Defense v. multiple opponents

[Cyriacus]

We do this drill a lot and everyone one makes the same mistake they actually try to fight. This never works in a Dojo setting where you can't actually hurt your partner. So here is how we do it.

Step 1. Don't use too man kicks. Use them to get in or as your attacker is retreating
Step 2. Pick opponent #1 and use him as a shield form #2
Step 3. As #3 circles grab or push #1 and into #3 preferably trip him at the same time.
Step 4. Attack #2 and use him as a shield for #3
Then Repeat throwing #2 into number #1

The key is to always have one guy on the ground or crashing into one of your attackers giving you time to fight only one guy at a time. The trips and throws would equate to your polk to the eyes, chops, groin kicks everything you would do in the street but can't at the dojo. What I mean by this if you perform one of these deadly techniques the opponent would fall to the ground for a little bit before recovery.

Tips
1. Use your punches to setup your grabs and trips.
2. Always fight forward using your angles.
3. Use one guy as a shield.
4. Don't fight any one opponent for more than a couple of seconds else no one else is coming after you.
5. Balance is your friend take theirs from them.

P.S. If you fight like this you can keep it up for a while, while your opponents get tired off falling down and standing up.

And if all Three Attackers come in at the same time, in a Triangular Formation?
One in Front, and One on Both Sides, perhaps with the one on the Right slightly back.
It isnt a hard Formation to assume before attacking, and circumvents many different Tactics.
Just offering some Perspective for potential Retrospect.
Im not going to state anything of responses to such a situation just yet.

 

[mango.man]

When our former school did this as part of BB testing, it was pretty much a "no holds barred" type part of the test. It seemed to me that the most effective way people dealt with the scenario was to grab hold of the smallest of the 3 (hopefully you are larger than him or her) and use that use that person as a shield against the other 2. Basically, grab and hug and hold on. Then try your best to keep the others in a straight line to you so you are not being attacked from multiple angles at once. This will allow you to focus as much energy as you can on 1 attacker at a time but whatever you do, don't let go of the smallest one once you are able to grab hold.

 

[Tony49]

And if all Three Attackers come in at the same time, in a Triangular Formation?
One in Front, and One on Both Sides, perhaps with the one on the Right slightly back.
It isnt a hard Formation to assume before attacking, and circumvents many different Tactics.
Just offering some Perspective for potential Retrospect.
Im not going to state anything of responses to such a situation just yet.

This is actually the best scenario, you run straight towards the Front of the Triangle grab the guy spin him into the other two and then keep on running. Remember their inherently is a problem with this drill nobody actually wants to hurt anyone. So if you as the defender are willing to break that rule your attackers who are try to play with in the rule will normally back off. Remember in the street their are no rules. (On a side note doing a diving somersault in between two of the the points of the triangle also works great.) I have done this a few times to the surprise of everyone because by the time they realize what happen I am out the dojo door running down the street. Of course, I come back to a lot of confused faces and my instructor shaking his head and saying under his breath "f**k and Tony, next"

 

[Cyriacus]

This is actually the best scenario, you run straight towards the Front of the Triangle grab the guy spin him into the other two and then keep on running. Remember their inherently is a problem with this drill nobody actually wants to hurt anyone. So if you as the defender or will to break that rule your attackers who are try to play with in the rule will normally back off. Remember in the street their are no rules. (On a side note doing a diving somersault in between two of the the points of the triangle also works great.) I have done this a few times to the surprise of everyone because by the time they realize what happen I am out the dojo door running down the street. Of course, I come back to a lot of confused faces and my instructor shaking his head and saying under his breath "f**k and Tony, next"

In theory. However, this assumes you go through the other Person before the Other Two get at you. And this isnt an excercise in Escaping, its an exercise in Sparring.
It allows the Attackers to Cluster Together better. And grabbing people isnt easy when your being simultaneously struck.

 

[Tony49]

In theory. However, this assumes you go through the other Person before the Other Two get at you. And this isnt an excercise in Escaping, its an exercise in Sparring.
It allows the Attackers to Cluster Together better. And grabbing people isnt easy when your being simultaneously struck.

Its an exercise in what every you wanted in to be. Turn around and fight if you want now your back to what I explain first. (In the street, I won't be turning around until I found a suitable weapon garbage can, my belt, stick, book etc...) Yes, they cluster better together but don't wait for them to close. If they do then you need to know a duck under, pull that move off along with the spin and your back to my first explanation. No matter how the attackers attack you need to get back to my first explanation otherwise you just become a punching bag or a pin cushion if one of the attackers has a knife. I have tried two people no weapon and one with knife. I think I am going to have to try all three with knives know that sounds like fun.

 

[Cyriacus]

Its an exercise in what every you wanted in to be. Turn around and fight if you want now your back to what I explain first. (In the street, I won't be turning around until I found a suitable weapon garbage can, my belt, stick, book etc...) Yes, they cluster better together but don't wait for them to close. If they do then you need to know a duck under, pull that move off along with the spin and your back to my first explanation. No matter how the attackers attack you need to get back to my first explanation otherwise you just become a punching bag or a pin cushion if one of the attackers has a knife. I have tried two people no weapon and one with knife. I think I am going to have to try all three with knives know that sounds like fun.

Im aware of this - Im mainly referring to the fact that these People arent going to move in a Linear Line towards you - Ducking can be met with Upward Punches, or Swinging Punches. And 1-2 People can be dealt with, given sufficient time, certainly. But its the Third that could screw you a bit.
Just to ensure were on the same page, im familiar with these kinds of Tactics - Im specifically directing this to the Applicable Likelyhood of being forced, due to position, to enter a Constant Exchange with more than one Person.
Would it not be better to Plan for such a possibility, rather than just think youll keep them seperate, and it wont happen? (Im not saying you said that, so much as using that as a generalisation)
If they Cluster together, some Creative Retreating will work.
But the chances of an attempt at closing in in a less Clustered, more Pinning manner is too great to be neglected.
Ducking will work to a point, but it could also lean you right into a Hooked Punch.
And a Shield can only be pointed in one Direction.
Now ill grant, it is somewhat an Exercise in what you want. But assuming youll always be able to just run away from Multiple Attackers leads me back to "Would it not be better to Plan for such a possibility, rather than just think youll keep them seperate, and it wont happen? (Im not saying you said that, so much as using that as a generalisation)"

Training for the Possibility of both Possible Outcomes can surely have more benefits than Psychologically being in a State of Retreat continually.

 

[andyjeffries]

I agree with one of the earlier posters, that this is really just a test of fighting spirit as the situation against multiple equally-skilled-as-you opponents will always have the odds stacked against you so in reality you won't win, particularly when they're padded and you're not.

That said, I just wanted to remind you of a bit of basic psychology - if you hit them hard to try to put them out of the fight (leaving you 2v1) then they (the hit one and the others) may increase the power they put in. It's basic thinking that "OK, if you're going to hit that hard, so will I" - and in the heat of the moment they'll forget they're padded and 3v1.

So, just remember it's a test of fighting spirit and cool-headedness, don't try to batter each one (without doing permanent damage) or you may find it gets much harder than it could have been...

Treat it as a technical game - how well can you position yourself and move in order to reduce the effectiveness of the 3 as much as possible.

 

[StudentCarl]

I agree with one of the earlier posters, that this is really just a test of fighting spirit as the situation against multiple equally-skilled-as-you opponents will always have the odds stacked against you so in reality you won't win, particularly when they're padded and you're not.

That said, I just wanted to remind you of a bit of basic psychology - if you hit them hard to try to put them out of the fight (leaving you 2v1) then they (the hit one and the others) may increase the power they put in. It's basic thinking that "OK, if you're going to hit that hard, so will I" - and in the heat of the moment they'll forget they're padded and 3v1.

So, just remember it's a test of fighting spirit and cool-headedness, don't try to batter each one (without doing permanent damage) or you may find it gets much harder than it could have been...

Treat it as a technical game - how well can you position yourself and move in order to reduce the effectiveness of the 3 as much as possible.

I've been thinking that too--this is a spirit/keep your cool/mobility test, but it may not be appropriate to escalate the force level. That also makes it a fair test of using force proportional to what I encounter, though I realize that in the real world a 3:1 assault is clear threat of great bodily harm and justifies the same from me.

 

[Tony49]

Dam I wrote a great response and it I accidentally closed the tab (had multiple tabs opened) In a nut shell you can't get stuck in the center and if you do you have to get out. Best way I have fun is to spin one attacker into the center if they have surrounded you completely. If you can throw, push, trip that attacker into one if not both. Know your back to line them up. As for a duck under if done correctly bending at knees not waist. An upper cut has just about as much chance as hitting you as when you were standing. As for swing punches that is what the duck under works the best. For straight you don't even have to duck. Remember, you have to step at a 45. If you fight with Olymipic TKD stance then keep your distance and line them up most will 3 men attackers using Olymipic TKD stance will give each attacker a chance to attack before trying to attack themselves because kicks take more room then punches, knees, elbows and grabs.

Just remember have fun and don't get stuck in the center.

 

[Cyriacus]

Dam I wrote a great response and it I accidentally closed the tab (had multiple tabs opened) In a nut shell you can't get stuck in the center and if you do you have to get out. Best way I have fun is to spin one attacker into the center if they have surrounded you completely. If you can throw, push, trip that attacker into one if not both. Know your back to line them up. As for a duck under if done correctly bending at knees not waist. An upper cut has just about as much chance as hitting you as when you were standing. As for swing punches that is what the duck under works the best. For straight you don't even have to duck. Remember, you have to step at a 45. If you fight with Olymipic TKD stance then keep your distance and line them up most will 3 men attackers using Olymipic TKD stance will give each attacker a chance to attack before trying to attack themselves because kicks take more room then punches, knees, elbows and grabs.

Just remember have fun and don't get stuck in the center.

Then I think we can Agree that being in the Center for any Reason can be Haphazard; And that a Remotely Decent Formation could put you there.
Since there are many possibilities for being Grabbed, attack with Unsynchronised Strikes, or "Jammed", if you were that that Position, it may not end to well without being Mentally Prepared to Trade Blows for even just a couple of Seconds, whilst you search for an Exit.