Combat Vets and Self Defense
- Thread starter SFC JeffJ
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green meanie
Master Black Belt
Desert Storm Veteran. US Marines (1987 - 1991) 
5
56Chevyguy
Guest
Urah ! What was your MOS? My primary MOS was 0311 infantry rifleman and my secondary MOS was 8541 Scout/Sniper. Semper Fi...
green meanie said:Desert Storm Veteran. US Marines (1987 - 1991)
green meanie
Master Black Belt
56Chevyguy said:
Nice! My primary was 0331 Machinegunner / my secondary was 8151 Security Forces. Semper Fi Bro!
Cruentus
Grandmaster
JeffJ said:
I am not a combat vet, but I have worked with enough vets to have an informed opinion.
With the ones that have actually been in action, I find that they have a better understanding of the realities of violence, and what it actually takes to defend oneself then most people. I also find that they have more of a "sheepdog" mentality vs. the "sheep" mentality of the rest of the public. They tend to take responsability for the defense of themselves and the innocent around them. They know what it means to put their lives on the line whether it be for other people, their country, or their cause. This is not to say that people of other professions can't have these qualities, but it is to the credit of the vets out there that these qualities are more prevelent among them then the general public.
Veterans are a pleasure to work with and train, in my opinion; I respect our vets greatly.
Paul
OP
OP
Thanks for the comments Paul.
For me personally, I think it helps my SD training immensely. Before combat, I thought SD would be like the fights I had been in growing up, and even the brawls I had been in while in the Army. Have a much better understanding of the end results of true violence now.
As far as it's affected my training, well, for one, I have a much better understanding how I personally react to the huge ammounts of stress sudden violence puts on your mind and body. I also know that trained reflexes DO kick in. Now, for the most part, instead of battle drills when threatened, I respond with a more or less appropriate technique. MOUT training and experience was really a factor for this, everything happens so quickly there.
Do I think this makes combat vets better at SD than everyone else? No, I think me, and others just have a different perspective, and maybe a slight edge.
Jeff
For me personally, I think it helps my SD training immensely. Before combat, I thought SD would be like the fights I had been in growing up, and even the brawls I had been in while in the Army. Have a much better understanding of the end results of true violence now.
As far as it's affected my training, well, for one, I have a much better understanding how I personally react to the huge ammounts of stress sudden violence puts on your mind and body. I also know that trained reflexes DO kick in. Now, for the most part, instead of battle drills when threatened, I respond with a more or less appropriate technique. MOUT training and experience was really a factor for this, everything happens so quickly there.
Do I think this makes combat vets better at SD than everyone else? No, I think me, and others just have a different perspective, and maybe a slight edge.
Jeff
Cruentus
Grandmaster
The mention of combat stress is very important in my opinion.
It is the aspect of combat stress and it's effects on the mind and body that give vets (as well as others who have been in very violent encounters) a better understanding of what will work in combat under stress. Often times, what actually works is far more limited then what most people train.
We think that aspect of combat stress is very important, which is why we do scenario's and such; we want to induce a fair amount of stress and force the participant to perform under that stress so that they will have at least an idea of what they will be facing in a fight.
Paul
It is the aspect of combat stress and it's effects on the mind and body that give vets (as well as others who have been in very violent encounters) a better understanding of what will work in combat under stress. Often times, what actually works is far more limited then what most people train.
We think that aspect of combat stress is very important, which is why we do scenario's and such; we want to induce a fair amount of stress and force the participant to perform under that stress so that they will have at least an idea of what they will be facing in a fight.
Paul
5
56Chevyguy
Guest
Well,
I don't know if it makes me any different than anyone else, but I appreciate what it takes to "win" in combat. Whether it's a self-defense situtation on the street or a firefight, it takes training, mental attitude, brains, and sometimes a little luck. A unit going into combat can't commit to the engagement slightly, they have to commit themselves 100% to the battle. Same thing on the street. We all know that if assaulted or faced with a fight, we should try to avoid it if possible. HOWEVER! if forced into it then we do whatever is necessary to win. Leaving the scene bruised and bloodied is better than leaving the scene in a bag. I think new people, whether they are martial artists or military, spend time worrying about what they would do in real combat. I think that if you have spent enough time, blood, sweat, and tears in training, you will just react.
I have trained with martial artists who think that training only a couple of hours a week will adequately prepare them for combat. In my opinion, unless our martial art is just a sport to us or for fitness, then we have to be very dedicated to our training to be able to use our art on the street. I don't know if that mindset comes from being a vet or if it's just common sense.
jb
I don't know if it makes me any different than anyone else, but I appreciate what it takes to "win" in combat. Whether it's a self-defense situtation on the street or a firefight, it takes training, mental attitude, brains, and sometimes a little luck. A unit going into combat can't commit to the engagement slightly, they have to commit themselves 100% to the battle. Same thing on the street. We all know that if assaulted or faced with a fight, we should try to avoid it if possible. HOWEVER! if forced into it then we do whatever is necessary to win. Leaving the scene bruised and bloodied is better than leaving the scene in a bag. I think new people, whether they are martial artists or military, spend time worrying about what they would do in real combat. I think that if you have spent enough time, blood, sweat, and tears in training, you will just react.
I have trained with martial artists who think that training only a couple of hours a week will adequately prepare them for combat. In my opinion, unless our martial art is just a sport to us or for fitness, then we have to be very dedicated to our training to be able to use our art on the street. I don't know if that mindset comes from being a vet or if it's just common sense.
jb
OP
OP
Tulisan said:
Exactly why so much of the training in the military adds stressors. They know they really can't approximate the stress of real combat, so they add other stressors. Schools like Ranger, SFAS, BUD/S, SERE, and others will deprive you of sleep, food, and anything else they can to increase stress levels of the participants. They aren't perfect, but are a pretty good indicator of how a soldier/sailor/marine/airman will react in combat situations.
I've said it before, but add as much stress to your SD training as possible. Sure, have the impact a little harder and faster, but there are a lot of other ways to do it as well. Running, calesthenics, and other things are great ways to increase stess levels. Run two miles hard and fast, then have uke grab or punch you. Still won't be combat level stress, but it'll be a heck of a lot closer.
Jeff
OP
OP
56Chevyguy said:
A little of both I think. It's that commitment to get what's nessecary done and knowing how to let training take over is invaluable in a SD situation, just like in combat.
Can people get these lessons other ways? Yes. Many instuctors teach it. I think it just really gets into the core of a combat vet in ways that can't be just taught.
Jeff
i think being in the military and being a martial artest give u an edge that ur civilian counterpart dont have u know when to turn it on and when not to and u know how more to control the force than they do but also u know how to use in as in muscle memery and stuff im a avtive duty marine in iraq right now there are several of us here thet grapple for fun and compertition and we love it umm so the marine corp has cam up in the last few years with something called mcmap theve taken sever things from different fighting styles and put them to gether and that what they teach now u go by belts too the first belt is a tan beld so u wear it with ur cammy uniform it goes to grey belt to green belt then green belt instructor which can train up to green belt then u have to go to a nother class for the instructor and stuff it goes then to brown belt i believe and then to black belt and black belt instructor course where u get ur *** beat to get it so its cool that they teach u some stuff here in the military but some thing i wouldnt use and stuff sorry if i got off the subject and if my spelling is bad
Tulisan said:
I find this true of Combat Vets and also civilians. If they have seen action, somehow some where, they understand more.
No disrespect to veterans who have not seen action, nor to civilians who have not either.
I just think it gives a different starting point for people to reference from.
Now as a group, I agree that Combat Vets are more likely to have seen that action and react and learn in a manner for their own self defense.
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