Pressure Points?

[PG_ShaolinKempoKarate23]

How effective do you think that pressure points are in a street fighting situation?

Do you see them as something to always use or depend on, or they more of a last resort?

 

[MJS]

Everything has its time and place. PP's can be very effective. However, learning how to apply them is not something that is going to happen overnight. Of course its going to be a bit more difficult to strike them when there is alot of movement, but again, it can be done. They're also going to work well against grabbing attacks, where there is slightly less movement.

Mike

 

[BlackCatBonz]

there are a few pressure points that you could work into your training that are effective, but they arent always fight stoppers.
understanding their use takes a long time and a lot of hard work but they can become a very useful tool.

 

[tshadowchaser]

I know some kempo/kenpo people may teach PP attacks but I have never studied with one. Most seem to teach basic strike, kick, block. If you are lucky enough to have a instructor that has studied PP attacks somewhere I am sure that he/she would be able to incorporate into the system what he knows.
Trouble is sometimes a little knowledge can be a bad thing also. IE: Trying to to a pp attack when a basic strike or block could accomplish more

 

[arnisador]

Don't count on them--but if a strike is going to land, it might as well land where it'll hurt. But I would not want to use a PP-only strike. Too many people are not affected, you can miss, etc.

 

[Casey_Sutherland]

there are a few pressure points that you could work into your training that are effective, but they arent always fight stoppers.
understanding their use takes a long time and a lot of hard work but they can become a very useful tool.

I agree. Doc would definatly be the one to answer this thread but IMO I beleive that specifically using PP for knocout purposes is unlikely and ties up your thought pattern while you could be more adequatly defending. That being said I beleive certain points for control and manipulation are essential.

 

[kenpoworks]

Hi Casey,
You are right about Doc, but for people who are based in Europe it might be a good idea to catch Mr. John Wards seminar at the IKC's in Holland in April 2006, John has a bead on Pressure Point Training that is great for all Kenpo practitioners.
Richie

 

[BlackCatBonz]

the quickest way for you to gain some insight into pressure points (and i hate using that term) is by studying some kind of body therapy......while this may seem like a whole lot of work just to find out where a few sensitive spots on the body are, it will serve to increase your knowledge of martial arts by leaps and bounds.
lets look at joint locks for instance......someone who has put in a lot of time studying the application of joint locks does so through a slow process of trial, error and feel. with a basic understanding of anatomy and kinesiology......the speed at which the locks are learned is much faster.

 

[DavidCC]

They can be very effective or ineffecgtive, mostly depending on the person applying the technique. Oh wait, that's true of everything :/

my Shaolin Kempo instructor has been very actively working to incorporate these techniques into what we do. You can learn more at www.kyusho.com

 

[BallistikMike]

Im the furthest guy that knows about "Pressure Points" in the sense of the Chinese Martial Arts and Meridians and things of that nature.

I like to have knowledge of "Pain Centers" things on your body that when driven into with a hard object or squeezed and twisted cause pain...lots of pain.

For example your eye ball, a nice pain center. Another would be your cheek. The soft tissue can be pinched and squeezed and then twisted to cause extreme pain. Kind of like a poor mans "Pressure Point" type of thing.

The problem with pain is that not everyone feels it the same and it is hard to rely on "Pain" as ... a ... motivator.

 

[Doc]

How effective do you think that pressure points are in a street fighting situation?

Yep!

Do you see them as something to always use or depend on, or they more of a last resort?

Neither. The mistake is "studying" pressure points. I have acupuncturists students who cannot apply them effectively in a self defense environment.

 

[DavidCC]

Im the furthest guy that knows about "Pressure Points" in the sense of the Chinese Martial Arts and Meridians and things of that nature.

I like to have knowledge of "Pain Centers" things on your body that when driven into with a hard object or squeezed and twisted cause pain...lots of pain.

For example your eye ball, a nice pain center. Another would be your cheek. The soft tissue can be pinched and squeezed and then twisted to cause extreme pain. Kind of like a poor mans "Pressure Point" type of thing.

The problem with pain is that not everyone feels it the same and it is hard to rely on "Pain" as ... a ... motivator.

Thsi is why we teach that pain compliance is not reliable. Effective use of "pressure points" does not rely on pain but on reflexive and autonomic reactions. The pain is just the icing on the cake LOL

 

[Eric Daniel]

How effective do you think that pressure points are in a street fighting situation?

Do you see them as something to always use or depend on, or they more of a last resort?

I am not sure when you should use pressure points but on the street both you and the person attacking you will have an adrenaline rush, so my question is do pressure points work on a person who has an adrenaline rush or is high or drunk? I think pressure points can but should not be used on the street. I don't think that you will have accuracy on the street because of adrenaline. With pressure points you have to be persise.

 

[Eric Daniel]

the quickest way for you to gain some insight into pressure points (and i hate using that term) is by studying some kind of body therapy......while this may seem like a whole lot of work just to find out where a few sensitive spots on the body are, it will serve to increase your knowledge of martial arts by leaps and bounds.
lets look at joint locks for instance......someone who has put in a lot of time studying the application of joint locks does so through a slow process of trial, error and feel. with a basic understanding of anatomy and kinesiology......the speed at which the locks are learned is much faster.

I will agree with you hear. I think that if you study the human body and know about it you can minipulate it and know what your doing. I know an instructor in Aiki- ju- Jutsu named Dan Angier who I have heard studied Gray's Anatomy and he knows all about the body and he incorporates that into his Martial Arts.

 

[Eric Daniel]

Don't count on them--but if a strike is going to land, it might as well land where it'll hurt. But I would not want to use a PP-only strike. Too many people are not affected, you can miss, etc.

I think it would hurt no matter where you strike a person.

 

[DavidCC]

I am not sure when you should use pressure points but on the street both you and the person attacking you will have an adrenaline rush, so my question is do pressure points work on a person who has an adrenaline rush or is high or drunk? I think pressure points can but should not be used on the street. I don't think that you will have accuracy on the street because of adrenaline. With pressure points you have to be persise.

If I can hit your arm in such a way that the muscles of your hand spasm then being drunk is not going to prevent it from doing so, even if it doesn't cross your pain threshold. For techniques that rely on the inflicted pain to make them do someting, then you are correct drugs or even a state of mind can nullify that. But there are some types of reaction that are not nullified by being oblivious to pain.

 

[Doc]

If I can hit your arm in such a way that the muscles of your hand spasm then being drunk is not going to prevent it from doing so, even if it doesn't cross your pain threshold. For techniques that rely on the inflicted pain to make them do someting, then you are correct drugs or even a state of mind can nullify that. But there are some types of reaction that are not nullified by being oblivious to pain.

Well said sir. If a person understands martial postures, and executes techniques built around an anatomical model that considers these things, than "pressure points," "nerve cavities" access is a byproduct of the execution that will take care of itself.

 

[MJS]

If I can hit your arm in such a way that the muscles of your hand spasm then being drunk is not going to prevent it from doing so, even if it doesn't cross your pain threshold. For techniques that rely on the inflicted pain to make them do someting, then you are correct drugs or even a state of mind can nullify that. But there are some types of reaction that are not nullified by being oblivious to pain.

I agree!! Even if they don't acheive the desired goal, getting some sort of reaction can be enough to buy you time to do something else.

Mike

 

[DavidCC]

I agree!! Even if they don't acheive the desired goal, getting some sort of reaction can be enough to buy you time to do something else.

Mike

we keep our exepctations low, the desired goal IS just a momentary reaction (that we can exploit).

One of our favorite sayings is: "That won't leave a mark, but it will make an impression"

 

[Eric Daniel]

I think that pressure points can be used and studied and practiced but you have to be an expert at pressure point (I think) to be able to use them on the street because when you get into a "real" fight situation there will be adrenaline that needs to come into your thought too. If the attacker has an addrenaline rush or is high on some sort of drug or is drunk, I don't think pressure points will be effective in those situations. Just because they may or may not work doesn't mean you have to not use them. "Use what you got, when you got it." You should incorporate other things into pressure point training and not always rely on them.