Pressure points

[Eazy]

Just put this in something ive got interest in thats all any info or techneques or vids would be appreciated.
Heres one i found.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3k1U2AVM4es&feature=fvw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mxEUS_as48&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTmanCg_r6k&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLiwmt45ahU&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8i3rYkiJLA&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NUr6lxaXQU&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YobAh1vUuxw&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xo_T9avaf_k&feature=more_related

 

[Chris Parker]

Hi Eazy,

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but....

Just put this in something ive got interest in thats all any info or techneques or vids would be appreciated.
Heres one i found.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmEa0FN5DhY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmEa0FN5DhY[/quote]

"Pressure Point Knock Out". This is not how someone falls when they are knocked out. The legs here retain support of the body, whereas in an actual knockout, they give way first.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3k1U2AVM4es&feature=fvw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3k1U2AVM4es&feature=fvw[/quote]

"Choson Ninja Pressure Points" Well, Greg manages to get every single point wrong (he's usually out by an inch or so, sometimes a few inches), he seems to have no structure to which language he is describing the points with (to the point where I would probably be tempted to ask him to repeat them... just to see if he can), certainly far from Japanese for a "ninjutsu" system... Not something to be followed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mxEUS_as48&feature=related

"Pressure Point Fighting" Well, this was a bit better, but really was just using mechanics (stopping the movement, and therefore absorption of the impact, by the neck and head), rather than specificly "pressure point fighting". And I'm highly doubtful that such a technique would be felt under adrenaline, you'd need to hit the base of the skull (really all he was doing) a lot harder, and then you'd still probably only rattle them for a second or so.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTmanCg_r6k&feature=related

"Pressure Point Body Technique". Okay, a straight shot down to the floating ribs, aimed down to affect the diaphragm. Cool. Some issues with the way he's doing it, but overall I've seen much worse. Really, the effect is heightened in the dojo, and you really do need far more power if you're going to try these things for real (against an adrenalised opponent).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLiwmt45ahU&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLiwmt45ahU&feature=related[/quote]

"Pressure Point Technique Against Punch". Er, no. The initial movement to push the guy away is just bad tactics (and not well done), the "stopping" hit to the head is not going to work the way he is doing it there (he will eat a very hard hit to the head), the inside of the thigh is not a "pressure point", it's just the femoral artery, and he's not going to get the best result with that kick, and the hits to the back of the head were only half of the time any more than an annoyance. Not a good one.

Oh, and for your information, a search to the site listed gives "related searches" including one Captain Chris (who I think may be the one "teaching" here?). You may want to read through this thread: http://martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=85005

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8i3rYkiJLA&feature=related

"Pressure Point Knock Out From a Punch". Not really convincing either. A shot to the point of the jaw when he's already unbalanced backwards, sure, I can see that as a knockout. But this doesn't cut it for me as the recouperation goes against all forms I've come across (hitting the back of the skull? The idea is to get oxygen back into the lungs, so you tend to work the diaphragm far more in these methods....), and the fall is again not what would be expected. He falls as he expects to fall, really.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NUr6lxaXQU&feature=related

"Pressure Point Knockout Energy Dojo". Ah, this is a common method. The trick is in the timing.... you knock them backwards slightly, so they start to lean forward to balance themselves up again. As they hit the end of their forward correction, you hit them (angling slightly up) to the base of the skull with the hand they don't see (you only tell them to prepare for a light hit, and they think it's the first one that knocks them back). If you can tell them to keep their feet where they are (for their safety!) first, you get the toppling forward effect at the end. By standing the right distance away, they will reach to catch themselves on you, overbalance, and you immediately start to tell them "okay, okay, sit down, it's okay....", which helps convince them they were "knocked out" by your "gentle strike". Gotta love these things....

Now, to balance, I teach and train what some may refer to as "pressure points" in my system as well, but the reality of it is very different to these examples. The reality is that it is just an approach to targeting, and a fair amount of power and impact is often needed to get some kind of result (especially outside of a dojo, where adrenaline is a higher factor, and the other guy doesn't know he's supposed to fall down....). Gaining a high degree of precision with targeting is one thing, these parlour tricks are less impressive when you know how they're done... and you can see how far from any real use they are.

 

[Chris Parker]

PS, I see you're modifying your post (again). If there's anything added I can comment on, I will, but my above post is in direct responce to your original (in full in the quotes, so everyone knows).

 

[Eazy]

Thanks for your constructive views i check the link you suggested.
I agree that all or most these methods would be hard to pull off to someone with trained fighting skill, But may work well this someone well on the booze when most trouble starts, Im not one for the one hit knock outs they look very dangerous, Possably kill someone i think those neck strikes. but the idea was just to direct members to that area of youtube with a good opic and maybe they find something they like then bring it back here and converse over it amoung others. Yes sorry about the upgrade i found more i liked. I really appreciate your views though.

 

[Chris Parker]

Two more? Okay, these are fun, aren't they?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YobAh1vUuxw&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YobAh1vUuxw&feature=related[/quote]

"A Pressure Point Knock Out". Ha, no it isn't. Again, no hallmarks of an actual knockout, for the main thing, the "rescussitation" is frankly bad, and this is more of a laugh than anything else.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xo_T9avaf_k&feature=more_related

"Pressure Point Knockout Neck Strikes" Well, the description itself says "clearly staged".... so I'm going to say.... no! But the guy on the left is certainly responsive, isn't he? See how much he moves even when not really being hit later in the clip? Good demo partner.

 

[Chris Parker]

It's not that they'd be "hard" to pull off, it's that they'd be impossible to pull off without a partner (attacker) who knew he was supposed to fall down... and so you know, alcohol, being a muscle relaxant, would make these "techniques" even less likely to work, as the person you tried it on would be more able to "ride" the blows, and would be moving, making it harder for you to land any of them.

 

[Drac]

I have attempted to demonstrate some of the pressure point techniques I have learned over the years on my family. NO ONE responded to them, not even my 110 lbs Niece. Some folks like myself respond to all of them.

 

[oaktree]

If you are being knocked out it's doubtful you will be able to keep your grip on someone.He also does a classic trained side break fall haha.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3k1U2AVM4es&feature=fvw

I wish I knew I would have known I was going to see 2 guys put stickers on each other ahead of time people are now wondering what kinda of sticker fetish I have...:uhohh:

Choson Ninja is one of the worse references to anything.
I heard Chinese name for the points I thought I heard Japanese and Korean for some of the points too. It would have been better if he just said it in Chinese or say the Jingluo and # instead of me having to be my own babel fish for myself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mxEU...eature=related

That is like a shock hit better than the other two but I find that hard to define as pressure point use.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTmanCg_r6k&feature=related

Basically he is describing a body shot. Not really pressure point.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLiwm...eature=related

This actually started off as a decent technique.
If you have his head there are so many possibilities The soccer kick to the groin ok not what I would do but not bad then he talks about a pressure point!! Forget the point you had his head you could have easily kneed his face or went for a choke or anything but that pressure point.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8i3rYkiJLA&feature=related

I thought he said SI-17 Tian rong near Jugular vein LI-17 Tian ding near Jugular vein. But he said SI-18 Quan Liao and LI-18 Fu tu. I doubt that will cause you to pass out. At least if you pressed the jugular vein it might cause you to black out. Haha he said Governing vessel first(which is correct) but he then changed it to Conception which is the front haha.
All I can think of is man those people are paying all that money for this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NUr6lxaXQU&feature=related

That was terrible. And the last 20 seconds of him massaging him was just creepy. If you notice he starts the demo with hair but the master hits him so hard his hair falls off.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YobAh1vUuxw&feature=related

She said "Hado ken!! right? That was terible too....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xo_T9avaf_k&feature=more_related

So many of these guys who do these knock out demos are creepy and old.

There are point that can knock a person out but they are not any mystical nonsense. They line up with Western anatomy.

I give you the Acupuncture names and tell you the English location:
CV-23 Lian Quan= basically Adam's apple
CV-24 Cheng =what boxers call the Button or the Chin
MHN-3 Yin Tang= center between the eyes
MHN-9 Tai Yang-near temple
GB-20 Feng chi= base of the skull
TB-22 He Liao=near temple superficial artery passes


I left out points I know.

 

[Eazy]

Thanks for taking so much effort for a really good view. Im impressed with you knowlege of the points I'll get them down on paper. Thankyou.

 

[oaktree]

Thanks for taking so much effort for a really good view. Im impressed with you knowlege of the points I'll get them down on paper. Thankyou.

Well since you are interested in those points..... You should learn what they are used for better to heal then to harm.

CV-23

Chinese Name Lian Quan
English Name Ridge Spring
Location: At the upper border of hyoid bone.
Point Associations:
Intersection Point of the CV & Yinwei Meridians.
Actions & Effects:
Main point for speech/mouth disorders - often used in stroke vicitims.
Salivation issues - excessive drooling or dry mouth/thirst.

CV-24

Chinese Name Cheng Jian
English Name Sauce Receptacle

Location: At the center of the mentolabial groove directly below the lip.

Point Associations:
Intersection Point of the CV, GV, LI & ST Meridians.

Actions & Effects:
Facial pain/paralysis - Bell's palsy.
Dry mouth as seen in wasting and thirsting disorders.

MHN-3

Chinese Name Yintang
English Name Hall of Seal
Location: Midway between the medial ends of the eyebrows
Actions & Effects:
Calms the spirit - insomnia, anxiety, stress.
Frontal headache.
Sinus issues - congestion, sinusitis.
Tong Ren/Tam Healing System: Eye and sinus issues, useful point for building the energy in the head during qi gong.

MHN-9

Chinese Name Taiyang
English Name Great Sun
Location: At temple, in a depression about 1 cun posterior to the midpoint between the lateral end of the eyebrow and the outer canthus of the eye.
Precautions: No Moxa.
Actions & Effects:
Temporal, one-sided a/or migraine headaches.
Eye issues - pain, swelling, redness, photophobia, visual acuity.
Local point for tootache, facial paralysis, pain, etc.
Classically mentioned in the Ode of the Jade Dragon for swelling of the breast (bleed bilaterally).
Tong Ren/Tam Healing System: Headaches, dizziness, eye and/or sinus issues. For migraines use with GB 20 and LI 4.

GB-20

Chinese Name Feng Chi
English Name Wind Pool
Location: In a depression between the upper portion of the sternocleidomastoid muscle and the trapezius, level with GV 16
Point Associations:
Intersection Point of the GB, TH, Yang Qiao & Yang Wei Meridians
Actions & Effects:
Dispel Exterior or Interior Wind - (exterior) - fever/chills, stiff neck; (internal) - paralysis, twitching, tremors, numbness, dizziness, vertigo.
All issues of the head, brain (seizures, memory, mental/neurological disorders), face, throat and sense organs (eyes, ears, nose, tongue).
Headache, especially occipital.
Eye issues.
Issues of the neck, shoulders a/or upper back - pain, weakness, stiffness.
Hypertension, especially with LV Yang Rising.
Tong Ren/Tam Healing System: Used most often in conjunction with the huatuo points of C1 and C2 to open the spinal cord, generally used to relieve neck tension.

TB-22

Chinese Name Erheliao
English Name Harmony Bone Hole

Location: Anterior and superior to TH 21 level with the root of the auricle on posterior border of hairline of the temple where superficial temporal artery passes.

Precaution</STRONG>: AA
Point Associations:
Intersection Point of the TH, SI & GB Channels

Actions & Effects:
Local Point

I would like to thank http://www.yinyanghouse.com
For supplying the points because I am to lazy to type it all.

 

[Eazy]

Dose anyone know the pressure points on a cat?.

I want to throw my energy into my cats sensory system and knock him out without touching him for practice.

I know it can be done ive seen priests do it in church, Yep they make people drop all the time it can be done.

I asked my missus if i could drop her she said she was thinking about leaving my _ss anyway, Geeze that was nice.

 

[oaktree]

Dose anyone know the pressure points on a cat?.

I want to throw my energy into my cats sensory system and knock him out without touching him for practice.

I know it can be done ive seen priests do it in church, Yep they make people drop all the time it can be done.

I asked my missus if i could drop her she said she was thinking about leaving my _ss anyway, Geeze that was nice.

http://www.heliomed.com/Images/BC-131-l.jpg

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=acupuncture+for+cat&aq=f
I do not know much about the subject. I only know it exist. I have no idea
the history,theory or training for it. I will see if someone with more qualifications can speak on behalf of it.

 

[Eazy]

LOL, I was only joking Haha you got me back, but hey thats great i give that to my missus Shes a Veterinary Surgeon. She used to work for the RSPCA.
Im sure she would be aware of this but hey its great i'll print her off one and suprise her with it.

 

[rlp271]

Any time you see the words "no-touch" and knockout in the same sentence, it's the power of suggestion. All those seminar tapes you see, and what you see in churches, is the power of suggestion at work. If you tell someone that by doing A, B will happen, enough times, they believe it on a subconscious level. To put it in vernacular, they drink the Kool-aid. I give you this video:

You have to watch it to the end, but you'll see how an untrained person, who has not done martial arts with George Dillman responds to one of Dillman's high ranking student's attempt at a no-touch knockout. This is another kiai master debunked:

This isn't to say chi/ki doesn't exist or that pressure points and acupuncture points don't exist. A parallel can be drawn between what western science has dubbed electrical impulses and what Eastern medicine has dubbed chi or ki. Interrupt the flow, and things tend to shut down. That's what happens when they use a defibrillator. They shock two bundles of nerves to stop your heart because it isn't beating correctly. The muscles then reset themselves and start beating at a normal rhythm. Saying you can actively throw your body's energy at someone else though, that's going to take a lot more convincing and empirical evidence for it to be accepted as fact. I'm rather fond of what Master Young told my instructor, "I know pressure points exist, but if I hit you hard enough, it doesn't matter if it's a pressure point or not."

 

[Josh Oakley]

I'm gonna piggy-back on ya, Chris.

Hi Eazy,

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but....

"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmEa0FN5DhY

[/url]

"Pressure Point Knock Out". This is not how someone falls when they are knocked out. The legs here retain support of the body, whereas in an actual knockout, they give way first.[/quote]

Agreed this doesn't look like a knockout. Either power of suggestion, or maybe he saw the white lights (got stunned). I'd think it possibly the latter, since he retained his grip on the gi, and he got struck on the right-side jugular. I have been white-lighted a couple of times getting hit right there.

However, even though it's possible to at least stun the guy for this setup, my main objection to this is the uke is totally relaxed and complacent... making it really easy to stun or knock out, regardless. People react differently to strikes if they're resisting or amped up. That's actually my sticking point for all of these videos.

Now, to balance, I teach and train what some may refer to as "pressure points" in my system as well, but the reality of it is very different to these examples. The reality is that it is just an approach to targeting, and a fair amount of power and impact is often needed to get some kind of result (especially outside of a dojo, where adrenaline is a higher factor, and the other guy doesn't know he's supposed to fall down....). Gaining a high degree of precision with targeting is one thing, these parlour tricks are less impressive when you know how they're done... and you can see how far from any real use they are.

And I might add, not everyone HAS all the pressure points. my wife, for instance, has never had the expected reaction to the pressure point on the top of the forearm. And not for lack of people trying. I've also had a number of students that were the same way (oddly, most of them were women). And for those to do react to pressure point strikes, I have seen people get desensitized to them, or people who have had surgery or who have cerebral pasly who don't react the same way that most people do. (Before anyone gets angry about me doing pressure points with someone with CP... that guy's a mean little bastard when we spar. Don't underestimate him or you'll go flying over his wheel chair.)

 

[Josh Oakley]

Any time you see the words "no-touch" and knockout in the same sentence, it's the power of suggestion. All those seminar tapes you see, and what you see in churches, is the power of suggestion at work. If you tell someone that by doing A, B will happen, enough times, they believe it on a subconscious level. To put it in vernacular, they drink the Kool-aid.

I know an instructor that "demonstrates" that a no touch hit can knock a person back. Then after the onlookers ask him how it worked, he reponds "it worked on you because at least a part of you believed, or wanted to believe, that it would.

He then will procede to lecture on the dangers of buying into what people tell you, and why a healthy dose of skepticism is always called for.

 

[Eazy]

Yes well ive watched the first on right though and there is alot of +s comming from a 9th dan raises concerns in conjunction as highlited with his earlier comments good find.
I'll look at the other now.

 

[Eazy]

You don't supose that is is over confidence in ones own self with the high black belt level and trainers trying to find that new unmastered skill.
I don't think the idea is stupid any more im glad i started the thread.
Ive got a new look on the pshycology of it all and i think alot of it has to do with that.
Thes masters believe within their rights that they can find that extra power or energy its like chassing the martial art Holy grail if you will.
No Battle was won without will and these masters are warriors they are mind set and knowing the power of the mind if they can learn to sync it and they may or someone may one day.
Its a mystery and while its that well who knows where it will end up but curainly nowhere if no one studies it.
we can make our selves lighter or dead weight =heavy'er thats something aswell.
Like walking on eggs its a step towards mind controll and levetation somethng eles but i think these thing all link some how.
Only masters can navigate uncarted waters i guess.
As it stands today i personaly would not go and buy a how to vid on it but maybe it has enough info to give someone the tools to forward achiving something in that direction, So not nessasarily a complete waste of money if your a martial arts resercher. Chi Wow

 

[Eazy]

Ok so now they can hone that skill the next step is to be able to make someone you don't know believe within seconds ( Maybe not that impossable) with years of practice. Ide like to see a demo one someone unsuspected of the demo even happening and see what happens.
It maybe not a case of the person not being tapped in but the person fighting against the suggestion because they know what the test is and they defy it.
So not even a normal mind but a closed mind to the suggestion.
It would be very hard to set up. but could be done if the practitionor did not have a uniform on and just looked normal get some one to stand back and film at a park or something. it would look very wierd for the resevor but you get those TV pranksters doing wierd stuff so not impossable.

 

[Eazy]

Don't give up if your interested keep honning in on it and practicing these skills keep reserching it obviously takes years maybe even longer than it takes to get a high level black belt.
Ive put some other suggestions in here on some methods of what one might try.
Im not a skilled martial artists but i still have some thoughts on this topic.