The future of TKD
- Thread starter terryl965
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WMKS Shogun
Green Belt
To give a canned answer: Tae Kwon Do will continue to evolve as a sport and a martial art. Okay, now that I have said that, let me get to a more meaty answer. I think Tae Kwon Do as a sport, particularly an Olympic sport, will continue to grow as changes are made to the rules to make it more accessable to more people. Programs like TORCH (The Olympics Really Can Happen, or something like that) are being marketed to bring Olympic Taekwondo to non-WTF/Kukkiwon students, and even students of other martial arts.
I also see traditional Tae Kwon Do continuing to develop as people like Staurt Anslow work to bring better understanding of the forms to student and instructor alike. Also, many instructors are working to make sure that Tae Kwon Do does not lose its spiritual and mental sides as well.
I am not sure what will happen with the three ITF branches. Maybe they will reconcile, maybe the courts will decide it for them. There is also a small chance that the ITF and WTF will merge, though it is slim.
The ATA is supposed to be getting a new Grandmaster soon, and they are making a killing in the business market, so it looks like the Sangahm style of Taekwondo or not, it apprears it is here to stay.
Smaller federations will continue to break off from larger ones, some will merge to make larger federations, and money will be made, some honestly, some not. Belt factories and McDojangs will continue as long as consumers are not educated enough and impatient enough, but there will also be some great dojangs producing some really excellent black belts, and even some students who may not reach black belt, but will still become great students of the art.
Oh, and hopefully, I will continue to increase in skill, and rise in rank! Heehee!
I also see traditional Tae Kwon Do continuing to develop as people like Staurt Anslow work to bring better understanding of the forms to student and instructor alike. Also, many instructors are working to make sure that Tae Kwon Do does not lose its spiritual and mental sides as well.
I am not sure what will happen with the three ITF branches. Maybe they will reconcile, maybe the courts will decide it for them. There is also a small chance that the ITF and WTF will merge, though it is slim.
The ATA is supposed to be getting a new Grandmaster soon, and they are making a killing in the business market, so it looks like the Sangahm style of Taekwondo or not, it apprears it is here to stay.
Smaller federations will continue to break off from larger ones, some will merge to make larger federations, and money will be made, some honestly, some not. Belt factories and McDojangs will continue as long as consumers are not educated enough and impatient enough, but there will also be some great dojangs producing some really excellent black belts, and even some students who may not reach black belt, but will still become great students of the art.
Oh, and hopefully, I will continue to increase in skill, and rise in rank! Heehee!
Dave Leverich
Black Belt
Kind of an interesting take on the ATA Mr. Henry, the ATA started in 1969 and was the NGB of the ITF for some time, predating even the KukkiKwon or WTF (as it was KTA in those days prior to the construction of the KKW). I think yes, it appears to be 'here to stay'.
The article about CM Allemier is more of a 'next in line' type statement, his journey towards that position. Honestly I'm not sure if it will be next year, or a few years down the line, but he is known as the "people's Master" and a very accomplished martial artist, as well as a good person. I'd be happy to see him in that role.
I know there have been numerous splits and offshoots over the years, even the ATA was an offshoot of the ITF, but it continues to thrive.
What I see in the future of Taekwondo overall is a continuation down the two paths of traditional and sport, as well as some convergeance of the two (bringing blocking back into the sport side etc). In the time I've been involved with TKD it's only grown and developed more, I see that continuing.
What I would absolutely love to see, is some kinds of Martial Arts offered in the school system, much like we do wrestling, baseball, football etc. Judo, TKD, Shorin Ryu, _something_ but of course my preference is TKD. I've seen the arts gain much acceptance over the last few decades, I hope to see even more and I'm sure I will.
Ps. On the ATA part above, I don't mean to come across defensive, I simply was looking to perhaps inform on some of the history. I've been studying TKD history over the last few years and it's really a great endeavor for me, very enlightening.
The article about CM Allemier is more of a 'next in line' type statement, his journey towards that position. Honestly I'm not sure if it will be next year, or a few years down the line, but he is known as the "people's Master" and a very accomplished martial artist, as well as a good person. I'd be happy to see him in that role.
I know there have been numerous splits and offshoots over the years, even the ATA was an offshoot of the ITF, but it continues to thrive.
What I see in the future of Taekwondo overall is a continuation down the two paths of traditional and sport, as well as some convergeance of the two (bringing blocking back into the sport side etc). In the time I've been involved with TKD it's only grown and developed more, I see that continuing.
What I would absolutely love to see, is some kinds of Martial Arts offered in the school system, much like we do wrestling, baseball, football etc. Judo, TKD, Shorin Ryu, _something_ but of course my preference is TKD. I've seen the arts gain much acceptance over the last few decades, I hope to see even more and I'm sure I will.
Ps. On the ATA part above, I don't mean to come across defensive, I simply was looking to perhaps inform on some of the history. I've been studying TKD history over the last few years and it's really a great endeavor for me, very enlightening.
Very interesting and informative input from David and David so far! :wink1:
Thanks, guys. My own view of things is maybe a little more... traumatic, maybe.
I see a surge of interest in the bunkai-jutsu avatar of Taekwondo along the lines of the work of Stuart Anslow (as per David H.'s post) and Simon John O'Neil (http://www.combat-tkd.com/Ctkd1/home.php), along with the recognition on the part of practitioners that the technical content of combat-effective TKD is almost entirely due to the Shotokan karate training of the majority of the original Kwan founders. (This is a simplification, I know; Hwang Kee most likely was exposed to a Japanese form of Gojo-ryu under Gogen Yamaguchi, and Yoon Pyung In (Chung Moo Kwan founder) was a student of Toyama Kanken (Shudokan) But the point is unaffected.)
The return to TKD as a severe, CQ combat art will very likely be accompanied by a rejection of the authority of the Korean national orgs who have, in effect, monopolized the TKD curriculum in order to drive TKD in the Olympic sport direction dictated by Korean nationalism in the wake of more than half a century of Japanese occupation; more and more schools will restore the Japanese katas to their syllabi, and, guided by the bunkai-jutsu criterion of effective application, will re-introduce the enormous technical legacy of TKD's Okinawan ancestry in the form of traps, locks, pins and other controlling moves, all in the strategic service of the terminating strike; conversely, the role of acrobatic high kicks will be largely eliminated, replaced by renewed interest in low or mid kicks to a controlled assailant as setup moves for finishing hand techs. Eventually this approach will become a recognize substyle of TKD, with its own name—Combat TKD, military TKD, or whatever—and associations and alliances amongst schools pursuing this line of development will form.
But whether a formal break with the WTF develops, or not, is pretty much immaterial, because the line of development I foresee already implies a fairly unequivocal parting of the ways; what I also think likely is that lines of communication between the Combat-TKD dojangs and Tang Soo Do will begin to develop that may, in time, lead to a formal healing of the rift between TSD and (the SD combat style of) TKD—maybe under the rubric of a single name. Stranger things have happened! The resulting MA community would itself be part of a larger community, comprising karate schools attempting to replicate the remarkable work of Iain Abernethy, Peter Consterdine and the other pioneers who established the British Combat Association, now one of the premier MA alliances in the world, devoted to realistic street effective applications of traditional MAs based on the enormous, underutilized technical content of those arts. The very best British-style bitter ales I've tasted were North American products, from brewpubs whose brewmasters were from the UK or had apprenticed to British master brewers, and had learned a thing or two before going it on their own, to overtake their teachers and raise the bar considerably—in Victoria, BC; in Seattle, and especially here in Columbus; and I see no reason whatever why exactly the same thing will not happen with combat-effective MA theory and experimentation in North America... anyway, that's my vision/hallucination/whatever of our future...
Thanks, guys. My own view of things is maybe a little more... traumatic, maybe.
I see a surge of interest in the bunkai-jutsu avatar of Taekwondo along the lines of the work of Stuart Anslow (as per David H.'s post) and Simon John O'Neil (http://www.combat-tkd.com/Ctkd1/home.php), along with the recognition on the part of practitioners that the technical content of combat-effective TKD is almost entirely due to the Shotokan karate training of the majority of the original Kwan founders. (This is a simplification, I know; Hwang Kee most likely was exposed to a Japanese form of Gojo-ryu under Gogen Yamaguchi, and Yoon Pyung In (Chung Moo Kwan founder) was a student of Toyama Kanken (Shudokan) But the point is unaffected.)
The return to TKD as a severe, CQ combat art will very likely be accompanied by a rejection of the authority of the Korean national orgs who have, in effect, monopolized the TKD curriculum in order to drive TKD in the Olympic sport direction dictated by Korean nationalism in the wake of more than half a century of Japanese occupation; more and more schools will restore the Japanese katas to their syllabi, and, guided by the bunkai-jutsu criterion of effective application, will re-introduce the enormous technical legacy of TKD's Okinawan ancestry in the form of traps, locks, pins and other controlling moves, all in the strategic service of the terminating strike; conversely, the role of acrobatic high kicks will be largely eliminated, replaced by renewed interest in low or mid kicks to a controlled assailant as setup moves for finishing hand techs. Eventually this approach will become a recognize substyle of TKD, with its own name—Combat TKD, military TKD, or whatever—and associations and alliances amongst schools pursuing this line of development will form.
But whether a formal break with the WTF develops, or not, is pretty much immaterial, because the line of development I foresee already implies a fairly unequivocal parting of the ways; what I also think likely is that lines of communication between the Combat-TKD dojangs and Tang Soo Do will begin to develop that may, in time, lead to a formal healing of the rift between TSD and (the SD combat style of) TKD—maybe under the rubric of a single name. Stranger things have happened! The resulting MA community would itself be part of a larger community, comprising karate schools attempting to replicate the remarkable work of Iain Abernethy, Peter Consterdine and the other pioneers who established the British Combat Association, now one of the premier MA alliances in the world, devoted to realistic street effective applications of traditional MAs based on the enormous, underutilized technical content of those arts. The very best British-style bitter ales I've tasted were North American products, from brewpubs whose brewmasters were from the UK or had apprenticed to British master brewers, and had learned a thing or two before going it on their own, to overtake their teachers and raise the bar considerably—in Victoria, BC; in Seattle, and especially here in Columbus; and I see no reason whatever why exactly the same thing will not happen with combat-effective MA theory and experimentation in North America... anyway, that's my vision/hallucination/whatever of our future...
WMKS Shogun
Green Belt
Dave- No offense taken at your take on the ATA thing, nor did I feel you were being defensive with it, just well informed.. I am actually from an ITF offshoot, but like to keep abreast of what the major TKD organizations are doing. I agree that I would love to see some sort of martial arts in the schools (or even the local recreation board doing something with martial arts the way they do soccer, basketball, and football...well...maybe not. I can see where the local recreation board might screw things up).
Exile- I can see what you have suggested happening in the next 25 years and I got the funny idea of combat TKD people teasing sport TKD people the same way many MMA'ers tease TMA'ers. Wow...TKD being on Bullshido.net for something other than a punching bag. They might have to go and change around a bunch of their forums. HAHAHAHA. How cool would that be!
Exile- I can see what you have suggested happening in the next 25 years and I got the funny idea of combat TKD people teasing sport TKD people the same way many MMA'ers tease TMA'ers. Wow...TKD being on Bullshido.net for something other than a punching bag. They might have to go and change around a bunch of their forums. HAHAHAHA. How cool would that be!
Funny thought, that! I know plenty of TKD people who think of the art in terms of applications and training for combat and whose view of sport TKD isn't very far at all from what Bullshido says about TKD as a whole.
But in all fairness, it's probably true that a fair number of sport-TKDers wouldn't want to claim that what they do is practical for use under realistic conditions. Unfortunately, it's also true that quite a few folk who learn Olympic-style competitive TKD believe that it's really a fighting art... that's one reason why it might be useful to have two different, generally recognized names for the two different activities, to minimize confusion about what the goal of the different respective technical and training approaches was...
WMKS Shogun
Green Belt
Personally, I look at it this way: Karate is a catchall for many styles of Japanese/Okinawan striking arts. Some are (more)combat effective, others are not. There are styles of karate (particularly in America, I believe) that are more sport than combat. Tae Kwon Do is the same way. We have schools and organizations and styles that are primarily A) sportive B) performance C) combat D) health. Tae Kwon Do needs to let people know by naming its styles like karate has and making them BETTER KNOWN. Sang Ahm style, Chang Hon style, Kukkiwon (Taeguk?) style, etc. It might help clarify. Just a few thoughts.
I agree, making people aware of the full palatte of possibilities in the art, and who does which of them, would be very useful for prospective students. TKD though has a significant problem with achieving this kind of useful distinction-making, namely, the disproportionate clout of KKW-style TKD (as compared, say, with the various styles of karate). The very entrenched top-down model of TKD, so different from what we see in karate, or CMA, or the Filipine arts, has I think the very unfortunate effect of promoting a much more monoclonal approach to MA activity than what you find elsewhere in Asia...
bluemtn
Senior Master
That would really be a switch!
I think that both aspects of TKD will change, with perhaps non- sport TKD getting more better known (again). Olympic TKD? I don't know... What I'd like to see, is that style stay away from being solely "sport oriented". There are quite a few that are starting to pop up that are only focused on it as a sport- which is fine, IMHO, but I think it should be labled differently... Possibly, quite a few of the "break- offs" will join together again... To me, it's still a bit uncertain as to what will happen in the future for TKD.
Shaderon
Master of Arts
I think we are going through a major change at the moment, the ITF is shakey and from what I understand the KKW is a bit shakey, if not as bad as it was... (someone else please fill in details - I'm not up on KKW politics). I know we've quit the UK-ITF because of red tape like politics and are negotiating with Canada right now for direct membership to International-ITF, so even a large org like us is now independant, if for a while.
I would personally like to see a re-naming of the styles, but I can't see the KKW agreeing to that, and as the ITF was General Choi's baby, I can't see them agreeing either so I think the names will stay the same. The divide can't stay as it is though, it's either going to lessen with more ITF style classes doing sport style sparring and sport style classes bringing in combat style techs, or it's going to widen and the two styles completely divorce from each other... this I think is less likely as the independants which seem to make up a large part of TKD are more "middle of the line" than the organisations realise. I visited a club last week which is WTF-style but punch to the face in sparring like in ITF rules, they don't do breaking and very few hand techniques but they have ITF style and WTF styel students who pop in for "a work out" and they pick up parts of their training and incorporate it. I think that eventually, in 20-30 years time, that more clubs will be indepandant, and the KKW and the ITF will be forced to shake hands, bow and compromise.
I would personally like to see a re-naming of the styles, but I can't see the KKW agreeing to that, and as the ITF was General Choi's baby, I can't see them agreeing either so I think the names will stay the same. The divide can't stay as it is though, it's either going to lessen with more ITF style classes doing sport style sparring and sport style classes bringing in combat style techs, or it's going to widen and the two styles completely divorce from each other... this I think is less likely as the independants which seem to make up a large part of TKD are more "middle of the line" than the organisations realise. I visited a club last week which is WTF-style but punch to the face in sparring like in ITF rules, they don't do breaking and very few hand techniques but they have ITF style and WTF styel students who pop in for "a work out" and they pick up parts of their training and incorporate it. I think that eventually, in 20-30 years time, that more clubs will be indepandant, and the KKW and the ITF will be forced to shake hands, bow and compromise.
Unfortunetly I have to agree with Cirdan. As long as TKD is an Olympic sport I can't see the Kukkiwon letting that slip. Sparring and the sport aspect of TKD, IMO is the money making machine for TKD. Now, i too never want Tkd to lose it's traditional roots of SD. But honestly, now a days you can't even run a school that people will come to if you haven't won a championship somewhere down the road. Again, i really don't agree with this. Actually I kind of hate the fact that TKD is going down this road but it seems true. Well at least from around where I'm from. We also have no ITF schools here so maybe thats why.
-Andew
-Andew
Shaderon
Master of Arts
I think the ITF is starting down this road, but trying to keep both aspects of the art alive. I must admit some of the nastier techniques have been glossed over so much that even the Dan ranks aren't told what the "alternative" applications of the techs are, but the techs are still there for someone with a bit of nous to figure out.
Muwubu16858
Green Belt
Taekwondo will die down as a sport, but the more traditional organizations will grow, because people are smarter thatn ever, and want to learn effective martial arts, not just kicks like WTF style sparring.
WMKS Shogun
Green Belt
I think the problem with that line of thinking is that many people do not know what type of school they are getting into. The average non-martial arts person trying to join a dojang does not care much about federations or styles. They have their own reasons for joining and often, it does not include researching whether it is a sport or traditional oriented school.
