somebady explain me

[Manny]

Can anybody explainme what's the diference beetwen Tang Soo Do nad Tae Kwon Do? What are the similarities and waht are the diferences. Sorry if I'm don't understand but they seem to me very alike.

Manny

 

[searcher]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tang_Soo_Do

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taekwondo


Start here and then, if you have any other questions, we can help you out.

 

[Twin Fist]

tang soo do has stayed closer to it's japanese origin, and includes some chinese influenced stuff.

some people say it is the closest to the original shotokan

 

[Manny]

So TSD is the father of TKD and is less-interested in the competitive aspect. When all the kwans got unifited in the 50's-60's to create TKD TSD did not follow the trend and reminded as TSD.

Manny

 

[Gordon Nore]

tang soo do has stayed closer to it's japanese origin, and includes some chinese influenced stuff.

some people say it is the closest to the original shotokan

I've heard that also.

 

[terryl965]

tang soo do has stayed closer to it's japanese origin, and includes some chinese influenced stuff.

some people say it is the closest to the original shotokan

Yes this is it was there anything else?

 

[bluekey88]

So TSD is the father of TKD and is less-interested in the competitive aspect. When all the kwans got unifited in the 50's-60's to create TKD TSD did not follow the trend and reminded as TSD.

Manny

I wouldn't say ot os the father of TKD....an uncle perhaps.

 

[Manny]

I've doing research on internet and I've found that TKD was a result of the unification of some MA of Corea in the mid 50's. The term TKD was given by Gen.Choi and the focus in the new MA was to delete any caracteristic or name or technike of japanese or chinesse origin. TSD in some way (Moo Duk Kwan) took the desicion to not adhere to TKD and stayed as is, TSD is a Coean Martial Art who uses Chinesse and Japanesse tecnkikes.

Am' I right?

Manny

 

[bluekey88]

Yes and no. As I understand it...the TKD Kwan founders, fo rth emost part, got a lot of their training in various Japanese/okinawan arts (shotokan being the biggest contributor). I belive that the founder of TSD also claims some chinese influence from time spent in Mongolia. I'll let the TSD historians sepak to that though.

The kwan founders returned to korea and oepened their schools. ultimately there was apush to unify the kwans. Many did, the TSD section ultimately did not....so, whle related, TKD did not descend directly from TSD. Rather they split off from the same related art(s). That's why I say more like an uncle than a father.

Peace,
Erik

 

[Manny]

So TKD evolved form TSD?

Manny

 

[cdunn]

Yes and no. As I understand it...the TKD Kwan founders, fo rth emost part, got a lot of their training in various Japanese/okinawan arts (shotokan being the biggest contributor). I belive that the founder of TSD also claims some chinese influence from time spent in Mongolia. I'll let the TSD historians sepak to that though.

The kwan founders returned to korea and oepened their schools. ultimately there was apush to unify the kwans. Many did, the TSD section ultimately did not....so, whle related, TKD did not descend directly from TSD. Rather they split off from the same related art(s). That's why I say more like an uncle than a father.

Peace,
Erik

Tang Soo Do is a blanket term, much as Karate-Do is. However, while there are a few other organizations under the blanket, it is most significantly used to name the decendants of the Moo Duk Kwan and it's curriculum.

The Moo Duk Kwan was founded in 1945 by Hwang Kee, originally teaching an art named Hwa Soo Do, consisting of whatever the Kwan Jang Nim had managed to pick up during his childhood in Korea and his travels through Manchuria. Variously, these are described as being a mimicry of Taekkyon, which the Kwan Jang Nim never claimed formal training in, Yang style Tai Chi Chuan, Shaolin Long Fist, and Dham Dui Sip E Ro (Twelve Step Springing Legs), but all of these are disputed, though the traditional curriculum of the Moo Duk Kwan contains hyung named for these arts, at least one of which is now lost. In any case, Hwa Soo Do was unfamilar to and unpopular with the Korean populace, and in 1947, Hwang Kee reformulated his art to use the familiar Japanese forms, while cross training with the Chung Do Kwan, and renamed what he was teaching Tang Soo Do, his art settling in parallel to the various other Kwans, with, perhaps, more of a Chinese influence.

With this new art, readily recognized by the Koreans as a martial art after the long occupation, the Moo Duk Kwan rapidly became a large and strong organization. When the call went out to create a national sport for Korea from the martial art organizations, Hwang Kee and the Moo Duk Kwan initially joined in the effort, though this eventually fell apart, and Hwang Kee formally withdrew the Kwan from the effort of the creation of Tae Kwon Do, though many of his students stayed with the new association. This is discussed further here.

During approximately the same time frame, Kwan Jang Nim Hwang got hold of a copy of the Muyetobotongji, an old historical war manual, containing a large segment on 'Kwon bup', or fist techniques. Using this manual, he created fourteen new hyung, and renamed his art to Soo Bahk Do. That is rougly where it stands today, while a wide assortment of breakaways happened over time, creating the various small TSD organizations, clinging to the old name of the art. Each school will have its own little particulars, depending on when it broke from the Moo Duk Kwan, and how much of the latter curriculum it picked up... and what else it picked up along the way.

There is no direct line between Moo Duk Kwan Tang Soo Do and what is today called Tae Kwon Do. There have been many instances where one has influenced the other, for better or worse, but no simple way to say that one came from the other.

 

[bluekey88]

So TKD evolved form TSD?

Manny

No. TKD evolved alongside, but seperate from TSD.

 

[chrispillertkd]

No. TKD evolved alongside, but seperate from TSD.

Well, yes and no.

All of the Kwan founders originally were teaching Tang Soo or Kong Soo, both being Korean translations of "karate" either "Tang [or China] Hand" in the first instance or "Empty Hand" in the second. It is interesting to note that Tang Soo would be a reaching back to the Chinese roots of karate as opposed to Kong Soo which would've been a direct translation of the Japanese (and in post-WW II Korea things Japanese were not exactly favorable which could explain the popularity of Tang Soo vs. Kong Soo). Chung Do Kwan found Won Kuk Lee mentioned teaching Tang Soo in a 1997 Taekwon-Do Times interview. Gen Choi, founder of the Oh Do Kwan and the man who coined the term Taekwon-Do talks about teaching Tang Soo in his autobiography pre-1955. Of course, Hwang Kee is probably most famous for teaching Tang Soo at the Moo Duk Kwan specifically because he ended up not joining the Taekwon-Do movement, although many of his instructors did (hence Moo Duk Kwan TAEKWONDO).

Taekwon-Do seems to me to have direct roots in Tang Soo/karate. It was after a certain point in time that Taekwon-Do and Tang Soo Do went their separate ways. Each has evolved separately, but TKD certainly has its roots in Tang Soo, as the statements of various kwan founders make clear. So, up to a certain point they evolved together (albeit briefly, all things considered) but have spent more time apart developing along different lines, just as the ITF and WTF/Kukkiwon have developed separately.

Pax,

Chris