Lifetime Supporting Member
- Jul 2, 2006
- Reaction score
- Northern VA
#1 I have looked into the laws here and guess what, they dont always work with in the confines of a fight. There is written law, and there is street law, guess which one goes down more?
All the same , you dont have to retreat here, you have to demonstrate that your life was in peril or you had good reason to. A DA for Fredricksberg,is one of our students, we do go into the legalities in conversations,and you have some good defenses if your not the attacker in Va. He say's you might actually have a good defense if you killed a guy who takes a punch at you (He nor I morally advocate that, but..) you can say, " As a martial artist, I am aware that a single punch to the head can kill or mentally damage me, I was scarred and feared for my life, that is why I hit him in the throat and upended him onto his head." (ANd there are thousands of cases to point to where a punch has killed, it can be considerd deadly force.
You've overly simplified this. Yes -- a single punch may indeed kill. You'd still need to justify your reasonable belief that THIS particular punch from this particular person was reasonably likely to kill you or cause grievious bodily harm. You might not be tried for criminal assault -- but you may very well face civil trial. And I guarantee that the attorney sueing you will paint the picture of a hard working, law abiding, all around good guy who sent money home to momma every week -- even if we're talking about Dirty Mike from the Pagans MC or an MS gang banger. And, even though many Virginia Commonwealth's Attorneys aren't likely to charge in clear self defense cases -- that doesn't mean none do. Nor does it mean that another state's prosecutors won't.
(FYI... your argument is a lot stronger if you spell names correctly...)
I have seen people knifed and brutally stomped, I once brutally stomped a POS who tried to stick a screwdriver in me. Guess what? Not a cop in sight, non to protect my then 15 year old ***, and non to arrest me for stomping on the back of his head and neck, till I could no longer do so.
Fact of life... Cops are seldom there before they're needed. Law enforcement is a REACTIVE body. And you're lucky that your victim in the above incident didn't file a police report naming you as an attacker. Anytime you have to use serious force against someone, be smart. YOU be the one to call the cops and tell your side first.
#2 Disagreement is cool,it leads to learning and understanding.
Call me a kid, do it in person, not sitting behind your computer screen.
Don't act like a testosterone-overloaded 16 or 17 year old, and you won't be treated like one. From various of his posts -- I've got a feeling Tellner has every right to call me a kid... and I kind of suspect I've got a few years on you.
#3 Much of what I said is MY OPINION, I do feel violent thugs should be killed if they engage you, no you cant keep stomping on their heads after they are down, someone see's you and you might be going to jail, but if you break his center and you are throwing him to the street, I say do it in a way that has a high probability of killing him, on his head or lower back across the knee.
If he has a weapon, he gets knifed or shot if I can deploy the weapon , I will kill him dead.
You're entitled to opinions. Have you failed to notice all the news reports about people losing jobs or being denied diplomas or college admission based on internet postings? Imagine how the things you've said in this thread would end up looking like were you defending the amount of force you used to defend yourself, in either criminal or civil court.
#4 Sensei does go over what is legal, but also what is realistic, and what you can do if you so choose to. Jujutsu is an art of war, not a sport, yes our society clashes with many of the tenants of it, but it's a personal choice to obey or not, I choose not to obey stupid laws, that can get me dead and my children fatherless, when I can get away with it.
If you choose not to obey "stupid laws" without the understanding to protect yourself afterwards... you may very well leave your children effectively fatherless and penniless when you get locked up and sued. Realistic self defense in the US today goes beyond the physical techniques and must move into legal justifications and ramifications.
#5 (On Sensei shooting a perp in the line of duty)
Yes, he say's he did have some remorse over it, but he said he would do it again, the guy was aiming at him as he stuck his head out the fire escape window, The guy could have just run down the alley, with his loot, but for some reason, he chose to point a gun at a cop, so Dave put a round through his Brain.
HIS LAYWER, a real one, not you pontificating and going to Google, told him " Better you killed him, he's only worth 1-2 million if we lose the case, but in a wheelchair, he's worth $25-30million." Yes it went to civil trial, that happens alot to cops,BTW. Families of low lifes trying to get some $$$ from their dead rejects carcassis pretty common, the families of the West LA Shootout Gunmen tried to.
Nobody challenged the shooting. However, the mindset that "I guess I should just kill someone rather than maim them" is not the lesson to learn. Note that your sensei was faced with a very imminent threat of severe bodily harm to him, as well as to others. He took the best course of action he could in those circumstances, in keeping with his duty as an officer. If you get jumped somewhere, defend yourself against a guy whose only weapon was his hands, and stomp him into the ground... You're gonna have a lot tougher time explaining that.
#6 I guess I am wrong about declairing bankruptcy, Good I learned something, I still think it's better to kill him then to maim him, when he was out to do the same to you, I aint talking about killing some guy for starting a shoving match or because of an insult, I am talking about those who stick a gun in your face, who take an unprovoked swing at your head with a pipe or their fist, someone who outweighs you by 50#s, someone who is clearly from a thugish subculture or a gangbanger, or they have to be attacking an inocent or one of mine. I chose to live and keep my body parts and ability to move under my own power
Somebody sticks a gun in your face, run. If you can't run... give the what they want. Gun disarms are largely fantasy. If there's any other option, don't try to fight a guy with a gun unless you've got one of your own. (Know what the pro's will tell you is the best thing to bring to a gun fight? Another, bigger gun!)
But nobody here has said anything amounting to "never use lethal force." You have been strongly encouraged to make sure you understand the legal elements of using force, especially lethal force, so that you can successfully defend your actions. If you can't articulate why you reasonably believed that you were facing imminent, serious bodily harm or death, you simply cannot justify using lethal force.
Some of the people here have great martial arts exp. but make you wonder if they have ever been involved with street violence (and I'm not saying you have to have been, if not your lucky, but underinformed.), there are gangs that will sodomize you after they beat you, just because they can, they might even curb your teeth or knees, they might rape your woman right in front of you. (That was in the news lately) And if you survive this, that is the heartbreak and sleepless nights I would worry about, not the life of some lowlife who made his choice to be a wolf and attack the sheep, screw him if he runs into a sheepdog.
IMO The laws are written by Politicians, who are largely lawyers, not those who have been involved with violence,lawyers are out for lawyers, the more laws and conditions they put into things like this, the more money the bastards make. If most Politicians were builders, there would be concrete and strip malls and no trees or grasslands, it's a scam that we all have to put up with, for now.
At this point... this convinces me that I'm probably wasting my time with this. I wish you a safe life...