or the flowcharts by Berimbozo).

How do they map all of these out? Is it 100% from rolls? Is it from connecting information from personal journals and other instructionals? Do they have time set aside to workshop reads and reactions with a student or another coach?

For example, my A-game is deep half guard. I have a handful of pre-planned responses. I have other subconscious details I've picked up over time to avoid being wristlocked. But most of what I do is try and react away from my opponent's attacks and set up my specific few. A lot of what I do is thought of in the moment and lost in the next. A lot of what I do is the wrong read. A lot of what my opponents do is a 1-time reaction. And now I'm trying to work on my B game and C game, so I'm spending less time in deep half to continue to develop it.

What would be the process for me to develop my deep half system to the point I could run an instructional on it?

 

[wab25]

Are you open to changing your definition of "System?"

A system is a pre-programmed series of if-then-else statements that serves as the basis of your gameplan

If I only use if-then-else statements, I might come up with a system:

• When striking, if my opponent circles to my right then turn to the right.
• When striking, if my opponent circles to my left the turn to the left.
• If my opponent throws me o`goshi then look at his chest or face while being thrown.
• If my opponent pins me in kesa gatame then turn towards my opponent.

Now, in the match, my opponent takes my back, get both hooks in and transitions to a body triangle..... The problem is that now I have to add more if-then-else statements to my system. The list can get quite long....

If I get deeper than the if-then-else statements and identify some core principles, core strategies then I can adapt those core fundamentals to whatever situation I find myself in. Take my system above.... the core principle there is to always face your opponent. If I understand that core principle, then I know what to do when the other guy takes my back, gets his hooks in, and gets the body triangle..... I need to face him. This applies to any throw, not just o'goshi. This applies everywhere.

So, now when I want to teach this principle or run an instructional on that principle... I would pick a few different types of set ups, if-then-else situations, that allows me to demonstrate the same principle. The point of showing the different situations is not to limit anyone to this set if if-then-else statements.... the idea would be to provide enough different if-then-else statements that communicate different uses of the same principle so that the student can learn how to apply that principle in whatever situation he is in. You may need to provide some if-then-else statements that show where you would need to change to another principle, instead of staying with the same one.... but even here, the idea is not to list every possible situation, the idea is to illustrate what causes the change to be necessary. The student should be learning the parameters where this principle applies and how to identify the boundaries and be able to recognize when they would need to use a different principle.

 

[skribs148 168]

Now, in the match, my opponent takes my back, get both hooks in and transitions to a body triangle..... The problem is that now I have to add more if-then-else statements to my system. The list can get quite long....

In BJJ, systems are often not definitive for the whole art. For example, a guard passing system is your approach to guard passing that you're going to attempt to do. If you are in bottom guard, you would be using a guard system. If you are standing, you would use a stand-up system or would pull guard to enter into a guard system. If you're in a dominant position, you're in a system there.

Striking is simpler in that there are less variables and fewer positions. So a striking system is typically a complete system or style or art. In grappling, you tend to get systems that connect together.

That's why I defined it specifically for this thread that a system is a focus on getting from Point A to Point N (wherever Point N is). If a "system" was simply "everything I know about BJJ" then instructionals would be unfocused and would last 10x as long as they do.

In the example I provided, Point A is DLR guard, Point N would either be a sweep or submission. Once a pass, sweep, or submission happens; or the other person escapes the guard; or the guard progresses outside of the system (i.e. if you end up in closed guard); or something else happens outside the scope of that system; at that point you would be in a new system. For example if I swept my opponent and ended up in their half guard, then I would be out of my DLR system and into my guard passing system (or even my half-guard passing system).

The question was not about the system itself, but about the logistics in developing a system. How does one go from random situations happening in rolls to a clearly defined flowchart that covers 99% of the situations you could expect to encounter? What is the process of working through that (is it live, is it private workshops, what resources are used such as journals or research)? How do you ensure your information is complete?

 

[wab25]

In BJJ, systems are often not definitive for the whole art. For example, a guard passing system is your approach to guard passing that you're going to attempt to do. If you are in bottom guard, you would be using a guard system. If you are standing, you would use a stand-up system or would pull guard to enter into a guard system. If you're in a dominant position, you're in a system there.

So, I had to make an example from what I know. While I have trained BJJ, it was years ago when I was much younger.... and I only did a few years of it.... So, I had to use something I knew, for the example.

You can easily apply what I was suggesting to your BJJ art (or any other art). I just trained with a US National Sambo Champion, who is also an international Judo competitor, 5th dan in Judo and a BJJ black belt. He would say: we are going to work from this position. In this position, these are the important parts, this is what we focus on. Now, we move into technique A, then B.... The questions always come, what if they do this or that. Most of the time he would refer back to: these are the important parts for this position, if you focus on these parts and get these parts right, then things still work for A and B or maybe even C. The idea is that you have the important parts, the important principles of that position that we are working. These questions and the techniques he showed were there to give a variety of the range of what you can do... not a list of in this position you can to either A or B, nothing else. Sometimes when a question was asked, the answer was: now we change gears and play a different game, but here is the piece that changed. The piece that changed always related to one of those important points to focus on in that original position. Now he is showing what to look for that tells you when to change from this system to the next system. That was why I mentioned using specific statements to show when to do something different.

You may need to provide some if-then-else statements that show where you would need to change to another principle, instead of staying with the same one....

The question was not about the system itself, but about the logistics in developing a system. How does one go from random situations happening in rolls to a clearly defined flowchart that covers 99% of the situations you could expect to encounter? What is the process of working through that (is it live, is it private workshops, what resources are used such as journals or research)? How do you ensure your information is complete?

This is the fun part. I think most people go about it differently. But, this is the homework portion of the class.... and we all do our homework differently.

So, I roll.... and a bunch of random things happen. I review my rolls after class, going through them in my head. What random things to I keep seeing / falling for / get confused by.... I want to work on the ones I see the most often. Once I identify those, I mentally go through the techniques I have been shown and figure out which technique can deal with one of those random things on my list. Many times, I need help from sensei or coach or another classmate. Usually, I will eventually find that one technique can be used for two or three of my random things... even if there are variations needed to the technique itself. This is a key that I use. I can now focus on that technique and those different variations. The things that are the same between the variations will show you what the important parts are, and lead to the core principles that are at play here. Now, as I learn to better understand those core principles and the common important parts.... I usually start to see that the same technique can be applied in a few other random things that happen. In fact, the better I understand the core principles and common important parts, the easier it becomes for me to find new variations in new random things that happen. Conversely, I will also find things that this technique cannot handle.... thus I start also learning the boundaries of that technique. So, I start with the most common escape of my technique, figure out what technique to switch to and then repeat this same process with the new system based around the new technique.

Over time, as you develop more and more of these... and as you get a better and better understanding of the core principles... each system should be able to handle more random things, each system should be able to take you to more directions and you should start to be able to find commonalities of those core principles. When you find the same core principle in many different systems.... you will see that same principle expressed in different ways.... which should help you better understand that principle, in all areas.

Now you can do lessons on a system, based on a position. You should now have many options to go to. Pick those that explore the range of possibilities, but that focus on those important points and the core principles. Pick things that show the limits, the boundaries of where you need to shift to a different system.

Now you can also do lessons based on a core principle, and show the different ways that same core principle is expressed in the different situations. I think it is important to do both types of lessons.

 

[hoshin160052]

I am wondering if you came up with the use of the term system or is that actually used in BJJ?
I feel a system has more of an overarching meaning to it. Using a boolean IF-THEN seems to me, to be more a subroutine. Would there be a reason to add AND, OR & NOT?

 

[skribs148 168]

I am wondering if you came up with the use of the term system or is that actually used in BJJ?

It's actually used, especially by Jon Thomas, but also by other guys.

 

[skribs148 168]

In the attached screenshots from BJJ Fanatics (one of the biggest, if not the biggest grappling instructional sites), there's 319 results for "system". Some of these are systems, some are systematically attacking XYZ, some are probably Systema, but it's clearly not a "me" thing, and these systems are focused on specific positions or concepts and not BJJ as a whole. I don't think I'm being creative or unique in my use of this word within BJJ.