Continuing Evolution after SGM Parker's passing

[Kalicombat]

Mr. Parsons,
If you read my post earlier in this thread, I stated that I wasted alot of time looking for shortcuts as far as kenpo was concerned. My time with the IKCA was one of those endeavors, as well as my other NON-EPAK kenpo quests. I am looking for the truth in kenpo, and am finding it in EPAK, under the IKKO, and its founder Mr. Conatser. I have been at the martial arts since I was 9 years old; I'll be 39 in a few weeks.
I have my reasons for my opinion regarding the IKCA. I have attended one of their camps, and I'll stay with my opinion. I wish Id have been able to train in EPAK back when I started training, but there was no access at that time. But, like someone once said, its not where you start, but where you finish.
All your other points of debate are valid, as well as subjective to each of our experiences. Feel free to email me and we can continue this debate in a more candid environment.

Yours in Kenpo,
Gary Catherman
[email protected]

 

[Fastmover]

You're way off base Gary. He put the techniques on tape because no one else had, they are simply the blueprint for the system, and not all encompassing. They are as rudimentary and fundamental as it gets.

Parker put what he thought was important in the II books, but left much material out, either undiscovered at the time, or, left for discovery within the framework of the system by the individuals practicing it. Why Mr. Parker didn't do videos is beyond me, from what I've heard, he talked about doing it all the time and never got to it.

DarK LorD

From what I heard Mr. Parker was none too happy about the tapes put
out by Tatum. It was after all his lifes work and he or his family should
have received the benefits from it. One question, did Tatum ask Parker
to do the tapes?

 

[Dark Kenpo Lord]

From what I heard Mr. Parker was none too happy about the tapes put
out by Tatum. It was after all his lifes work and he or his family should
have received the benefits from it. One question, did Tatum ask Parker
to do the tapes?

You know, I've heard this Sob Story so many times, and from Ed Jr. as well. Mr. Parker not only had the physical and monetary means to do it, but also the time, why he didn't is uncertain,why not ask his son? Panther Productions came to Tatum, not the other way around. No, Tatum did not ask Parker, he'd already left the IKKA and was on his own in 87. Larry didn't do the technique tapes until 93, once again, leaving more than ample time for ANYONE to do what he did, THEY DIDN'T. Any more silly questions?

DarK LorD

 

[Fastmover]

You know, I've heard this Sob Story so many times, and from Ed Jr. as well. Mr. Parker not only had the physical and monetary means to do it, but also the time, why he didn't is uncertain,why not ask his son? Panther Productions came to Tatum, not the other way around. No, Tatum did not ask Parker, he'd already left the IKKA and was on his own in 87. Larry didn't do the technique tapes until 93, once again, leaving more than ample time for ANYONE to do what he did, THEY DIDN'T. Any more silly questions?

DarK LorD

Ive never heard Ed Jr. was upset with the tapes.....this confirms what Ive
heard about the Parkers not being happy with Tatum tapes. Its amazing
that folks ride the Parker wave to serve their purpose and to validate their
cause. Anything for a buck!

So just to understand you correctly Tatum didnt give his old instructor the
respect of asking to put Parkers work on Tape? So the technique
tapes were not done until 93, did the Parker family give their approval?
I guess not................screw the Parker's! WOW! I cant believe you said
they should stop their sobbing, thats a little across the line.

 

[Dark Kenpo Lord]

Ive never heard Ed Jr. was upset with the tapes.....this confirms what Ive
heard about the Parkers not being happy with Tatum tapes. Its amazing
that folks ride the Parker wave to serve their purpose and to validate their
cause. Anything for a buck!

So just to understand you correctly Tatum didnt give his old instructor the
respect of asking to put Parkers work on Tape? So the technique
tapes were not done until 93, did the Parker family give their approval?
I guess not................screw the Parker's! WOW! I cant believe you said
they should stop their sobbing, thats a little across the line.

Yes, a sob story, Parker had every available means and oppurtunity to do the tapes, he didn't, why don't you ask Mr. Parker about it, oh yea, he's dead. It's a moot point John, and those tapes paved the way for literally thousands of Kenpoists to learn the forms and basics of Kenpo, why is that a problem for YOU, you have nothing to do with EPAK anyway, and I certainly don't see you sending money to Mrs. Parker and family to teach Kenpo, or do you?

DarK LorD

 

[Fastmover]

Yes, a sob story, Parker had every available means and oppurtunity to do the tapes, he didn't, why don't you ask Mr. Parker about it, oh yea, he's dead. It's a moot point John, and those tapes paved the way for literally thousands of Kenpoists to learn the forms and basics of Kenpo, why is that a problem for YOU, you have nothing to do with EPAK anyway, and I certainly don't see you sending money to Mrs. Parker and family to teach Kenpo, or do you?

DarK LorD

Yes Clyde for many years I did support and belong to the IKKA.

 

[Dark Kenpo Lord]

Yes Clyde for many years I did support and belong to the IKKA.

Are you still paying them? If not, I'd like to know why not. You're teaching the fruit of Mr. Parker's and Mr. Mills' labors as well, with your logic, you should still be paying them, and everyone else that's benefitted over the years should be as well.

DarK LorD

 

[Fastmover]

Are you still paying them? If not, I'd like to know why not. You're teaching the fruit of Mr. Parker's and Mr. Mills' labors as well, with your logic, you should still be paying them, and everyone else that's benefitted over the years should be as well.

DarK LorD

Just trying to confirm some things that Ive heard. I never meant to say
that folks couldnt make a living, but I was curious what level of respect
and credit was given in their making.

I will give you credit for one thing.........you certainly support and give full
respect to your instructor. Even more the time you spend supporting what
you believe is impressive and shows a lot of compassion. I value the folks
that have passed on their knowledge to me and give them full credit
in pointing me in the right direction. I feel lucky at times......as Im sure
you do.

Take Care

 

[bdparsons]

Mr. Parsons,
If you read my post earlier in this thread, I stated that I wasted alot of time looking for shortcuts as far as kenpo was concerned. My time with the IKCA was one of those endeavors, as well as my other NON-EPAK kenpo quests. I am looking for the truth in kenpo, and am finding it in EPAK, under the IKKO, and its founder Mr. Conatser. I have been at the martial arts since I was 9 years old; I'll be 39 in a few weeks.
I have my reasons for my opinion regarding the IKCA. I have attended one of their camps, and I'll stay with my opinion. I wish Id have been able to train in EPAK back when I started training, but there was no access at that time. But, like someone once said, its not where you start, but where you finish.
All your other points of debate are valid, as well as subjective to each of our experiences. Feel free to email me and we can continue this debate in a more candid environment.

Yours in Kenpo,
Gary Catherman
[email protected]

Mr. Catherman,

I'm sorry your experience with the IKCA is not what you had hoped (sincerely, no sarcasm intended). Some things work for some, not for others. I'm glad you found a Kenpo home, make the most of it, but allow others to do the same. I've learned over the years not to judge a practitioner just because I don't care for the patch on their chest. If you would like to hold a civil discussion on Kenpo or other martial arts via email, I'd be more than willing. You can reach me at [email protected]

Respects,
Bill Parsons
Triangle Kenpo Institute

 

[GAB]

DarK LorD

I see what you are saying, now that you put a correct time frame on the events.

I thought Al Tracy had some input into this regarding making the tapes.
On Al's website, he takes some credit, he also gives a lot of credit to the man who made the tapes.

Why would MLT go to Ed Jr.? Ed Jr was just that a Junior, as I understand it he was not interested in his fathers occupation, other then a son of a person who was very talented and probably heard about it so many times he was tired of it.

I have heard different stories, from different groups as to the amount of involvement Ed Jr. had in AK. It could have been one story or the other as far as I am concerned.

I don't see where you said screw the Parker's, This is where I get into trouble, saying something, then someone adding different words to my story.

You ask a question, the answer comes back as, to kill the messenger attitude.

I was surprised when I got the Encyclopedia of Kenpo, it was/is actually written and published by Junior but the cover say's created and written by Ed
Parker. Not erroneous but deceptive.

When you get into the book you understand that it was or so Junior say's something his father was working on and he finished it (junior).
I think it was well done and a tribute to Sr. (but the major work that went into it was by Jr.)
He published it in 1992, his father passed away in 1990.

Ed Jr. did not have any of the Kata's or techniques put into a video (he had time) so the thing is, business.

I believe the tape's are also a tribute to SGMEP, the fact that MLT did them is just a testimony as to the knowledge he had and others did not.

I believe one of the reasons (young and old) people who want to go into the Martial Arts is, for health reasons.
I would say that MLT is pretty healthy looking, and a good example of what others think, they would like to look like, if they took up the art.

Kind of like looking at a body builder and not seeing the perfect specimen and then believing what they preach, yet don't practice.

Just a few of my observations of late.:idunno:

Regards, Gary