Abortion pills for everyone...including predators...unintended consequences...
- Thread starter billc
- Start date
That's a load of bull Bill. It is not an abortion pill. It is post coital contraception and it is only effective for 3 days after unprotected intercourse. We have been able to buy them from pharmacies in Australia for the last ten years. The sky didn't fall and the sun still comes up. :asian:
Of course, that article doesn't quite get it right, Bill. "Plan B" isn't necessarily for the "pregnant," as much as it is for the penetrated. If the patient already knows that they're pregnant, then it's too late to resort to that pill....furthermore, any man who commits the crime of penetrating an eleven year old girl :burn: probably doesn't care too much about forcing her to take a potentially fatal over the counter drug........
.......or a surefire fatal overdose of aspirin..................(30g)
.......or a surefire fatal overdose of Benadryl................(1800mg-this is about 50 pills)
........or pouring drain cleaner down her throat..............
........or just smothering her to death, strangling her, stabbing her, or burying her alive. Tie weights to her ankles and toss her off a bridge.
You get the idea. The article's stupid.
Well, he could-but that's really just a little less bovine feces than the article. I mean, really, c'mon. From the article:
:lfao: I just don't understand how you can keep swallowing this crap, then vomiting it up here as though it were the Gospels....:lfao:
This argument at least has some basis in logic and fact.
What's funny is that people that don't understand the pill or how it functions keep calling it an abortion pill.
It stops a pregnancy from happening, but a fertilized and implanted egg is not affected at all. It's also interesting to mention that Ron Paul, a Libertarian, a conservative, and a man who actually does know for a fact what the pill does. Also someone against abortion completely is a supporter of the morning after pill and the availability of it.
Seriously, use of birth control is intelligent. And it cuts down seriously on unwanted pregnancy. Which cuts down even more on abortions. So how is it a bad thing? You can't stop people from having sex. So at least do it safely, and have a backup plan that doesn't involve ending the life of a developing fetus. I'm surprised you don't support this concept.
It stops a pregnancy from happening, but a fertilized and implanted egg is not affected at all. It's also interesting to mention that Ron Paul, a Libertarian, a conservative, and a man who actually does know for a fact what the pill does. Also someone against abortion completely is a supporter of the morning after pill and the availability of it.
Seriously, use of birth control is intelligent. And it cuts down seriously on unwanted pregnancy. Which cuts down even more on abortions. So how is it a bad thing? You can't stop people from having sex. So at least do it safely, and have a backup plan that doesn't involve ending the life of a developing fetus. I'm surprised you don't support this concept.
There is indeed some merit to this argument. At such a young age, nobody has the capacity to make life changing decisions for themselves. Birth control availability I can see, but not abortion. Still, keep in mind that morning after pill is not abortion though. It's a fine line here.
Cirdan
Senior Master
Same here in Norway, it is also available at groceries and gas stations. We get an occational rumble from below, but the ground hasn`t split apart and swallowed us all.. yet.
The focus of the article is about sexual predators using the easy availability of this over the counter pill to hide their crimes. There was a gym teacher at my high school who was having sex with two, maybe more, obviously underage cheerleaders. This pill makes it easier for them to hide this kind of activity. What about molestation in a family? This pill makes it easier.
As a medical Professional, is it wise to allow girls as young as 12 or 13, or younger to be able to buy this pill without a trained professional overseeing the process? Shouldn't someone know if they are having sex with a boyfriend at that age?
As a medical Professional, is it wise to allow girls as young as 12 or 13, or younger to be able to buy this pill without a trained professional overseeing the process? Shouldn't someone know if they are having sex with a boyfriend at that age?
Well how does it logically matter if a child can buy the pill? If an adult is using it to prevent an underage victim from becoming pregnant they will buy the pill themselves. So really this article is an overreaction and based on flawed logic. An adult can buy this pill. It doesn't matter if a young teen can.
And once again, this pill is birth control. Not abortion in a bottle. Availability of birth control means fewer unwanted pregnancies. I fail to see how this is a bad thing.
ballen0351
Sr. Grandmaster
Problem I have is by making this available to kids. Has it been properly tested for long term effects on a teenager? Body chemesty is different between adults and teens. If my daughter is able to buy these pills without my knowledge and something happens medically and I don't know she took these pills it could potentially cause a dangerous situation. If you over 18 and something happens well that's on you and you assume the risk. A 15 year old doesn't understand the risk. A 15 year old buys condoms they won't die but taking a medication opens the possibility an adult should be notified
What "process?
I mean, you do know how babies are made, right?
You don't have to be a "medical professional" to know that-regardless of age-if a female takes this drug in the three days after being impregnated, she might not have gotten pregnant, anyway?
That if conception were going to occur, all this drug does is keep that from happening, or interrupt it?
That if conception does occur, you may think of it as a "living human being," but it's basically a collection of cells-like, 8 cells- smaller than the size of the tip of a very sharp #2 pencil?
View attachment $Day 3 embryo.jpg
That the "process" occurs every month (in females who are capable of becoming pregnant) and it's called her period?
See, Bill-this is the kind of crap you just lap up, regurgitate and expect others to accept. I get it, you're Catholic, you think abortion is wrong-your church's position is that most contraception is wrong, and that this pill "interrupts the word and will of God."
So Bill, for the love of God, and the sake of your soul, man, don't take this pill. Okay? :lfao:
Odds are good that if she's having sex with a boyfriend at that age, someone does know, but it's not her parents.
And, not as a medical professional, but as the father of a daughter whom I love very much, I'm glad that this pill will be readily available for girls who-for a variety of reasons-might need it but not feel comfortable asking their parents to get it. As a parent, I raised my kids to make their own informed decisions, and didn't put my head in the sand about what they might or might not be doing, or getting away with-nor did I watch them 24/7 and curtail their normal social development-I didn't have the luxury of that sort of time-I had to trust them. That trust paid off, I think-but I don't know if my daughter ever had an abortion, or if she's ever even had sex with a member of the opposite sex, for that matter.
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I can understand the argument about teens getting this without parents knowing. And yes there are risks with birth control pills. My wife was on birth control at 16 because of horrible periods due to a hormonal imbalance. The pills corrected it, but she needed her mom to sign off on it.
However I have heard similar arguments reguarding easy access to condoms for teens as well. And I understand parents who are uncomfortable with the idea. But when many parents only tell their kids "Don't have sex" and expect them to just not do it, I can understand access to birth control being a good thing.
If I were a parent I would teach safe sex, and give access to birth control methods because logically a teen will act on hormonal impulses. If you really want to deny that, just think back to highschool and try to remember all of the teens having sex even then.
Now, yes there should be accurate tests to make sure there are no health concerns. But I honestly don't know that there aren't. I haven't looked quite that far into it because I obviously never planned on taking it. However I am not so quick to demonize something that I haven't fully researched. But I HAVE researched it enough to know that it most certainly is not an abortion in any way. To abort a pregnancy, a person must actually be pregnant. And this pill stops the pregnancy before an egg can be fertilized and then implanted in the uterus.
Same as a birth control pill.
Now, if you disagree with any form of birth control that's fine. But you can't force that belief on others. Or expect them to just not be sexually active. And if pregnancy is stopped before it can happen, then there is no need for abortion which is much more questionable morally.
So honestly, birth control is good. And so is proper education on sexuality and said methods of birth control. Now, that being said, I do believe that if a parent needs to give permission for regular birth control ( unless that is no longer the case ) then the morning after pill should fall under the same category and be treated the same way. And if regular birth control medication is now available without parental concent, then this is again no different.
I think that the reason for most of the argument against this particular pill is due to not understanding it from a medical standpoint. And it is understandable, but people should research instead of being spoonfed what their opinion should be. As far as availability, it should be treated as any birth control pill in regard to age.
Otherwise it should be available freely.
However I have heard similar arguments reguarding easy access to condoms for teens as well. And I understand parents who are uncomfortable with the idea. But when many parents only tell their kids "Don't have sex" and expect them to just not do it, I can understand access to birth control being a good thing.
If I were a parent I would teach safe sex, and give access to birth control methods because logically a teen will act on hormonal impulses. If you really want to deny that, just think back to highschool and try to remember all of the teens having sex even then.
Now, yes there should be accurate tests to make sure there are no health concerns. But I honestly don't know that there aren't. I haven't looked quite that far into it because I obviously never planned on taking it. However I am not so quick to demonize something that I haven't fully researched. But I HAVE researched it enough to know that it most certainly is not an abortion in any way. To abort a pregnancy, a person must actually be pregnant. And this pill stops the pregnancy before an egg can be fertilized and then implanted in the uterus.
Same as a birth control pill.
Now, if you disagree with any form of birth control that's fine. But you can't force that belief on others. Or expect them to just not be sexually active. And if pregnancy is stopped before it can happen, then there is no need for abortion which is much more questionable morally.
So honestly, birth control is good. And so is proper education on sexuality and said methods of birth control. Now, that being said, I do believe that if a parent needs to give permission for regular birth control ( unless that is no longer the case ) then the morning after pill should fall under the same category and be treated the same way. And if regular birth control medication is now available without parental concent, then this is again no different.
I think that the reason for most of the argument against this particular pill is due to not understanding it from a medical standpoint. And it is understandable, but people should research instead of being spoonfed what their opinion should be. As far as availability, it should be treated as any birth control pill in regard to age.
Otherwise it should be available freely.
This method of post coital contraception has been available unofficially for over 40 years. The more recent form only became available from a pharmacist about ten years ago and there are certain procedures in place before it can be sold including advice and possible referral. However, if a young girl is old enough to be having intercourse then she should safely be able to take the 'morning after' pill. The US has a different system of regulating drugs that divides them into prescription only and available anywhere. Australia has a couple of extra schedules that restrict some drugs to be available from pharmacies under the supervision of a pharmacist. If we look at your example of using a condom and it breaks or comes off, then even though the couple has taken responsible precautions there is the chance of an unwanted pregnancy. This pill helps safeguard against this.
The point that some people seem to be missing is that this pill is not just for kids. There are many women of older age taking it as well if needed. The fact that it has been released for open sale in the US shows that the FDA considers the risk of young people taking it to be much less than the risk of an unplanned pregnancy.
:asian:
ballen0351
Sr. Grandmaster
I'm not missing the point its available to adults. I don't give a flying crap heap about an adult having access to it. I have issues with kids taking them without a parents permission. You may be OK with it I'm not.
So how much of the drug testing that you claim is safe was tested on teens? What restrictions are going to be put on them? Can a 13 year old girl go buy them no questions asked? If so what safeguards will be in place to make sure they are being used properly? If an adult screws up oh well she should have read the directions better. A kid screw it up who's at fault then?
I can't buy cold meds without showing and having my ID scanned but my child can go buy this drug no questions asked? I question the reasons behind this decision as well it seems more political pressure then actual drug research. It is what it is the Govt is going to do what it wants anyway so at this point it doesn't much matter what I or anyone else thinks.
So how much of the drug testing that you claim is safe was tested on teens? What restrictions are going to be put on them? Can a 13 year old girl go buy them no questions asked? If so what safeguards will be in place to make sure they are being used properly? If an adult screws up oh well she should have read the directions better. A kid screw it up who's at fault then?
I can't buy cold meds without showing and having my ID scanned but my child can go buy this drug no questions asked? I question the reasons behind this decision as well it seems more political pressure then actual drug research. It is what it is the Govt is going to do what it wants anyway so at this point it doesn't much matter what I or anyone else thinks.
I wasn't suggesting you had missed the point of it, and yes, I am OK with it. I am even more OK with it because medicines are more controlled here than in the US and the person purchasing the medication is going to get proper advice on how to use it.. But regardless of that, I would rather my child have access to post coital contraception than have an unwanted pregnancy, but I suppose your OK with that. The fact that a 13 yo could purchase the product without questions being asked is the fault of your system, not the fault of the product. And, you can buy cold meds without ID. There are dozens of products available for self selection. The fact that most of them are totally ineffectual is again the fault of the system. The ones that require ID are the ones that can be turned into amphetamine, nothing to do with drug research, and it is ironic that they are the effective products. As I said previously, this medication has been available for over 40 years and has been shown to be safe and relatively free of adverse effects. It is the same drug that has been available in implant form and used in institutions for decades.
I can't believe how you guys blame your government for everything. They make a product available to help prevent unwanted pregnancy and you blame the government. If the government restricted the availability and the rate of unwanted pregnancies increased other people would be blaming the government for not making available a safe and reliable medication. Educate children by all means but you will still have young people having sex without contraception, even in the strictest families. If the kids discussed with their parents that they were having sex I am sure the parents would give permission for them to use a contraceptive. The fact is, most children don't discuss their sex lives with their parents and would not be asking their parents for permission to buy the morning after pill. In that case they would probably wait for their missed period then maybe seek an abortion. Do you think that is a better option? :asian:
