Israeli Arts?

[arnisador]

In this thread in the Kenpo forum mention is made of two Israeli martial arts other than Krav Maga: Panim-El-Panim, for the military, and an art that translates as "Survive" (Hiesardut?). Does anyone know anything about these systems? I could only find the following:

From http://www.uta.fi/~ag52374/faq.htm:

What is ”Kapap”?

The word is Hebrew which is abbreviated from ”Krav Panim-El-Panim” and means “simple stick fighting”. These techniques are still included in the level requirements.

 

[meni]

The kpap is used only inside the military training and it not that advanced it doesn’t have rank or level it only have some techniques of how to sub-do and attacker but not really much more
The average soldier in the Israeli army sees these arts maybe for three month out of his training!

2 the special units have there own training which as far as I know is completely something else all together but one can assume that the Israeli army is adopting the best that they can find

i hope this is helpfull

meni

 

[theneuhauser]

unless they have blossomed into their own artforms, kpap is just a part of krav maga thats taught in the military and hsardut does mean survive. during military training you get dropped off in the desert for a week with little resources and you have to "survive". that's the only hesardut that i know of.

 

[meni]

Originally posted by theneuhauser

unless they have blossomed into their own artforms, kpap is just a part of krav maga thats

is it realy the same thing i was under the impresion that they are two deffrent things comlitly one is for fun and the public the other to usa in training

 

[arnisador]

What I saw in the other thread was that Panim-el-Panim was for the military, not the public, but the web page seems to suggest otherwise--that it's a subset of Krav Maga. It's hard to do a web search on it as Panim-el-Panim is also the name of a popular student organization, apparently.

 

[Kirk]

http://www.hisardut.com/

 

[arnisador]

Originally posted by Kirk

http://www.hisardut.com/

Thanks! From that site:

In Israel it is known as Dennis Survival Ju Jitsu™ to honor its founder Dennis Hanover.



Dr. Dennis Hanover is a 9th Degree Black Belt and a veteran of four wars. He was one of the first to introduce the martial arts into Israel in the early '60s. After achieving top belt and recognition in several martial arts in the Orient, he decided to develop Hisardut® as a more applicable answer to the threats and challenges facing people in modern society. He has trained the most elite units of the Israeli military: members of the Chief of Staff Reconnaissance Unit (Sayeret Matkal), the Naval Commandos (Shayetet 13), the Israeli Anti-Terrorist Units (Yamom) and the border patrol riot suppression teams (Mishmar Hagvul). In addition, top Hisardut® instructors are actively teaching advanced levels of the system to the Israeli Internal Secret Service (Shin Beth) and the diplomatic protection and Air Marshal teams.


We teach a complete Survival System, not a martial art. The Hisardut® system is not a random collection of techniques but a comprehensive system that was designed from inception as a modern "all-dimensional" (all ranges of fighting) method of engagement and all-around survival system. The Hisardut® curriculum was developed from a systematic study of preferred elements from various martial arts, military close combat drills, police defensive tactics, and an ongoing review of actual incidents involving confrontations between police/military personnel and terrorists/criminals. A complete evaluation of these findings resulted in an integration of the best techniques. These were improved upon and combined together with specialy developed fighting tactics and taught as one system.

The Hisardut® curriculum teaches the latest know-how from the field of security, police tactics, criminal psychology, extreme condition survival, modern warfare and realistic survival fighting. Hisardut® is the only system in the world that specializes in couterterrorism and terrorism survival.

 

[arnisador]

I stumbled across some info. at a Krav Maga forum:
http://www.kravmaga.com/forum/discussion.cgi?forum=5&discussion=6

Some discussion of military vs. civilian versions:
http://www.kravmaga.com/forum/discussion.cgi?forum=5&discussion=2

 

[arnisador]

The current issue of Black Belt has an article discussing Krav Maga and its variants.

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by arnisador

In this thread in the Kenpo forum mention is made of two Israeli martial arts other than Krav Maga: Panim-El-Panim, for the military, and an art that translates as "Survive" (Hiesardut?). Does anyone know anything about these systems? I could only find the following:

From http://www.uta.fi/~ag52374/faq.htm:

I met an Israeli Army Officer in Japan that taught Krav Maga back in Israel.

Oddly enough he said he didn't care for it as a fighting art and also added he thought it was not as good as other arts out there like Karate and Judo.
I asked him why he didn't care for it since he was an instructor of the art. He said it was the "official army art" and he was required to teach it.
He added that it even though it was only moderately effective it was simply to teach, simple to remember and so the Army made it the "Official Art".

He said he was more interested in the new hand to hand course the US Marine Corps. had developed recently.

I have seen some video tape of it and it looks pretty nasty.