Wong Training

Discussion in 'The Great Debate' started by MonkgWong, Apr 30, 2020.

  1. MonkgWong

    MonkgWong Yellow Belt

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2020
    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Still posting about English language vs Chinese language even after the moderator warned you? Stop mate, it's really childish.

    So, I'll ask again - who trains golden bell?
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
  2. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    8,721
    Likes Received:
    2,175
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Austin, Tx/Shell Beach, Ca
    Agree! It's always more fun to talk about "true" MA than to talk about anything else.

    Could you put up a "crushing fist" training video so we can start to talk about it?

    - What's crushing fist?
    - How to train it?
    - Which MA style did it come from?
    - ...
     
  3. MonkgWong

    MonkgWong Yellow Belt

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2020
    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Hey Kung Fu Wang.

    Crushing fist is a technique from Xingyiquan. To train it you need a good foundation in the style - I suggest San Ti and some Li Gong exercises. It is one of the five primary fists of the style and relies on moving the body as a unit.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  4. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    8,721
    Likes Received:
    2,175
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Austin, Tx/Shell Beach, Ca
    People trained "golden bell" during the boxer rebelling time, it was proved that it didn't work against bullet.

    Like to hear more about your opinion on this. Could you put up a clip for that? Thanks in advance.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2020
  5. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    8,721
    Likes Received:
    2,175
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Austin, Tx/Shell Beach, Ca
    So crushing fist is Beng Chuan.

    Do you coordinate your punch with your front foot landing, or with your back foot landing?
     
  6. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    8,721
    Likes Received:
    2,175
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Austin, Tx/Shell Beach, Ca
    It's a trade off.

    What's your opinion on the XingYi front foot landing, back foot slide and follow footwork?
     
  7. Tez3

    Tez3 Sr. Grandmaster

    • Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2006
    Messages:
    26,958
    Likes Received:
    4,417
    Trophy Points:
    308
    Location:
    England

    Good grief I train karate and MMA and I could have written those two sentences with authority! Google would have informed me for the first sentence and the second could easily apply to all styles of martial arts and probably a lot of other sports too.
     
  8. Monkey Turned Wolf

    Monkey Turned Wolf MT Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2012
    Messages:
    6,857
    Likes Received:
    2,051
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    New York
    I think you missed the other part about providing support for extraordinary claims.
     
  9. Xue Sheng

    Xue Sheng All weight is underside

    • Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2006
    Messages:
    30,216
    Likes Received:
    4,609
    Trophy Points:
    308
    Location:
    North American Tectonic Plate
    What the heck are you talking about....I posted the Chinese characters, the pinyin and the english to point out how incredibly wrong you were.....nothing to do with not listening to what was said Grandmaster.....

    "Stop Mate?" So you're actually English (British) or Australian......and since your "student" on the site you were banned from claimed his school was in England, I'm guessing the closest you ever got to China was possibly Norwich.....

    Whatever...you want to be a mystical monk grandmaster, go for it, your a fake and I know it....they want to let your type on the page, and spread your fantasy and disinformation so be it....it is their page to do with what they want, posters want to take your misinformation and fantasy seriously...so beit....I know what you are....and I have had enough of your silliness...I will no longer waste my time on a fake like you...Grandmaster Wong....not from China, but claims to be, does not know the language of the country he claims to be from, does not even know the dialect of his home province......likely from England..........have a nice day spreading your nonsense.....I will go back to the other site where you and. your fiction are not allowed...I will not be missing much......people want to get info from a fake Chinese monk about Bengquan, which he likely knows nothing about...that is their problem.......real life martial artist and xingyiquan person signing off.......the Grandmaster is here....pfhht
     
  10. MonkgWong

    MonkgWong Yellow Belt

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2020
    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    8
    If starting in a San Ti position (with left foot forward), the right fist lands when the right foot lands (near the left foot). It works on a principle known as 'six harmonies' - Kung Fu Wang, what is your mother style? Then perhaps I can explain in more detail.
     
  11. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    8,721
    Likes Received:
    2,175
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Austin, Tx/Shell Beach, Ca
    My XingYi came from:

    Liu Wei-Xiang 刘纬祥(1864~1936) -> Chang Dong-Sheng (1908–1986) -> me

    Today, the term "style" has no meaning to me. I believe there is a right/wrong way of doing thing. I don''t believe there is an internal/external way of doing thing.

    Today, I only believe in "toolbox development". The XingYi 5 elements are just tools in my toolbox.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2020
  12. MonkgWong

    MonkgWong Yellow Belt

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2020
    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Your approach is wise - and I appreciate you not rambling about pinyin and local dialects, it is most refreshing.

    While I understand your approach here, is your Xingyi closer in form to Heibei or Shanxi (or Henan) style?
     
  13. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Sr. Grandmaster

    • Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2005
    Messages:
    12,531
    Likes Received:
    2,355
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    San Francisco
    First, why is this a matter of great importance?

    Second, anyone who names a specific thing and calls it “most” powerful or “most” effective or “most” whatever, is wrong.

    So, I disagree.
     
  14. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    8,721
    Likes Received:
    2,175
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Austin, Tx/Shell Beach, Ca
    I'm only interested in MA discussion.

    My XingYi is Heibei system. Our Heng Chuan punch with big fist eye pointing upward instead of pointing side way (to avoid elbow cracking).

    Our Beng Chuan keep the elbow joint bending more than other XingYi system (also to avoid elbow cracking).
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2020
  15. isshinryuronin

    isshinryuronin Purple Belt

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2019
    Messages:
    326
    Likes Received:
    270
    Trophy Points:
    218
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    I have never read so many posts where I had no idea what the heck was being discussed. I saw the Iron Fist on TV earlier today. Is it something like that? I thought I had a decent layman's handle on mainline Chinese MA, but you have all proved me wrong. It is way more confusing than Okinawan MA.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    8,721
    Likes Received:
    2,175
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Austin, Tx/Shell Beach, Ca
    This is why I keep asking the OP to put up his personal training clip so we can have something solid to discuss.

    This is what OP was talking about - Xing Yi Beng Chuan.



    Here is a golden bell training. Unfortunately, this training doesn't work for the head punch.

    - Bruce Lee once said, "I don't push, I punch."
    - KFW once said, "I don't punch to the body. I only punch to the head." :D

     
    Last edited: May 2, 2020
  17. isshinryuronin

    isshinryuronin Purple Belt

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2019
    Messages:
    326
    Likes Received:
    270
    Trophy Points:
    218
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    Ah. This seems to be what I know under the name "iron shirt." It is one of the elements of the form "sanchin" or in Chinese, Sa'am Chien. There may be a difference in the philosophical basis, however. I confess I'm not clear on this point.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2020
    • Agree Agree x 1
  18. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    8,721
    Likes Received:
    2,175
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Austin, Tx/Shell Beach, Ca
    If someone claims that he is a monk warrior, he can shave his head and post a picture to prove that he can be a monk.

    But how can he prove that he is a warrior?
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2020
  19. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Sr. Grandmaster

    • Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2005
    Messages:
    12,531
    Likes Received:
    2,355
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    San Francisco
    Shaving one’s head is no proof of being a monk.
     
  20. Monkey Turned Wolf

    Monkey Turned Wolf MT Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2012
    Messages:
    6,857
    Likes Received:
    2,051
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    New York
    I just learned I'm a monk. Sweet.123
     
    • Funny Funny x 2

Share This Page