Hakko-ryu & Kamishinkan Jujutsu similarities & differences

[jujutsu_indonesia]

my sensei asked about the possibilities of video exchanges between us, is it possible? We are very interested to see your techniques, and maybe you be interested in seeing ours. After all, the written words are very limited media. Whaddya think?

 

[Garner Train]

Well the art I study is Nippon Kobudo Kamishin Ryu. The actual "mainline" art is a Chinese/Korean lineaged art likened to Hapkido. One of the past head-families, Albert Church (Hobbs Shihan also trained with Church sensei before training with the Okuyama family), also trained in Nihon Jujutsu with several Jujutsu instructors. One of the last Jujutsu arts Church sensei trained in was Hakko Ryu under Shodai-Soke, Ryuho Okuyama. Church sensei added a systematic Jujutsu curricullum to parrallel the inherited art to train the students in formal Jujutsu waza.
Kamishin Ryu Jujutsu, is likened to most Jujutsu of Daito Ryu descent and is structured similarly to Hakko Ryu. Kamishin Ryu has Shodan waza lists through Yondan, Godan/Shihan waza up through the Shihan levels. Upper Shihan levels (after Godan) are mainly deeper principles underlaying all of the waza. Striking plays an important part of the waza (usually the waza is taught without the strikes and then strikes layered on after the waza is learned).
Kamishin Ryu Jujutsu is taught in the same way as Hakko Ryu (and the other Daito lineaged Jujutsu arts as well), sitting, one sitting, one standing and both standing and rear techniques.
We teach Henka (different variations) Oyo (different applications) of the techniques to further our "self defense" possibilities.
For more information on Kamishin Ryu go to www.kamishinryu.net

Denny, I will be leaving tonight to go to Nicaragua (sp?) for one week on a missions trip. I will be back next Monday PM. I will check the thread when I get back, If you want you can let the thread "die" and revive it in a week, either way I look forward to sharing.

I liked what you said but I was there teaching aikijujitsu for Mr Church when he added the Jujitsu. I watched him go down the list and change it to Kamishin terms. He took the Hakkoryu list and changed the terms, Hakko Dori to Kami Dori, Takagami-Hand mirror to Hand flower. Church practiced Hakkoryu under Soke Okuyama but he never obtained his Shihan grade (His teaching license). also was there when Sensei Hobbs and Sensei Annesi trained with Mr. Church along with many others.

 

[geezer]

I liked what you said but I was there teaching aikijujitsu for Mr Church when he added the Jujitsu. I watched him go down the list and change it to Kamishin terms. He took the Hakkoryu list and changed the terms, Hakko Dori to Kami Dori, Takagami-Hand mirror to Hand flower. Church practiced Hakkoryu under Soke Okuyama but he never obtained his Shihan grade (His teaching license). also was there when Sensei Hobbs and Sensei Annesi trained with Mr. Church along with many others.

Not to change the subject from Hakkoryu Garner, but why don't you contribute to the (currently inactive) Wing Chun forum here? With your varied background and long experience over all these years it would be interesting to get your input.

BTW you never did send me back the shoes I left at your studio in Saginaw about 37 years ago. But that's OK, for the last 30 years I've worked out in tennis shoes!

 

[Flying Crane]

I realize this is a very old thread and all, but am I the only one who suspects @jujutsu_indonesia and @kamishinkan might be the same person carrying out both sides of the conversation?

 

[geezer]

I realize this is a very old thread and all, but am I the only one who suspects @jujutsu_indonesia and @kamishinkan might be the same person carrying out both sides of the conversation?

It's possible... but not sure what the point was, though. Maybe publicity? Back in 2006 things were different on this forum. People sometimes tried to use them to gain exposure.

 

[Flying Crane]

It's possible... but not sure what the point was, though. Maybe publicity? Back in 2006 things were different on this forum. People sometimes tried to use them to gain exposure.

It reads kind of like those commercials for Renewal by Anderson Windows, trying to sell new windows in your home. They try to play it like a real conversation but it is so painfully obvious that it is completely scripted, they are a little difficult to watch. Feels like I am being sold something by someone who assumes I am an idiot.

They won’t get any traction that way.

 

[_Simon_]

I realize this is a very old thread and all, but am I the only one who suspects @jujutsu_indonesia and @kamishinkan might be the same person carrying out both sides of the conversation?

You know what, you're right it really does!

 

[_Simon_]

You know what, you're right it really does!

Good point mate I agree.