Is language essential to training?

[trueaspirer]

In my karate school, we are required to learn certain elements of the language, like greetings, thanks, formalities, and a lot of techniques. I suppose this fits in when your are learning a certain country's martial art, but it seems like unecessary fluff to me. I don't see how learning a foreign word for something actually helps me learn the technique. Now, don't get me wrong. I have nothing wrong against learning foreign languages; in fact, I am learning Japanese on the side just for my own purposes. But couldn't the time spent learning the language be better spent learning more moves or training?

 

[tradrockrat]

We very specifically trained in english. Learning the words in Korean, Japanesse or whatever was always explained to me as a matter of respecting the traditions and origens of your art, but in Bando we approached it from the opposite end - respecting the culture of the "adopting" student and country. It was supposed to be a practicality issue for us as well - in essence the thought was exactly as you say - time better spent learning the techniques.

I don't see anything wrong with learning the language though. when I moved on to study other styles, I was happy to learn the words and phrases of another language.

 

[mantis]

It gives some authenticity to the school. Remember, eastern martial arts are coupled with cultures that is why you will see a lot of that.
Is it essential to training? knowing enough about the culture may be. but communication regardless of the language is the most essential thing.

 

[Grenadier]

It comes down to a matter of personal preference. Some people are fine with only the English words, while others believe that the use of Japanese / Chinese / Korean adds flavor and authenticity to it.

I've always been the type to appreciate learning the language, although I'm certain that someone who is even somewhat fluent in Japanese would find so many holes in my knowledge of the language. Still, it's something that I enjoy, and sometimes I wonder if we might lose a few things when they get translated to English.

Also, it's good to excercise the mind, as well as the body.

In the end, I do believe, however, it's not an absolute necessity, and that a good teacher will still teach good martial arts regardless of the country of origin, or whether or not a language other than English is used.

 

[Andrew Green]

goals determine that. IMO understanding what is being said is important, so it makes sense to use a language everyone understands.

But, if using foreign terms accomplishes that, go for it. Just don't butcher the language like many schools seem to do

 

[Gemini]

There's more to an art than just the moves. Besides language, you have philosophy and history for example. I believe they're all important when learning an art. I've also found that when talking to other TKD practitioners, we use different terms in English, but when the korean equivelant is stated next to it, it makes it easier to understand. To your point however, we don't generally spend class time learning it. We do that above and beyond. Like anything else, the more time you spend doing it, the faster it comes to you. For instance, I'll go over language or historic aspects while I'm driving to work. Pretty hard to do front kicks doing that, eh?

 

[Henderson]

But couldn't the time spent learning the language be better spent learning more moves or training?

If you are actually spending class time studying linguistics, then I say it's not necessary. But if your class is run using Japanese (or whatever) terms and phrases that you must learn as you go along, then I am all for it. Personally, I enjoy it myself.

Respects,

Frank

 

[Kacey]

It depends on why you learn it. In ITF TKD, there are a couple of reasons for learning Korean terms; one, as you said, is to show respect for the traditions of the country the art comes from. The other is more pragmatic; for those going to international competition, a basic knowledge of the commands used provides a common ground for those who don't share a language. For example, we had a tournament attended by a large number of people from Puerto Rico; most of them didn't speak English, and most of us didn't speak Spanish, but we had enough Korean in common to negate the need for translators to start and end events, and to name tuls (patterns) during that part of the competition.

 

[Danny T]

In my karate school, we are required to learn certain elements of the language, like greetings, thanks, formalities, and a lot of techniques. I suppose this fits in when your are learning a certain country's martial art, but it seems like unecessary fluff to me. I don't see how learning a foreign word for something actually helps me learn the technique. Now, don't get me wrong. I have nothing wrong against learning foreign languages; in fact, I am learning Japanese on the side just for my own purposes. But couldn't the time spent learning the language be better spent learning more moves or training?

Good communication is key. We use some of the languages to express the different positions, kicks, punches, etc. not to learn the language but because the heads of the systems we instruct speak their languages. When training with them if we didn't know or understand what they want it would be very confusing. We also want our members to train at other school or locations if possible when traveling. If the other school uses different words it can be a bit confusing. So for the ease of all we use the different languages. We don't have our members have to learn Chinese or Thai or whatever. We simply use some key words to express key movements or positions. Like Teep for a push kick or sok for an elbow strike in Muay Thai. In Wing Chun we use Tan Sao rather than Palm showing Hand. In some cases it is easier to use the language from which the art derives. In our case it is all about what is the simplest way for all.

Danny

 

[pstarr]

I teach my classes in my native tongue but students are required to learn certain words, names of forms, and phrases in Chinese. Sometimes, understanding the name of a given form (or even a technique) in it's native tongue, be it Japanese, Korean, Chinese, or whatever - helps you better understand the nature of the form/technique.

 

[FuriousGeorge]

I think it all depends on the goal...for effective fighting, language and tradition are irrelivent. But if you are there for the cultural, philosophical and spiritual aims that many martial arts strive to impart, its important to involve oneself in the cultural aspects of the art (i.e. language, bowing, etc). When I was doing aikido, I found the cultural aspects to be integral to the art as a whole...but at straight blast gym we never bother with this stuff with the exception of the names of certain submissions and things in bjj. Ultimately its all about your aims.

 

[Brandon Fisher]

My students learn it and I am trying to learn to speak more Japanese one because I would like to Okinawa one day and the other to respect the traditions. I think its a essential part of traditional martial arts training.

 

[Carol]

One doesn't need martial arts to learn how to fight. A hardcore boxing or wrestling gym will make a damn good fighter out of just about anybody.

MA, like many Asian traditions, has a lot of structure and a lot of deep roots. In learning even a little bit about the language, one can learn a lot about many of the "why's" of the art.

I speak a bit of Japanese and have had the good fortune of going to Japan. I learned this before I started training in EPAK, and EPAK is all in English.

Has the language helped me? In my pwn art, maybe a little bit. It has helped me quite a bit in understanding the arts in general.

I don't think that much class time should be dedicated to this though. Using phrases in the original language would be acceptable to me. Drilling on the language during class would not.

 

[Brandon Fisher]

I will use the terminology as I am teaching a technique to leading drills. This helps the students remember after awhile and faster if I have them repeat it to me.

 

[matt.m]

I think in the overall scheme of things it comes down to two things:
1. Just because I know what cijak means does not mean I will perform better in an all out street fight.

2. I know what cijak means does mean that I will be able to follow the instruction during a tae kwon do class or tournament.

I think knowing basic terms helps the practitioner to take ownership of the art they are taking. I also believe it is good, as in Judo japanese is the language of Judo. This means that no matter where you are on the planet every judo player knows exactly what you are talking about.

 

[mrhnau]

I think it can be useful. Is it -needed-? no. However, suppose you want to train with someone in the original country? Or with someone from another country who does not have english as a primary language? I imagine you could still teach, but you still have the same language barrier, this time just a barrier of lack of english rather than lack of language of origin.

I suppose there might be a problem of translation too, unless all phrases can be translated literally or with a full consensus.

Really, you won't be required to learn a full language. If you are moderately intellegent you should not have problems learning a few technique names or phrases. It can't really hurt, where there might be problems if you don't, unless you don't plan on ever interacting with people of other languages.

 

[stone_dragone]

I think that it is important to learn as much of the language of the nation of origin as possible if a student is interested in more than just the physical aspect. Often times, the word used in the native tongue has more connotation and a deeper meaning than the direct translation that we use, and can be used to convey more than we can in our own tongue.

For example, the japanese word "Rei" is often used as the command for "Bow" but has a deeper meaning of "respect" or "heart" or "propriety" and other conotations. This could be a vehicle to discuss and teach greater lessons that may not be directly connected with combat.

My two cents...

 

[Henderson]

For example, the japanese word "Rei" is often used as the command for "Bow" but has a deeper meaning of "respect" or "heart" or "propriety" and other conotations. This could be a vehicle to discuss and teach greater lessons that may not be directly connected with combat.

My two cents...

That's a perfect example.

 

[Brandon Fisher]

Sure is a good example

 

[IcemanSK]

Do I think its estential to learn an art, no. But I do think it adds richness to the experience of learning the art. Learning the techniques & commands in the "native tongue" also adds a larger degree of portability to your ability in that art. I've noticed this especially with Judo practioners. Most seem know the throws in Japanese. This helps them communicate in a common language about a technique.

Whereas with us Taekwondo folks, there can be 5 different English translations for the same block. I've been to too many seminars where someone has said, "When you said "X" block, where you talking about this?" (Then the person demonstrates a block). So, I think common language adds richness & helps in communication of the art.