Sokeship Council, Grandmaster or NOT????

[Don Roley]

For some strange reason, that picture of Lou Angel and Gogen Yamaguchi reminds me of the picture of Jack Stern (do a search on martialtal) and Mas Oyama. The way it is presented, the reality of the fact that it is just two guys together, etc just have so many things in common that my alarms are going off.

 

[Don Roley]

I imagine your teacher is very familiar with what a good side kick looks like. And I am convinced that he could teach me a great many things about side kicks despite training in Tang Soo Do. How many other arts practice side kicks?

In the same vien, when I practice Naihanchi hyung and I perform a joint locking application, my 6th degree black belt Jui Jutsu professor may be able to teach me a great deal about performing that particular application.

See where I am going with this???

The art is one thing, the technique is another. No art owns a technique. Sitting in front of a panel of experts in various arts and demonstrating can be one of the most powerful experiences in your personal education in the Martial Arts.

I think you are taking a very superficial view of the martial arts. You talk as if all hits, etc are the same. They are not. Some are damaging, some are driving. Take a look at Hsing-i. From what I understand, they have something like five different types of hitting, all with the same type of fist.

Too many people think that martial arts are just the same techniques thrown together in different combinations. I thought so too. But now I see that there is some truely great variations in the arts from the ground up. If someone does not know the total of the art, how are they to judge if it is good or not. What may be "correct" in one art can be "wrong" in another. I have a hell of a time with my shoulders in my current art after the style I started out with.

Penjak Silat, Copierra, Systema, Bagua and Shotokan- are you really going to say that these example arts do not have fundemental differences in the way they approach the situation of combat and declare yourself worthy of judging them all?

I have talked about this before, and here is a greater expansion on how I feel on the matter.

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?p=377877#post377877

 

[RRouuselot]

For some strange reason, that picture of Lou Angel and Gogen Yamaguchi reminds me of the picture of Jack Stern (do a search on martialtal) and Mas Oyama. The way it is presented, the reality of the fact that it is just two guys together, etc just have so many things in common that my alarms are going off.

Me personally I am always wary of the “photo op shot”. What I like to call “shashin-do” (the way of the camera). Too often people will get a photo of themselves and some famous teacher and then claim we trained “extensively”, when the truth is they may have spent only a very short time together…..a day, hour, or even only a few minutes

 

[James Kovacich]

For some strange reason, that picture of Lou Angel and Gogen Yamaguchi reminds me of the picture of Jack Stern (do a search on martialtal) and Mas Oyama. The way it is presented, the reality of the fact that it is just two guys together, etc just have so many things in common that my alarms are going off.

Oh really? Do you relate this to Stern too???

WHERE WERE YOU IN 1963 WHEN HANSHI WAS MAKING HISTORY?

 

[James Kovacich]

I said Hanshi Angel does not have a gut, like you mentioned. Beleive it or not, Hanshi has spent a lot of time pumping iron and at that time his chest still had a good pump. I have a picture of him in a t-shirt from I think a little before that pic was taken and his chest is buffed.

Hanshi was into lifting and when he got older he may have gained weight but he has thinned out with age.

Here he is probably in his mid 60's and still packed a bit of muscle for his age.

 

[arnisador]

Oh really? Do you relate this to Stern too???

WHERE WERE YOU IN 1963 WHEN HANSHI WAS MAKING HISTORY?

You know, you might be a little too close to this subject.

 

[RRouuselot]

Oh really? Do you relate this to Stern too???

WHERE WERE YOU IN 1963 WHEN HANSHI WAS MAKING HISTORY?

I hate to ask but feel I must get clarification on this......how was he "making history" in 1963?
Well here he is in present day........

http://www.kempokarate.com/tenshi_goju.mov

anyone have any comments about his "technique"?

 

[RRouuselot]

Here is another clip from the same URL http://www.kempokarate.com/angel_bio.cfm

1)In 1987 he founded the Tenshi Goju Kai, at which time he was promoted to 10th Dan and awarded the title of Hanshi.

2)His teacher, Peter Urban, recognizes Lou Angel as the Hanshi of the Tenshi Goju Kai.

3)He was awarded the title of Founder and Head of Family by the World Head of Family Sokeship Council, the most prestigious Grand Masters Society in the world. In 1996 he was named the Grand Master of the Year.



1)Promoted by whom? Since he claims to have been in Yamaguchi’s Org. you would think he would have gotten it from there…….but then if he was a 10th dan he would be the highest rank in Yamaguchi's Organization.

2)Again, I thought Yamaguchi was his teacher…I mean that is what the photos are trying to say aren't they???......and who the hell is Urban to recognize anybody’s rank……hell he got booted out of Yamaguchi’s group for being such a screw ball.

3)“most prestigious in the world” my butt! Maybe to it’s members but to anyone that knows squat about the arts they are a JOKE.

 

[James Kovacich]

I hate to ask but feel I must get clarification on this......how was he "making history" in 1963?
Well here he is in present day........

http://www.kempokarate.com/tenshi_goju.mov

anyone have any comments about his "technique"?

He was making history because in 1963 most Americans hd not a clue about martial arts much less training in Japan.

That link didn't work but if it was a clip of his Goju it was taped in a manner that one would need to ask questions in order to get it.

I have more currrent footage and it's a safe bet that it' such better than you expect.

I'm done being polite. You are disrespecting someone close to me. You are a "hating" fool who, like your cohorts, has no chance of going down in history and for those who are in the going down as American pioneers, suck becuse you say so. YOU SUCK!

 

[RRouuselot]

１）He was making history because in 1963 most Americans hd not a clue about martial arts much less training in Japan.

2) That link didn't work but if it was a clip of his Goju it was taped in a manner that one would need to ask questions in order to get it.

3) I have more currrent footage and it's a safe bet that it' such better than you expect.

4) I'm done being polite. You are disrespecting someone close to me. You are a "hating" fool who, like your cohorts, has no chance of going down in history and for those who are in the going down as American pioneers, suck becuse you say so. YOU SUCK!

1)I still fail to see how it is “making history” since I know of quite a few people that were training here during that time and before and stayed after Angel left. Did he do something they didn’t?

2)Oh then here it is again…..go to the bottom of the page. http://www.kempokarate.com/angel_bio.cfm

3)I would hope so because the stuff I just looked at didn’t seem to be what you promote him as.

4)No, tell us what you really think…….you may want to wipe that white froth off from around your mouth too.....

 

[RRouuselot]

From the same website:

1) Hanshi Angel is a respected member of the World Head of Family Sokeship Council along with such well known members as Adriano Emperado, Helio Gracie, Wally Jay, Peter Urban, Ron Van Clief, and Jackie Chan;…………

2) In 2002 Hanshi Angel's National College of Martial Arts Int'l was recognized as the Organization of the Year by the prestigious worldwide martial arts grandmasters organization (the elite martial artists of the world),



3) In addition to Hanshi Angel's almost 50 years of Martial Arts experience, the support of the WHFSC, and his unique abilities he provides a safe haven of support and recognition to the members of the National College of Martial Arts.



4) Hanshi Angel has traveled to California to sit on the American Kenpo Karate Systems (AKKS) promotion board, which currently has a membership of over 130 schools worldwide. He was asked to do so by Professor Jeff Speakman (founder/head of the AKKS)



1)[font=&quot] [/font]I wonder if Jackie knows he is a “Soke”???…..I also wonder if Jackie even has his own style????

2)[font=&quot] [/font]“Elite martial artists of the world”……I didn’t see a lot of the people that most would consider “elite” on their list. Must be elite for something else……

3)[font=&quot] [/font]Keywords here: a safe haven of support and recognition sounds more like a crisis center of some sort. I think that translates as “acknowledgement and rank”

4)[font=&quot] [/font]“Professor” is it??? What did he get his Doctorate degree in?

 

[arnisador]

1)I wonder if Jackie knows he is a “Soke”???…..I also wonder if Jackie even has his own style????

I've heard said that some of these orgs. will induct "honorary" members without getting their consent.

Be that as it may, I'm moving to Hong Kong to study Chan Gar Kung Fu! Soon I'll be beating people with everyday implements just like Jackie Chan!

 

[arnisador]

What is the National College of Martial Arts?

 

[Cryozombie]

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[RRouuselot]

I've heard said that some of these orgs. will induct "honorary" members without getting their consent.

Be that as it may, I'm moving to Hong Kong to study Chan Gar Kung Fu! Soon I'll be beating people with everyday implements just like Jackie Chan!

Well they inducted my teacher without telling him until after the fact. Being the kind of person that thanks someone when something is given to him (whether he likes it, wants it needs it or even knows what it is) he had someone write a thank you note.

Are you really going to Hong Kong?

 

[RRouuselot]

What is the National College of Martial Arts?

It's this http://www.louangel.com/

Here something of interest name of Angel’s Org. “Tenshi” Gojukai.....

Tenshi means “Angel” in Japanese.

 

[arnisador]

Are you really going to Hong Kong?

No, just wishful thinking.

 

[Makalakumu]

When I was a young boy (11 years old), I was blessed to train with a student of this person. Master Robert Fusaro is a 7th dan. I would like to this example up for comparison in this discussion.

 

[RRouuselot]

No, just wishful thinking.

Now I'm hungry for Chinese food!

 

[RRouuselot]

When I was a young boy (11 years old), I was blessed to train with a student of this person. Master Robert Fusaro is a 7th dan. I would like to this example up for comparison in this discussion.

It would seem he still has a connection to the original folks he trained with back in the mid 1950's.....that's good.
Odd how his rank isn't bloated after a mere 50 years training.
Shouldn't he be at least a Soke by now?

Seriously though, I think this statement should be changed:

Fusaro Sensei is one of the highest ranking non - Japanese black belts in the world at 7th Dan (Degree)


To:

Fusaro Sensei is one of the highest ranking non - Japanese black belts in the world at 7th Dan (Degree) that was actually tested by a authenticated Japanese Honbu not a fake Soke Society