Slut Walks

[punisher73]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42927752/ns/us_news-life/?gt1=43001

Thoughts? Is our culture to "permissive" on rape?

If a man walks down the street with $100 bills hanging out of all his pockets and gets robbed, we would say that he bears some responsibility. Should it be the same standard that if a woman wears extremely revealing clothing that, even though completely wrong, she has a small part in what happened?



Just asking questions, this is NOT a "she had it coming" viewpoint.

 

[bushidomartialarts]

I think the difference is in severity.

A man walks through Harlem with $100 bills hanging out of his pocket. We'll punish the robbers, but we'll also chide him for being foolish....but we wouldn't chide him if the robbers also beat him severely.

Rape is assault, not robbery. A more apt analogy would be a woman dressed provocatively getting felt up on a crowded subway train....a situation where I think you'll see the exact same response as the $100 bill example above.

 

[Flea]

A "slut walk" strikes me as a strange phenomenon, but I think I get where they're coming from. It's a similar approach to a gay pride rally - turning a taboo into a positive, with the ultimate goal of removing the stigma altogether. Given enough marches, the mainstream view might just budge a little. If one came to my town I think I'd dust off my "Boobquake" shirt and join in.

 

[Flea]

I think the difference is in severity.

Rape is assault, not robbery. A more apt analogy would be a woman dressed provocatively getting felt up on a crowded subway train....a situation where I think you'll see the exact same response as the $100 bill example above.

Nah. There's another side to "severity," and that's the intrusiveness. You can't put sexual violence on par with a robbery.

 

[Empty Hands]

The analogy doesn't hold up on the facts. Most women are raped by men they know. Most rape victims are under 18, with a very significant minority of that under age 11. Stranger-rape of an attractively dressed woman walking down a dark alley are such a minority of rapes that they are barely worth talking about.

So no, dressing in stained sweats (or even kids clothes, as it turns out) will not protect you from rape.

 

[Touch Of Death]

"Reclaim the word slut"... That's hilarious. And by the decree of the greater slaterniani we hear by claim the word SLUT as our own.
Sean

 

[Tez3]

The most common usage of the word slut used to be to describe a woman who was untidy, dirty even, dishevelled and slatternly. It's seems to be an Americanism that we've copied that it now has a 'sexual' meaning. We've always tended used the word 'slag' for that type of female or the expression I like 'she's no better than she ought to be', one of those sayings you don't actually know what it means!

Rape is more often about power and control, rarely is about the sexual act itself which is used as something to humilate and degrade the victim.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-12857539

Rape is not just an assault it's a hate crime which leaves lifelong trauma.

 

[LuckyKBoxer]

This is just ridiculous to me.

while I feel that people should be allowed to be people, as long as in their doing so it doesnt change or effect my way of living directly, there are some things that common sense should tell you is wrong.

look a person can have racist views as much as he wants, its a free country, If a black racist walks by me with a shirt that says "whitey sucks!" I will laugh at him the same as some fool white guy walking down the street with a shirt embroidered with a swastika.
but if that black guy does the same thing at a KKK rally, or if that white guy goes to say oakland and does that, well they are idiots and probably going to be beaten or worse.. are they to blame? They are after all exercising their freedom of speech? Of course they are to blame for being idiots, stupid, whatever you want to call it.

now a woman dressing provacatively is one thing, doing it and acting provacatively is another, doing it, acting it, and then leaving with some guy she just met and getting raped? horrible... but she has some blame for her actions.
It is obvious not all rapes are because some guy was lead on by a woman dressed like a "slut" or acting like a "slut" and teasing them either directly or indirectly. But there is definitely a percentage that happen that way. Some people need to use self defense and not put themselves in bad situations then expect to have no blame when things go south.

I think today people are way to sensitive, I see it on this forum all the time. Someone says something and immediately a large group of people take it the worst possible way it could possibly be interpreted. Its like everyone has a damn chip on their shoulder and is looking to make others seem as evil as possible to help themselves feel better. I am not exempting myself from this either, I try really hard to read what is written and react off of that, but sometimes its hard not to read something and see an extreme version of what it can be.

I guess this seems so ridiculous because the word slut is a derogatory term... its used to describe poor behavior, tacky dress, etc.. for people to defend it seems ridiculous... I mean why not have a Pimp walk day, a wife beater day, a child neglector day, a day without drug dealers, etc.etc. it just seems stupid. have a day to support respect amongs humans, or a day to support free speech, or a day to support successful marriages, or a day to celebrate school graduates, or a day to celebrate any other set of positive morals.... this?? just lame

 

[Touch Of Death]

This is just ridiculous to me.

while I feel that people should be allowed to be people, as long as in their doing so it doesnt change or effect my way of living directly, there are some things that common sense should tell you is wrong.

look a person can have racist views as much as he wants, its a free country, If a black racist walks by me with a shirt that says "whitey sucks!" I will laugh at him the same as some fool white guy walking down the street with a shirt embroidered with a swastika.
but if that black guy does the same thing at a KKK rally, or if that white guy goes to say oakland and does that, well they are idiots and probably going to be beaten or worse.. are they to blame? They are after all exercising their freedom of speech? Of course they are to blame for being idiots, stupid, whatever you want to call it.

now a woman dressing provacatively is one thing, doing it and acting provacatively is another, doing it, acting it, and then leaving with some guy she just met and getting raped? horrible... but she has some blame for her actions.
It is obvious not all rapes are because some guy was lead on by a woman dressed like a "slut" or acting like a "slut" and teasing them either directly or indirectly. But there is definitely a percentage that happen that way. Some people need to use self defense and not put themselves in bad situations then expect to have no blame when things go south.

I think today people are way to sensitive, I see it on this forum all the time. Someone says something and immediately a large group of people take it the worst possible way it could possibly be interpreted. Its like everyone has a damn chip on their shoulder and is looking to make others seem as evil as possible to help themselves feel better. I am not exempting myself from this either, I try really hard to read what is written and react off of that, but sometimes its hard not to read something and see an extreme version of what it can be.

I guess this seems so ridiculous because the word slut is a derogatory term... its used to describe poor behavior, tacky dress, etc.. for people to defend it seems ridiculous... I mean why not have a Pimp walk day, a wife beater day, a child neglector day, a day without drug dealers, etc.etc. it just seems stupid. have a day to support respect amongs humans, or a day to support free speech, or a day to support successful marriages, or a day to celebrate school graduates, or a day to celebrate any other set of positive morals.... this?? just lame

Slut exactly translated means slat, and for people that don't like the C word, I don't know why people would want to be called by a description for their private parts.
Sean

 

[bushidomartialarts]

I mean why not have a Pimp walk day, a wife beater day, a child neglector day, a day without drug dealers, etc.etc. it just seems stupid. have a day to support respect amongs humans, or a day to support free speech, or a day to support successful marriages, or a day to celebrate school graduates, or a day to celebrate any other set of positive morals.... this?? just lame

I love your second set of examples...the world needs more of that.

But being sexually promiscuous (or dressing like you might be) doesn't belong on the same list as wife beating and child neglect.

 

[LuckyKBoxer]

I love your second set of examples...the world needs more of that.

But being sexually promiscuous (or dressing like you might be) doesn't belong on the same list as wife beating and child neglect.

I will freely agree to that point.. I was not putting a huge amount of thought into it.. I was trying to simply list poor traits... and while the last two are indeed poor traits, I would agree they are in a different category.

 

[Tez3]

However wearing short skirts and boob tubes aren't always the attractive sight some wish they were. Tbh very few females wearing short skirts etc look very appealing, with their blue mottled legs, muffin tops, builders bums etc. With both male and female Chavs there is a huge amount of violent drunken behaviour involved.

The Great British Chav (female version)

 

[LuckyKBoxer]

However wearing short skirts and boob tubes aren't always the attractive sight some wish they were. Tbh very few females wearing short skirts etc look very appealing, with their blue mottled legs, muffin tops, builders bums etc. With both male and female Chavs there is a huge amount of violent drunken behaviour involved.

The Great British Chav (female version)

I will see your Chav?? and raise you a Snooki!

 

[mook jong man]

Cor Blimey they're right scrubbers aren't they.

 

[Tez3]

Ugh! sometimes you know I think the Burka idea isn't so far wrong! I support people doing their own thing and tbh I wouldn't want to be told what to wear in my own time but whether or not dressing in such tiny clothes is provocative or not, I really think many girls should cover up to save the rest of us having to see them. I'm torn between admiring the confidence of girls who squeeze a hundred pounds of flesh into a tiny top and skirt but on the other hand it just appalls me.
Up in some of our northern cities it's common for girls to go shopping in their pajamas so much so that some supermarkets have banned them from wearing them in their shops.
In the sixties like most girls then I wore mini skirts, it didn't seem such an issue and people were more prudish then.

Here at least it's less the clothes that are an issue but the drunken yobbish behaviour. It's common to drink till you fall into a coma, this makes girls vulnerble. Many girls aren't sober enough to make an informed decision as to whether they want sex or not, many will shag a guy when they are drunk that they wouldn't even speak to if sober. Many don't even know the guy they shag. all inhibitions go out of the women, a guy intend on having sex doesn't need to rape, he just waits till a girl literally falls at his feet.

 

[granfire]

Glory days when people actually dressed up when they left the house....

 

[JohnEdward]

This is a really old argument for sure, and sadly is resurrected when something like this happens.

In my experience, I think there is a truth to the cop's "flippant" comment. I speak unbiasedly. We can say the cop was out of line and should have said something less demeaning and politically correct to the woman by saying, by the overtly sexual way you are dressing, possibly for attention based mostly on what seem to be on a lacking of self esteem, or you are struggling with understanding good sense fashion, the attention you are getting you can't control. By dressing the way you are, realize many men and women see you as being highly sexually promiscuous and available to them sexually. These people lack the control to restrain themselves from forcing you to have sex with them. Sure Lil' Kim, Lady Gaga and other entertainers you admire are praised dress that way to be noticed and get attention, and you see dressing like that is a successful way of getting attention you want, but they have bodyguards, and people always around them to protect them. You don't. If you want to dress in this overtly exploitive manner, you may want to do it in a more controlled environment where their are not any sexual predators and crazies who can't control their sexual urges and will force sex upon you. You don't want to swim in shark infested waters looking like and acting like a seal.

Now how unreasonable is all that to say to a woman who has self-esteem issues, and hasn't learned the art of dressing for the occasion, or for the environment. How many men (gay or not) can walk into a Redneck bar, dressed as Perez Hilton in a cop uniform and not get beat to an inch of their life, raped, or both. There are some realities that exist. We many not like it. But they do. If a women is dressed in a sexually provocatively manner on the street she will draw quickly dangerous attention, sad and true fact. Something those people protesting don't understand. The cop's comment or his attitude isn't the real problem. It is the fact sick and dangerous people are out there, and you have to protect yourself, and not make yourself vulnerable, or as a neon sign target. Sadly, the street isn't the perfect Utopia where everyone is nice to each other no matter what signals we send out. In my view, yea it was a flippant comment, but it spoke a truth very succinctly. Let me add, I don't see rape as a consequence or a burden on the victim. Instead as a matter in terms of risk management and personal safety. No one deserves or asks to be raped or attacked, but it happens anyway to all sorts of women which is a sad reality and threat women have to be aware, and manage the risks in terms of personal safety. I really wish things where different, as a husband, and father.

 

[Flea]

I saw this elsewhere and couldn't resist passing it along:

[yt]WGnGPAZcsqE&feature[/yt]

 

[Big Don]

What is really sad about this is people being proud of being scum. The lack of shame in today's society is a big problem.

 

[Sukerkin]

As I can't see the images/video Flea linked to I can't comment in context but in general terms I do agree with Don about one of the consequences of generations of "Me First Last and Always" is that people do not properly consider how what they do and how they behave reflects upon themselves. Nor do they consider how their right to do as they please, anti-social or not, impacts upon the rights of others not to have to put up with that sort of thing.