Wheel vs. roundhouse kick

[loun]

What is the difference between these 2 kicks? When would you use one over the other?

Thanks

 

[Blindside]

You might want to describe what you mean by these terms, it is helpful to have a starting point for the discussion. Describe the motion of each and the thread can go from there.

Lamont

 

[John Bishop]

I've heard the rear leg "roundhouse" kick refered to as a "wheel" kick by some Korean stylists, so there may not be a differance.

 

[shane23ss]

What is the difference between these 2 kicks? When would you use one over the other?

Thanks

A wheel kick could be a roundhouse kick in reverse, like a reverse spinning roundhouse. Then again, it could be a different name for the same kick, kind of like a cresent/moon kick. Maybe some one from a "kicking" system would know. I asked my Tang Soo Do buddy (who is a 1st degree BB) but he doesn't know.

 

[FearlessFreep]

Not sure on the wheel kick but another TKD friend of mine calls something a 'hurricane kick' and I call it a 'tornado kick' so...

Then again, look down in the TKD forum in a thread about 'spinning back kick' vs 'spinning side kick' with half the people saying they are unique kicks with various strengths and half the people saying they're just different names for the same thing.

 

[KenpoDave]

What is the difference between these 2 kicks? When would you use one over the other?

Thanks

In my system, the wheel and the roundhouse have the same end result. However, the wheel comes off the ground with the knee pointed forward, similar to the way Bill Wallace teaches, then pivots to the roundhouse position. The roundhouse is the roundhouse.

The wheel tends to be more deceptive when done correctly. The roundhouse tends to have more power. Also, the roundhouse is not typically practiced as a front leg kick, whereas the wheel as practiced with both the front and back.

 

[jfarnsworth]

Personally I have never heard of a wheel kick. I do like KenpoDave's post on the difference of the 2. However I personally teach the roundhouse much the same as he had indicated the wheel kick. :idunno: Sounds to me like pretty much the same thing.

 

[Brian Jones]

Back many years ago when I was taking TKD, a wheel kick was done like a hook kick,only the knee stayed straight, no "hooking motion". As a kickon its own it wasn't done much, but you would often se it as a "spinning wheel" kick where the leg stayed stiff, as opposed to a spinning hook kick. I may be wrong but I think the wheel is also prevelant in hapkido.
All in all I agree with the previous posters, if you post your school's definitions of the wheel and roudnhouse, perhaps someone can answer your question.

Brian Jones

 

[FearlessFreep]

However, the wheel comes off the ground with the knee pointed forward, similar to the way Bill Wallace teaches, then pivots to the roundhouse position.

Hmm...that sounds what I've been used to as a 'roundhouse'

At our school, basically the snap kick (or front kick), the side kick, and the roundhouse kick all start the same; drive the toe to get the knee up pointing at the target. From there, the snap kick snaps the foot/toe forward, the side kick pulls the thigh over and drives the foot forward, and the roundhouse turns the hip over and snaps the foot out.


We do all three from front or back. Back tends to be offensive (more power), front tends to be defensive (quicker to get up against an attack already launched) or as the first part of a multiple part attack.

I don't think we use a straight leg kick

 

[MJS]

Back many years ago when I was taking TKD, a wheel kick was done like a hook kick,only the knee stayed straight, no "hooking motion". As a kickon its own it wasn't done much, but you would often se it as a "spinning wheel" kick where the leg stayed stiff, as opposed to a spinning hook kick. I may be wrong but I think the wheel is also prevelant in hapkido.
All in all I agree with the previous posters, if you post your school's definitions of the wheel and roudnhouse, perhaps someone can answer your question.

Brian Jones

Yes, thats the way I learned it as well.

Mike

 

[KenpoDave]

Personally I have never heard of a wheel kick. I do like KenpoDave's post on the difference of the 2. However I personally teach the roundhouse much the same as he had indicated the wheel kick. :idunno: Sounds to me like pretty much the same thing.

Pretty much. The kick is the same at the end, different beginning. We used to not use the term roundhouse, and go with offensive and defensive wheel, the defensive wheel being the roundhouse, the offensive wheel being the more deceptive kick.

Some have mentioned the wheel being a straight leg hook kick. That is how we do the hook kick. Our hook kick is almost identical in mechanics to a ridge hand.

 

[dubljay]

The way I learned Wheel and roundhouse are they are two different kicks.

Wheel:
It begins in a linear path, like a front kick. When you bring your knee up, just before you extend your lower leg you pivot on your planted foot, turning your hips and then extend your lower leg. This will change the path from linear to circular, making it harder to defend against (in ideal terms). If you analyze the body mechanics and the path taken of a front kick a wheel kick is basically a front kick on the horizontal plane. Deceptive in nature, medium in power compared to a roundhouse.
There are four positions of a wheel (and front kick) starting from both feet in a fighting stance
1: Knee bent and the kicking foot up off the ground tucked back just a bit.
2: Extending the striking foot, for a wheel kick this also includes the pivot on the planted.
3: This position is the same as the first, which includes the pivot back for a wheel kick.
4: This is where you replant your foot back into a fighting stance.

I personally use the wheel kick most in a combination. From a left lead stance I use my right leg (back leg) and throw a front kick to the midsection or ribs, then retract back to the 3rd position from above, pivot and throw a wheel kick to the side of the head. I'm currently working on executing this combination from my lead leg.

Roundhouse:
A roundhouse is entirely circular in motion. The kicking foot comes up off the ground already beginning its arc path to the target. Because there is no change of path from linear to circular, the power and momentum of this kick is much greater than that of a wheel kick. The draw backs are that it is easier to anticipate and defend against.


Either kick can be executed from either the lead or rear leg. However desired power may lead to one leg position optimal for certain also body mechanicals kicks make it easier for one kick to be executed from certain leg positions as opposed to another. You must decide which legs and kicks work for your own body mechanics.

I wish there was a way for me to illustrate the body positions to make myself as clear as possible.

-Josh-

 

[KenpoDave]

The way I learned Wheel and roundhouse are they are two different kicks.

I wish there was a way for me to illustrate the body positions to make myself as clear as possible.

-Josh-

Josh, your illustration is exactly the way I was taught the kicks.

 

[dubljay]

Josh, your illustration is exactly the way I was taught the kicks.

I am just glad you could understand what I said, by the time I finished writing and editing that post I couldn't make sense of what I had written.

 

[The Kai]

When I first started in tracy's kenpo the Wheel kick was a Roundhouse Kick.

Todd

 

[TigerWoman]

I find terminology across arts pretty mixed up. In TKD, a wheel kick is commonly known as a spin heel to head level but the leg is brought up straight and around and not hooked-snapped to target. Like a hook with no hook but with a spin in other words.

Then the roundhouse kick is completely different. We snap round kicks so there is no slow bringing up straight and around, if that's what you call a wheel kick. We bring the knee up, point in the direction of the kick and extend the lower leg for the snap. The snap round kick is non-telegraphing and faster IMO. TW

 

[Dark Kenpo Lord]

I find terminology across arts pretty mixed up. In TKD, a wheel kick is commonly known as a spin heel to head level but the leg is brought up straight and around and not hooked-snapped to target. Like a hook with no hook but with a spin in other words.

Then the roundhouse kick is completely different. We snap round kicks so there is no slow bringing up straight and around, if that's what you call a wheel kick. We bring the knee up, point in the direction of the kick and extend the lower leg for the snap. The snap round kick is non-telegraphing and faster IMO. TW

You do realize this is a Kenpo/Kempo forum, not a TKD forum so of course you're going to have your own terminolgy for your art. Tracy Kenpo has differences to EPAK, terminolgy and technique names and actions are the big ones, but the kicks are very similar,so the original question was asked in the right place. I never read or post on the TKD board because I have no vested interest in it whatsoever, same goes with the rest of the arts.


DarK LorD

 

[TigerWoman]

You do realize this is a Kenpo/Kempo forum, not a TKD forum so of course you're going to have your own terminolgy for your art. Tracy Kenpo has differences to EPAK, terminolgy and technique names and actions are the big ones, but the kicks are very similar,so the original question was asked in the right place. I never read or post on the TKD board because I have no vested interest in it whatsoever, same goes with the rest of the arts.


DarK LorD

Of course I realize...Kenpo people post all the time in the TKD forum and you are welcome too. Basically kicks are the same, but done differently within different styles of TKD too. The question should be what is the best way to execute the kick? TW

 

[[email protected]]

In my KF style, upon which Kenpo is based (in part) a wheel kick is simply a roundhouse kick which is not retracted along a the same (or similar) route on which it traveled to reach its target. To be more specific, a roundhouse returns the kicker to an orientation which faces the opponent assuming this is where the kicker faced when launching the kick. A wheel kick, however goes through the target turning the kicker relative to the kickee. Think of a haymaker punch which doesn't retract and instead misses, thereby exposing the side/back of the puncher. Anyway, this leads to it's name. Wheel, of course refers to the person 'wheeling' around or at least spinning. While they may not spin 360 they certainly have exhibited a spin-like tendency with this kick, and of course many MA practitioners would use this extension/turn to simply begin a full spin around and re-face their enemy.

 

[loun]

This was my first post on this forum, I was very surprised to see the amount of responses this seemingly simple question generated. Thank you for all of the replies.

I spoke with the head instructor last night and asked him the question. He said the roundhouse kick comes from the rear leg and the wheel kick from the front leg. Depending on the proximity and the relatice position of the target either one can be executed low, parallel to the groung (midrange) or rising.