Acorn and The Obamasiah

[Twin Fist]

lemme get this right.

Acorn us comitting voter fraud across the country
Acorn is undeniably a democrat outfit
Obama was acorn LAWYER for crying out loud

why is ANYONE even seriously considering voting for obama when he is linked to terrorists, radicals, socialists, and now voter fraud?

 

[elder999]

lemme get this right.

Acorn us comitting voter fraud across the country
Acorn is undeniably a democrat outfit
Obama was acorn LAWYER for crying out loud

why is ANYONE even seriously considering voting for obama when he is linked to terrorists, radicals, socialists, and now voter fraud?

Because none of it matters?

Because he's apparently not associated with war crime, fascism, big brother style orwellian control, secrecy, imperialism and economic devastation? Unlike the current administration, which, for better or worse, Mr. McCain is completely associated with?

Sorry, I'm voting for McCain, but I'll be very surprised if he wins.Because of the economy, and an unfocused campaign, but also because of 8 years of Bush/Republican mismanagement.

 

[Ray]

why is ANYONE even seriously considering voting for obama when he is linked to terrorists, radicals, socialists, and now voter fraud?

Oddly enough, a co-worker of my wife was making fun of how McCain's arms don't seem to move right...my wife asked her "do you know how they got that way?" Of course not. I've seen and heard many dumb things from people (on both sides) demonstrating a lack of knowledge on both of the candidates plans.

I've asked people have you read (whoever's) tax plan, have you looked at their record, do they do as they've promised in other campaigns, etc. American voters (in general) mustn't be spending time to research. Did we ever?

And are we sure we've got the straight poop on acorn?

 

[grydth]

lemme get this right.

Acorn us comitting voter fraud across the country
Acorn is undeniably a democrat outfit
Obama was acorn LAWYER for crying out loud

why is ANYONE even seriously considering voting for obama when he is linked to terrorists, radicals, socialists, and now voter fraud?

So now being a lawyer who appears in a legal matter for someone or something is sufficient to damn one by association? What a wonderful way to render the 5th, 6th and 14th Amendments utterly meaningless... and bring along that totalitarian state you would have us believe the other side threatens us with.

Soon, perhaps, we can also condemn doctors, nurses, teachers, and anyone else who associates in any way with or renders services to an Enemy of the People.

"Obamasiah" sounds cute, except when its actually being used to demonize someone. Aren't we tired of this endless and savage ad hominem smog? How can some complain the public is ignorant of the real background and issues - - - with all of this trash in the air obscuring them?

Oh by the way, I myself have represented some folks you'd think were pretty awful - - - did it in the US Army. Followed that up by years as a military prosecutor, where I helped repopulate Leavenworth. Followed that up by a decade of representing injured working folks trying to get any benefits... how heartwarming it was a few weeks back to see one of the worst cannibal companies getting billions out of the bailout.

So, Forum Admin... you can toss me off the forum for having associated with and provided legal services to all sorts of folks that some people may not like.

If that's not unAmerican, what is?

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Can I wait until after I cash my bailout check? I don't have enough coke (a cola) in me to reach the ban button just now.

 

[arnisador]

why is ANYONE even seriously considering voting for obama when he is linked to terrorists, radicals, socialists, and now voter fraud?

Given that he is winning, you have to wonder if maybe some of the things you believe about him are not quite true.

 

[Nolerama]

Could you toss me off the forum for also associating with free-thinkers, radicals, "terrorists", and ACORN?

I think TF should read up on the issue with ACORN's voter registration fraud cases. Personally, I think they can tighten their process a little bit. I do think they do a wonderful thing for low-income families who face gentrification, and educate and give insight on municipal/tax opportunities that they wouldn't get otherwise.

Whining about ACORN being a bad organization, and then associating that with Obama is like saying that Anheuser-Busch is a terrible company for selling to InBev (foreign conglomerate) and that McCain hates American industry (his wife is an Anheuser-Busch heiress) by association. Seeing that kind of thing on here leads me to believe someone's drinking political campaign Kool-Aid.

That's a very wide-reaching statement to pass judgement on. At first, I thought it was a very bad haiku.

Oh yeah, McCain can't raise his arms over his head due to injuries sustained during the Vietnam War, where he was a POW.

 

[MBuzzy]

To tell you the truth....I'm not voting for McCain BECAUSE of the smears and the campaign tactics. Maybe it is because I'm in a battleground state, it seems that others don't have it this bad....but I am DISGUSTED by the behavior of the candidates....both of them to tell the truth. But honestly, I have a great deal more respect for Obama. Based on the fact that his plans make sense to me - his PLANS, meaning the written versions - and his attitude. During debates, Obama seems to me (who is independent and was undecided for a long time) to be much more focused on HIS stance and what HE will do. While honestly, all I saw from McCain was "Obama does this" Obama does that" and my favorite "In 1985, I did this" "In 1973 I did that." All I care about is what a single candidate will do.

Linking candidates to people who do bad things, in my opinion, is just another one of these smokescreen tactics. There is no one ALIVE who has never associated with some less than desirable element. If you are a lawyer, it will happen A LOT. In the case of ACORN, you might as well condemn the census bureau too, because they do the EXACT SAME THING. When you employ a lot of people to do menial tasks, they will cheat. There is no way around it.

 

[Ray]

All I care about is what a single candidate will do.

There is no better indicator of what a person will do than what he/she has done in the past.

When you employ a lot of people to do menial tasks, they will cheat. There is no way around it.

What? You expect people to cheat? And there's no way around people not honoring their end of the bargain? Can I ask: do you cheat or is it just other people?

 

[Nolerama]

There is no better indicator of what a person will do than what he/she has done in the past.

I'm sure EVERYBODY in McCain's camp is completely innocent of associating with unsavory individuals. Yeah, that's good logic right there.

What? You expect people to cheat? And there's no way around people not honoring their end of the bargain? Can I ask: do you cheat or is it just other people?

I think that's actually an axiom in one of my small business classes: menial employees steal. It makes sense for a guy working for a group to register voters to "double dip" and make a little more money by writing down more names and numbers than he actually got. Who's going to care? He's just a menial worker, probably working per-signature. Actually, problems like this exist on both sides of the partisan line.

The point of this debate lies with associating political candidates with "unscrupulous" people and making a judgment call on their personality based on that association.

If I bought a house legitimately from a company that doesn't hire Union in a non-Union town, does that make me an evil man? If I buy from Wal-Mart, knowing full-well that they've helped outsource thousands of American jobs, does that make me an ultimately bad person (I'll agree: buying from Wal-Mart to me is unethical)? No. It doesn't.

So I declare this "debate," based on insinuation, speculation, and lazy research to be over. I think arguing over character flaw should be in another thread.

 

[MBuzzy]

There is no better indicator of what a person will do than what he/she has done in the past.

Maybe I'm more idealistic than that. Especially in the world of politics, I fully disagree. For a politician, what you've done in the past means nothing....what your party line is and who is currently sending you a check is what makes the difference.

By saying that there is no better indicator of what a person will do than what they have done in the past eliminates the possibility for anyone to ever change. And in both cases, neither of them have a voting record that a) matches their current policies and plans and b) is consistent throughout their entire career....and I wouldn't expect it to be. Things change. On top of that, the vast majority of the time, the information you are being fed is skewed. When a person votes one way over another, it is seldom included as to why they voted that way (voting down a seemingly good bill because of consequences or all of those lovely extra clauses that are added in to "sure thing" bills) and the opposing votes that they made (didn't vote for this, but did for that).

What? You expect people to cheat? And there's no way around people not honoring their end of the bargain? Can I ask: do you cheat or is it just other people?

In general, no, but I try to be realistic about it. Now, I don't expect everyone to cheat in any situation, but when you provide little oversight, pay based on performance, and pay little.....cheating should be expected from at least some people. Do you think that a fast food employee never cuts corners? If you don't pay people much and don't treat them well, they have very little corporate loyalty and no reason to do a good job and be honest. There are plenty of studies to back this up. People don't have as much integrity as most people think they do.

 

[MBuzzy]

why is ANYONE even seriously considering voting for obama when he is linked to terrorists, radicals, socialists, and now voter fraud?

As for the statement in question....I really find it hard to believe that there are so many people out there who think that "the other candidate" is so evil. In general, they both have the best interests of the country at heart. No one is trying to run us into the ground.

I would think that it is far worse if a person categorically dismissed anyone who had ever been accused of any unsavory actions.....

 

[Archangel M]

Unless its Sarah Palin right?

Not to accuse anybody here of it, but it really seems THAT all depends on who you like in the first place. Ignore ACORN and some questionable ties to possible (ill give that) domestic terrorists, or at least dont dig too deep...we have troopergate to concentrate on.

 

[Twin Fist]

Given that he is winning, you have to wonder if maybe some of the things you believe about him are not quite true.

no, i KNOW, dont think, i KNOW that every single thign i said is true, i also know the media is so busy .........giving him the Lewinsky and telling the public that none of that matters that the public is, in large numbers believing that it doesnt matter

and it OUGHT to.

 

[Twin Fist]

Whining about ACORN being a bad organization, and then associating that with Obama is like saying that Anheuser-Busch is a terrible company for selling to InBev (foreign conglomerate) and that McCain hates American industry (his wife is an Anheuser-Busch heiress) by association. Seeing that kind of thing on here leads me to believe someone's drinking political campaign Kool-Aid.

.

BZZZZZZZZZT
wrong answer, thanks for playing

Anheuser-Busch isnt intimately involved int he election process

Acorn IS

apples and oranges there buddy

Acorn is a democratic group

they are comitting RAMPANT voter fraud

or do you dispute that?

If it was reversed, and it was a conservative group turning in literally 100's of thousands of FAKE voter registrations (some of which were already used to vote early) you know full well you and the press would be up in arms about it

 

[Twin Fist]

The point of this debate lies with associating political candidates with "unscrupulous" people and making a judgment call on their personality based on that association.

They are working, cheating and lying ON BEHALF OF OBAMA

doesnt that ring a bell?

or is partisanship more important than truth these days(like it was in 1998 as I recall)?

 

[Twin Fist]

As for the statement in question....I really find it hard to believe that there are so many people out there who think that "the other candidate" is so evil. In general, they both have the best interests of the country at heart. No one is trying to run us into the ground.

I would think that it is far worse if a person categorically dismissed anyone who had ever been accused of any unsavory actions.....

Obama might not be evil, but he is a lot of things, like a socialist, a pathological liar, most likely a racist, and a FRIEND of domestic terrorists.

those things cannot be denied.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

And the McCain/Palin group supports continued abuse of power for personal reasons, continuing a policy of wars of expansion, reversal of roe-vs-wade, and seperationalist groups.

Bottom line here is, does he know, did he encourage, etc.

As to voting fraud, Florida 2000, Ohio 2004.

All 4 of em suck dude.

 

[Twin Fist]

actually Bob, Palin's hubby was in the seperatist group, Palin wasnt

While she is pro-life, she has never tried to legislate that, nor has McCain,so they are not liekly to try abd reverse RvW, and even if their court Apoointees did overturn it, that wouldnt make it illegal

Do you REALLY thnk Iraq was a war of expansion? cuz we havnt tried to keep it or anything, so i wonder what thats based on?

 

[Bob Hubbard]

There is also the email issue with her which included forwarding state business to her seperationalist hubby, who she knew was involved, etc. I don't want to turn this into another Palin thread so I'll just refer the full thing to the other threads where we already hashed out alot on her.

As Iraq being part of a war of expansion, there's a number of threads here that go into detail on that topic. Been a while so I don't have specific links handy.

My biggest point is, all 4 aren't "clean". Obama's spending 10x what McCain is, and is only able to eek out a few extra points. Logically, he should be burying him. But it's a fight.

So, don't think people aren't noticing the issues. It's just that most either aren't aware of or don't give a credit to the thirds. If people were given a real choice, and aware of it, I think things would be different. Of course, most of those candidates also come with concerns....which leaves me looking at the full pallate and wondering how we sank so low that this is all we can field to choose from.

I'm writing in Steve Jobs. Screw it.