The ball of the foot is a lot stronger than I gave it credit for

dvcochran

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Doctors go through lectures and have practical training. Some doctors go on to treat people, others go on to research medicine further and develop better practices, new procedures, and better ways of doing things.

When I'm playing video games, I will do research on what others thing the best build for my class is, I'll run my own spreadsheets, and I'll test things out, before applying them.

I think the same applies to martial arts. You listen to your master or instructor, you ask questions, you play around with things to see what works best. Other times you drill to hit stuff, or to keep from being hit by stuff.
Building spreadsheets before playing video games. Just..., wow. I thought the idea was to have fun.
 

JR 137

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Doctors go through lectures and have practical training. Some doctors go on to treat people, others go on to research medicine further and develop better practices, new procedures, and better ways of doing things.

When I'm playing video games, I will do research on what others thing the best build for my class is, I'll run my own spreadsheets, and I'll test things out, before applying them.

I think the same applies to martial arts. You listen to your master or instructor, you ask questions, you play around with things to see what works best. Other times you drill to hit stuff, or to keep from being hit by stuff.
Of course you (general you) should try stuff out during sparring. If you dont, youll get stuck in the same instinctual mindset and do the same basic instinctual stuff over and over. Youll never progress.

If you can actually perfectly land a hook kick with the ball of your foot instead of the heel or vice versa every time, or anything else for that matter, then youre sparring with the wrong people. I dont get hung up on what specific part of my body lands where. Ball of the foot vs heel isnt very relevant to me so long as I landed it and they wouldnt have gotten up if it was an actual situation.

I think sometimes we get too hung up on minor details rather than just actually going at it. At some point the mentality has to be just hit the damn thing. Thats my point.
 
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Building spreadsheets before playing video games. Just..., wow. I thought the idea was to have fun.

That is fun.

In fact, it's my favorite part, to see what's on the spreadsheet prove true.

Or when I learn that I was horribly wrong and I need a new spreadsheet. Then it's even more fun!
 
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Of course you (general you) should try stuff out during sparring. If you dont, youll get stuck in the same instinctual mindset and do the same basic instinctual stuff over and over. Youll never progress.

If you can actually perfectly land a hook kick with the ball of your foot instead of the heel or vice versa every time, or anything else for that matter, then youre sparring with the wrong people. I dont get hung up on what specific part of my body lands where. Ball of the foot vs heel isnt very relevant to me so long as I landed it and they wouldnt have gotten up if it was an actual situation.

I think sometimes we get too hung up on minor details rather than just actually going at it. At some point the mentality has to be just hit the damn thing. Thats my point.

I have a lot of opportunity to think about it on the job, and I'm at the dojang for 3-5 hours a day, 6 days a week. I have plenty of time to do both thinking on the minor details, and "hitting the damn thing."
 

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An Ax kick can have several entries. A classic Ax kick is on a straight line like a front kick with the same chamber. Instead of continuing with the power upward, it is changed to out and downward using the hips. If you need to change the angle, the same downward strike can be performed with an inside OR outside crescent entry. I see it occasionally performed as a spinning kick but I think you have to be lightening fast to pull it off effectively. Maybe if s setup is used and you get them back on their heels.
Sure, you can also enter outside in, but it's going to get caught and you'll get dumped on your head.

At least in a fighting/MMA/Muai Thai context.

I agree that it is not the best entry technique, but as a third or fourth it's totally landable. I wouldn't call it a go to but I land them in sparring sometimes.
 

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It's pretty much an inside to outside crescent with emphasis on the down force rather than the lateral swing. It's actually a landable kick because the timing is weird. The strike comes a beat late.

It definitely hurts more with the back of the heel, but it's also easier easier to get caught throwing it that way.

Axe kick can be thrown inside to outside, outside to inside, or straight.
 

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When you throw axe kick, do you worry about that your opponent may

- lift your leg over his head and throw you backward?
- kick your groin?
- sweep/hook your standing leg?
- ...

It seems to me that the risk you may take is far greater than the reward that you may obtain. All high kicks has the same issue if your opponent charges in and "runs you down".

tumblr_osxcwymssG1qd4esao1_400.gif
 
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JR 137

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When you throw axe kick, do you worry about that your opponent may

- lift your leg over his head and throw you backward?
- kick your groin?
- sweep/hook your standing leg?
- ...

It seems to me that the risk you may take is far greater than the reward that you may obtain. All high kicks has the same issue if your opponent charges in and "runs you down".

tumblr_osxcwymssG1qd4esao1_400.gif
Everything has its risks. Pick your poison.
 
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Axe kick can be thrown inside to outside, outside to inside, or straight.

I only recently discovered the straight ax kick. I knew of the straight stretch kick, and of the outside-down and inside-down kicks, but only recently learned of the straight ax kick.
 
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When you throw axe kick, do you worry about that your opponent may

- lift your leg over his head and throw you backward?
- kick your groin?
- sweep/hook your standing leg?
- ...

It seems to me that the risk you may take is far greater than the reward that you may obtain. All high kicks has the same issue if your opponent charges in and "runs you down".

tumblr_osxcwymssG1qd4esao1_400.gif

In Taekwondo, I'm not too worried about it, because that move is illegal (and the type of foul that WILL be called because it is quite an egregious break in the rules).

However, when we're not using WT rules, I'm not worried about it, either. It's very hard to get me down with a single leg. I just bounce with your flow until you give up or I can counter. From that position, I've got 2 hands free, you've got one or none, depending on how I'm grabbed. It's very easy to throw punching combos to the head (I even pull with my leg to add strength to it). You can also purposefully drop your other leg behind them and scissor-kick for the take-down.

It's not a position I want to be in, but it's not a position I'm afraid of.

This video in particular it looks like he's trying a technique he's not good at, and he over-reached with it. The strike is clumsily executed, from how slow he is to execute the kick, to how he looks twisted and off-balance already when he uses it.
 
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Everything has its risks. Pick your poison.

I think pretty much every move has some sort of counter to it. @Kung Fu Wang has lots of videos where Ability Y counters Ability X. But this always assumes that the other fighter knows Ability Y, and always ignores the possibility of Ability Z, which counters Y.

Not that there's anything wrong with these discussions. It makes sure you're aware of Y if you use X, it makes sure you know Y for if X is used on you, and it makes you think about what Z should be (if you don't know it already).
 

Kung Fu Wang

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It makes sure you're aware of Y if you use X, it makes sure you know Y for if X is used on you, and it makes you think about what Z should be (if you don't know it already).
Of you train axe kick, you also need to train

- counters to axe kick.
- counters to those counters.

Unfortunately when your opponent lifts your leg over his shoulder, there will be no counters (may be backward flip).
 
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Of you train axe kick, you also need to train

- counters to axe kick.
- counters to those counters.

Unfortunately when your opponent lifts your leg over his shoulder, there will be no counters (may be backward flip).

What you are saying is false. I've been in that position loads of times and my opponent has been more compromised than I have.
 

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I only recently discovered the straight ax kick. I knew of the straight stretch kick, and of the outside-down and inside-down kicks, but only recently learned of the straight ax kick.

When I say straight, I mean straight up the middle, not with a straight leg. It's mostly like throwing a high front snap kick and then pulling the foot down. You could possibly throw it with the leg straight, but most likely it's going to hit the target on the way UP instead of down. If the target was advancing, you could maybe do it totally straight legged, but the timing would be tricky.
 

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A lot of guys I know have terrific hook kicks. The best hook kick I've ever seen is Wallace's. Or didn't see as it smacked me upside the head too many times to count. And when I say "best" I mean the ability to hit with it against resisting opponents who actually know how to fight. One thing Wallace always used to say was "Next time you teach a first week beginner a side kick, watch it carefully, it will be a perfect hook kick." He was referring to how it's not pulled straight back but rather bends/snaps at the knee at the end of the kick. And how it goes out to target kind of straight, rather than in a looping arc.

Ball of the foot, heel, whatever, your choice. They're different in range, timing, position, and how much they tire you if you're throwing a couple hundred of them in training, different in a lot of ways, all of which you'll learn as you become a real kicker. As for power, you can knock out people with either, but you have to learn to land the suckers first. Actually landing the kick without it getting shoved up your keister or getting thrown to the ground should be your first and last priority. You have to work that puppy hard. And they are a close in kick, not a far away kick. Once you can throw it in close it is soooo difficult for your opponent to see coming.

But, man, when you develop a really good hook kick it's one of the most enjoyable things you'll find in striking.
 

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Ive done the ball of the foot roundhouse to a bag many times. It always felt awkward. Probably because Im used to using the shin with toes pointed like an instep kick. The angle it comes in at is different, targets are different, etc.

Im not a big roundhouse guy. I target the ribs and the outside of the legs with it. The shin at those targets just feels right and natural to me. Ball of the foot feels like Im forcing something and where I throw it from (in relation to my opponent) isnt the same.

Going from from instep to shin shouldnt be a difficult transition at all. Just get a few inches closer when throwing the kick. I use the shin for everything but the head. Simply because my shin isnt going to reach 99% of the time. But lets be serious - my instep barely reaches either if it reaches at all.
I don't throw a lot of roundhouses, either. I haven't really paid much attention (probably should pay more) the actual proportion of what I throw, but I do know I favor my front kick over all others, at least when actually trying to impact with power (as opposed to a distraction, etc.).
 

Gerry Seymour

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It's pretty much an inside to outside crescent with emphasis on the down force rather than the lateral swing. It's actually a landable kick because the timing is weird. The strike comes a beat late.

It definitely hurts more with the back of the heel, but it's also easier easier to get caught throwing it that way.
Inside to out crescent...which I also have never trained. :D

Seriously, the only crescent kick typically trained in NGA is outside-to-in, and most folks never use it - they train it for tests and never develop it beyond that. I don't teach it, presently, but might add it back in as students progress, if I get my own to something I consider useful.
 

Gerry Seymour

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Doctors go through lectures and have practical training. Some doctors go on to treat people, others go on to research medicine further and develop better practices, new procedures, and better ways of doing things.

When I'm playing video games, I will do research on what others thing the best build for my class is, I'll run my own spreadsheets, and I'll test things out, before applying them.

I think the same applies to martial arts. You listen to your master or instructor, you ask questions, you play around with things to see what works best. Other times you drill to hit stuff, or to keep from being hit by stuff.
And while I share your tinkering mindset, I'll just play the character and see what happens with a given build. Then I'll play with the same class again, and try a different build. I think a large part of my approach to MA is like that. I'm "intuitively analytical" about it - I try stuff, and only pay attention to differences that are big enough to get my attention.
 

Gerry Seymour

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When you throw axe kick, do you worry about that your opponent may

- lift your leg over his head and throw you backward?
- kick your groin?
- sweep/hook your standing leg?
- ...

It seems to me that the risk you may take is far greater than the reward that you may obtain. All high kicks has the same issue if your opponent charges in and "runs you down".

tumblr_osxcwymssG1qd4esao1_400.gif
That is the math on high kicks. If you throw them without the right opening, you're probably in trouble.
 

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