BajiQuan in Detail

[Baji87]

My name's Eric, I'm 21, from America, and I live and work in China, in Shandong Province. I'll be here a while.

Now, I wish I could ask the locals, but at the moment my Chinese is extremely poor, and the ones I do manage to communicate with know nothing or next to it. Something I keep hearing is that Bajiquan is practised by very few people. And those that DO know, well, even if their conversational English is good, there knowledge of Wushu is not usually wholly and completely transferable. And yes, I am working on improving my Chinese as well.

I have been looking for a Martial Art that was right for me, and I am pretty much convinced with what I've seen and read. Of course experience and time will be the only true tell, but before I decide who to learn from, I have to (want to) understand what my options are...something I am currently mixed up with.

I've read ALL the pages I could (yes, i've read bajimen...), but all the information is very generalized and I am looking for a bit of detail and history.

I understand that Bajiquan is an Art Form, and in that Art Form there are different styles and families. I've heard of the Wu, Huo, and Liu families (and many listed on Bajimen with no actual details about the different styles).

I really want to know, if anyone does:

1) What are all the different styles/families/branches/etc of Bajiquan existing in and outside of China today?

2) Where are they from and where are they mostly practised today?

3) What similarities do they share and what makes them different?

4) What are the most traditional of these styles? And what's your definition of traditional?

5) The Forms: It's my understanding that there are 20 (?) standard forms that are shared by all branches of Bajiquan...is this accurate? If so, what are they all?

6) What is BajiQuan's relation to other Martial Arts, especially TaijiQuan?

Also, I've heard people from the Liu family style say in their history of Baji that Wu Zhong had no descendants, and yet I've also heard many others say the the man by the name of Wu Lian Zhi in Mencun, Hebei (Baji's birthplace, apparently) who is the head of the Wu Family Style, is Wu Zhong lineage (in fact i've even seen a provided family tree of it)...Does anyone know for sure?

I hope that any of you might be able to assist my curiosity...I know I ask a lot...and I'm sure I'll have more questions, too...but I thought that the Martial Arts Forums would be the best place for this post.

Thanks,

Eric

 

[Taijiguy]

1) What are all the different styles/families/branches/etc of Bajiquan existing in and outside of China today?

I'm not really sure. I know of Huo, Liu, Wu, Ma, and a couple other groups in and outside of China though I'm not sure what they'd be classified as.

2) Where are they from and where are they mostly practised today?

There's Liu (I assume "Liu" refers to Liu Yung Qiao's students... the Wu Tan group) and Huo style baji quan here in Ohio. I'm not sure where my teacher's classmates are in mainland China. It's been awhile since I've seen him, and my Chinese wasn't good enough to ask at the time Wu Tan schools are in Taiwan, and spread in various places throughout the world. I know there's another baji quan group in Germany (don't know their classification). If you want info on mainland Chinese baji quan, the only specific group I can name off the top of my head is in Tianjin... and Wu Lian Zhai's group that you already named. I'd also check out the famous Cang County. The Tianjin group is pretty interesting as they seem to incorporate some nice kicking from Chui (sp?) Jiao and have an interesting baji blend. Very fast and strong. They also seem to have a more extensive "jin gang ba shi" system than other groups (seperate forms and so on beside the typical line drills)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPZ9qKk--Us&mode=related&search=

3) What similarities do they share and what makes them different?

What they seem to have in common is that snappy power generation, lots of close in fighting, good chin na, throws, body checks, elbows, etc. Lots of line drills, conditioning and stance work. All seem to use a short horse stance, at least in certain applications, though some like use will use a longer stances too (like long fist). Most seem to practice pigua too as the two were once part of the same style, though it's level of integration will be different depending on the lineage. Some will have it existing as line drills and maybe some integrated forms (like Liu Yun Qiao's system) while others will teach it as a completely separate more extensive art with it's own forms, etc.

4) What are the most traditional of these styles? And what's your definition of traditional?

They're all traditional with the exception of the modern wushu form which seems to basically be a watered down version of the da baji form. There's not much too it, and it's pretty easy to spot.

5) The Forms: It's my understanding that there are 20 (?) standard forms that are shared by all branches of Bajiquan...is this accurate? If so, what are they all?

I'm not sure about the "20" standard forms... the main ones I've noticed are xiao jia baji quan, da jia baji quan, jin gang ba shi (eight techniques done as line drills), and liu de kai (a series of six techniques done as line drills). I've also seen weapons training for staff, sword, lance (long spear/pole) and spear. Those last too might be the same, just with a different length weapon, I'm not sure.

6) What is BajiQuan's relation to other Martial Arts, especially TaijiQuan?

I think there had been some contact between Chen villiage and at least one baji quan teacher before (historically). Of course, like lots of other Chinese martial artists, most all baji quan people I've come across practiced some kind of taiji too, often Chen style.