Why??

[troubleenuf]

OK... here is a question to ponder... why do martial artist who have 20, 25 or even 30 years experience STILL feel the need to get direction and or justification from a higher source (usually Korean)?

 

[granfire]

why not?

There is always more to learn.

 

[sfs982000]

OK... here is a question to ponder... why do martial artist who have 20, 25 or even 30 years experience STILL feel the need to get direction and or justification from a higher source (usually Korean)?

I guess it just depends on how you look at it, if it has to do with one of the frequent changes that occur within a bigger organization then I could understand constantly referring to them regardless of how much experience you have. That is one of the downsides I can see with belonging to a large organization is that they set the guidance and if want to belong to their organization it has to be done their way.

 

[MBuzzy]

Have you met some of those Koreans? The guys that grew up with it every day, some of them from the SOURCE? I was friends with a lot of Koreans that trained directly the creators of some of these arts. Remember that the Korean culture is a lot different, they will share certain things only with certain people and some of the styles are still family based.

Plus, everyone can learn. Once you get high enough, you HAVE to go to Korea to find someone that knows more than you do.

 

[NPTKD]

OK... here is a question to ponder... why do martial artist who have 20, 25 or even 30 years experience STILL feel the need to get direction and or justification from a higher source (usually Korean)?

I get it... I found myself doing it. I made alot of changes in my school over the last year. Some liked it, some didn't. It took alot of hard work. In the end, I think I would have done things different. Live and Learn!

 

[terryl965]

Because any good system evolves and for us to keep going we need to as well.

 

[granfire]

Have you met some of those Koreans? The guys that grew up with it every day, some of them from the SOURCE? I was friends with a lot of Koreans that trained directly the creators of some of these arts. Remember that the Korean culture is a lot different, they will share certain things only with certain people and some of the styles are still family based.

Plus, everyone can learn. Once you get high enough, you HAVE to go to Korea to find someone that knows more than you do.

I think there is a lot of myth running through this mind set.

But still, Korea is the base for the Art and you will miss out on a large segment of the spirit of it if you don't take that into consideration.

Then again, I keep thinking about 'Kung Fu Panda':
"Son, the secret ingredient in my Secret ingredient soup is....NOTHING"

One is always a student. Stopping to learn means drifting back, not just standing still. Sometimes you have to go to the old masters, sometimes the lessons are taught from other sources.

 

[Bondservant]

Wisdom grows with time. My grandfather used to say this "A wise man can learn from a fool because he will listen, yet a fool can't learn from a wise man because he won't listen." If you find yourself with 20 , 30 , 40+ years experience and think that you know it all then you have lost the willingness to learn.

I would conclude, outside of tradition, that those who still seek instruction/wisdom from those who have greater experience than them are simply still willing to learn.

Just my two cents from my humble opinion.

Kiyungee

 

[d1jinx]

well.... i guess i have been driving for 20+ years so I really am competent. I know how to drive and I am very good at it. So theres really no reason to check with the MVA/DMV or higher authority to see if there have been any changes or if i may have started doing things differently. If I want to be a part of their org, I should know what they expect.

sorry, i couldnt help being a smart ***. (look at my advatar)....
but my point is, Yes, I look to a "higher power" for some things.

I think I understand where you are coming from, and if its what I think.... no, I dont ask for permission to do things my way.... when it comes to running my school or business. But I do when it comes to technique, doing things like forms or competition rules.

 

[Miles]

OK... here is a question to ponder... why do martial artist who have 20, 25 or even 30 years experience STILL feel the need to get direction and or justification from a higher source (usually Korean)?

I can only answer for myself as each person will have their own individual reasons.

I treasure my relationships with my instructors to include GM Park, Hae Man. Even though I have more than 30 yrs of training, they will always have more and can guide me to where they've already been. I don't need validation from them, our relationships have transcended that.

With this past visit, GM Park noticed my wife's neck was stiff. She suffers from degenerative disc problems. He politely asked permission to press on her finger. She said she experienced a lightening bolt of pain in her neck which subsided as he continued to press on her finger.

I continue to learn things in and out of martial arts from my instructors. They've been down whatever road I'm on now, and can guide me around the hazards (or make me go into the hazards if I'm going to learn something from the experience).

 

[dortiz]

"well.... i guess i have been driving for 20+ years so I really am competent. I know how to drive and I am very good at it. So theres really no reason to check with the MVA/DMV or higher authority to see if there have been any changes or if i may have started doing things differently. If I want to be a part of their org, I should know what they expect."

But if you could take a track course with a professional race course driver would you? Would you not learn new things even after 20 years of driving?

Dave O.

 

[troubleenuf]

Some of you got what my question was... but not MBuzzy.... The Koreans were the source....years and years ago.... to think that they are the know all end all now is nothing more than a myth. In 30 years TKD has changed and not all changes came from Korea. In fact many of the best changes came from the MANY other countries that TKD is now practiced in. The idea that only in Korea can you get the "secret" or somehow "mystical" knowledge is ludicrous. The TKD of today does not even resemble the TKD that those "founders" did... so why do you have to go to them to get the knowledge. Its almost like its a cult... only one person or one source can give you the knowledge when in actuality their are many if not more knowledgeable instructors out there who are not korean and who have never been to Korea. Look at it this way... would you go to the inventor of the steam engine for information to work on a jet engine? And yes I have met many Koreans... many of who are so full of their own importance that any knowledge they may have is not worth the effort.

Have you met some of those Koreans? The guys that grew up with it every day, some of them from the SOURCE? I was friends with a lot of Koreans that trained directly the creators of some of these arts. Remember that the Korean culture is a lot different, they will share certain things only with certain people and some of the styles are still family based.

Plus, everyone can learn. Once you get high enough, you HAVE to go to Korea to find someone that knows more than you do.

 

[d1jinx]

"well.... i guess i have been driving for 20+ years so I really am competent. I know how to drive and I am very good at it. So theres really no reason to check with the MVA/DMV or higher authority to see if there have been any changes or if i may have started doing things differently. If I want to be a part of their org, I should know what they expect."

But if you could take a track course with a professional race course driver would you? Would you not learn new things even after 20 years of driving?

Dave O.

yeah, Im with you. I'm not sure my thoughts came out the way they went in my head. I was being a smart@ss and basically saying....

even though i know how to do something, I still chek to see if it is right, if it has changed, or if there is a better way to doing something.... so yes, these are my reasons for looking to a Higher source like the original question asked.

but i also am not a slave to thier bidding and feed into thier pockets, so to speak. respect and loyalty are given, not my slavery.

that all i meant to say.

 

[d1jinx]

Some of you got what my question was... but not MBuzzy.... The Koreans were the source....years and years ago.... to think that they are the know all end all now is nothing more than a myth. In 30 years TKD has changed and not all changes came from Korea. In fact many of the best changes came from the MANY other countries that TKD is now practiced in. The idea that only in Korea can you get the "secret" or somehow "mystical" knowledge is ludicrous. The TKD of today does not even resemble the TKD that those "founders" did... so why do you have to go to them to get the knowledge. Its almost like its a cult... only one person or one source can give you the knowledge when in actuality their are many if not more knowledgeable instructors out there who are not korean and who have never been to Korea. Look at it this way... would you go to the inventor of the steam engine for information to work on a jet engine? And yes I have met many Koreans... many of who are so full of their own importance that any knowledge they may have is not worth the effort.

been there seen that. but as much as they do... koreans are not the only ones walking around in suits wanting everyone to bow and see how important they are.... maybe the majority, but not all...

I try to avoid those "types" of masters and GM.

(def: types = full of themselves)

 

[troubleenuf]

Yep, its not limited to the Koreans... its just that there seems to be a thing about putting up a Korean Master on the pedestal and ignoring what/who he really is because of the "worship" (for lack of a better word" of him.

been there seen that. but as much as they do... koreans are not the only ones walking around in suits wanting everyone to bow and see how important they are.... maybe the majority, but not all...

I try to avoid those "types" of masters and GM.

(def: types = full of themselves)

 

[Twin Fist]

there hasnt been a korean in my lineage since Jhoon Rhee.

And I am ok with that