Memories of Masters

[SaulGoodman]

Hi everyone. I read a very interesting account recently of someone's experiences training hands on with the late great Chu Sheung Tin. I haven't had the opportunity to meet the likes of Augustine Fong/Ho Kam Ming/Leung Ting/William Cheung etc and would be fascinated to hear any anecdotes related to training with famed Wing Chun personages. Sorry that I don't have anything to start the ball rolling with!

 

[Vajramusti]

Hi everyone. I read a very interesting account recently of someone's experiences training hands on with the late great Chu Sheung Tin. I haven't had the opportunity to meet the likes of Augustine Fong/Ho Kam Ming/Leung Ting/William Cheung etc and would be fascinated to hear any anecdotes related to training with famed Wing Chun personages. Sorry that I don't have anything to start the ball rolling with!

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well- I am an old timer. I have rolled with Chu Sheung Tin, Wong Shon Leung,Victor Kan, Hawkins Cheung
and others and naturally with my sifu Augustine Fong and my Sigung Ho Kam mIng.

 

[SaulGoodman]

How did they differ in terms of personalities and their approach to teaching Joy?

 

[Vajramusti]

How did they differ in terms of personalities and their approach to teaching Joy?

How did they differ in terms of personalities and their approach to teaching Joy?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Besides Fong Sifu and Ho sigung I can't comment on the teaching approach of the others- just their results
in chi sao. Wong had lots of fights but I was surprised by his lack of structure. CST was soft. Hawkins could be sneaky. Kan had lots of power.
I gained more respect for Fong/Ho after doing chi sao with others.

FYI/fwiw- Ho Kam ming's formal teaching Macau is over 50 year's old. There was a well done 192 page commemorative book
done in Macao- a good pictorial history of wing chun in Macao. It includes lots of pictures of Ip Man's visits to
sigung"s Macao school- pictures of some of Ho's fighters and fights.And Ho and Fong doing chi sao .
Ho sifu is now 90 years old and has retired from regular teaching though he corrects his top students from time to time.

 

[SaulGoodman]

Thanks for that Joy, v interesting!

 

[KPM]

I remember doing Chi Sau with Fong Sifu, and being part of the "helper" group as well! That was too many years ago! One of Fong Sifu's teaching methods is to roll with a student....he puts the student in a bad situation, then he asks the "helper" group that is watching to make suggestions for what the student's response should be. Then the student does what was suggested the group and Fong Sifu simply flows with it and puts him/her in another bad situation! It lets the "helper" group start to analyze what is happening in Chi Sau and see what various responses might be as well as their consequences. I remember Fong Sifu as being very smooth and technically precise in his Chi Sau.

I remember training with Joy as well! Good times! One thing he would make us do is take off our shoes and walk cross the floor only by grabbing and dragging with the toes to strengthen the muscles of the feet! One time I was helping Joy do a demo at a fitness center. I had the pole and he had the knives. I did a motion where I swung too wide and hard with the pole (I didn't know anything about using the pole at the time) and Joy blocked with the knives and the end of the pole snapped and flew across the room! He just went on like he expected that to happen!

 

[SaulGoodman]

I remember doing Chi Sau with Fong Sifu, and being part of the "helper" group as well! That was too many years ago! One of Fong Sifu's teaching methods is to roll with a student....he puts the student in a bad situation, then he asks the "helper" group that is watching to make suggestions for what the student's response should be. Then the student does what was suggested the group and Fong Sifu simply flows with it and puts him/her in another bad situation! It lets the "helper" group start to analyze what is happening in Chi Sau and see what various responses might be as well as their consequences. I remember Fong Sifu as being very smooth and technically precise in his Chi Sau.

I remember training with Joy as well! Good times! One thing he would make us do is take off our shoes and walk cross the floor only by grabbing and dragging with the toes to strengthen the muscles of the feet! One time I was helping Joy do a demo at a fitness center. I had the pole and he had the knives. I did a motion where I swung too wide and hard with the pole (I didn't know anything about using the pole at the time) and Joy blocked with the knives and the end of the pole snapped and flew across the room! He just went on like he expected that to happen!

Great info KPM, I still have my complete collection of Augustine Fong Panther productions vhs tapes somewhere. I seem to recall they used tangerine dreams music in the tapes!

 

[KPM]

Great info KPM, I still have my complete collection of Augustine Fong Panther productions vhs tapes somewhere. I seem to recall they used tangerine dreams music in the tapes!

Those tapes were made at about the time I was learning. Fong's partner in most of those tapes is Dom Nguyen. He was often my training partner when I visited Tucson because we were about the same size and skill level at the time.

 

[Wing Chun Auckland]

Interesting to hear this Joy. You are very fortunate to get to cross hands with so many greats.
Interesting how CST felt soft to you. People who I have met that have rolled with him say he can't be moved and as a lineage our chi sao structure is the strongest I have felt. Mind you, there is not HKM around these parts as I have said.

We had a Augustine Fong teacher visit my club many years ago. Unfortunately, I wasn't there. The consensus was that he had good structure. Videos I have seen of HKM guys also show a good solid structure.

 

[Callen]

FYI/fwiw- Ho Kam ming's formal teaching Macau is over 50 year's old. There was a well done 192 page commemorative book
done in Macao- a good pictorial history of wing chun in Macao. It includes lots of pictures of Ip Man's visits to
sigung"s Macao school- pictures of some of Ho's fighters and fights.And Ho and Fong doing chi sao.

It is an amazing book indeed, rich with history and rare photography. I was fortunate enough to receive a signed copy during a visit to Macao.

 

[Nobody Important]

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Besides Fong Sifu and Ho sigung I can't comment on the teaching approach of the others- just their results
in chi sao. Wong had lots of fights but I was surprised by his lack of structure. CST was soft. Hawkins could be sneaky. Kan had lots of power.
I gained more respect for Fong/Ho after doing chi sao with others.

I thought this to be a very profound statement into personal experiences with other Yip Man students. Quite a bit more is being relayed here than what was written.