Should Political/Religious/Orientational Debate be allowed here.

[Nightingale]

if you find a post objectionable, please use the "report to mod" feature. We try read everything, but sometimes we just don't see a problem post. Click on the little red thingie in the top right corner of the post and let us know about it.

 

[Fortis]

As much as those threads tend to be fertile ground for people to start throwing around insults, I don't think they should be banned. For every person letting off steam (which I'd rather them do on an internet board anyhow), there are 10 fine posts by people that are giving legitimate beliefs and opinions without "flame-throwing. :flame: " If someone is easily offended by these types of threads, then they should inherently know to avoid them.

 

[Jay Bell]

As long as people act like adults, I think it's good. Learning the perspective of others is necessary. Of course...with those topics...

 

[Cryozombie]

haha. Yes, Jay, I agree. I admit myself to sometimes acting in an immature manner regarding some threads... and I always look back and go... "what was i thinking..."

 

[tshadowchaser]

I think that when the "heated discussion" goes south is when people result to insulting each other, especially through direct name calling, or direct attacks.

We also learn more about the people we are meeting with. We also learn something about ourselves.

These two statements about sum up my thoughts on the subject.
Name calling and the "I'm right your wrong" attitude are not discussions, they are specific points of view ment to insult and/or subjugate (sp) a person.
Two or more sides of a given statement can be a learning experience.
Very few people ever change their minds on a subject of religion, politics , etc,. from a discussion, but they may see clearer the other guys point of view.

 

[Flatlander]

Didn't even know this thread was here in May. I just voted. It feels good to exercise your right to vote. There should be more polls.

 

[Feisty Mouse]

Ditto. I think the mods do a good job of prodding when things get out of hand. I am very interested to hear what people think, even when I disagree with them.

 

[Gary Crawford]

Fiesty,You do a very good job of being respectful to those you don't agree with,but not everyone does.I have found a member or two who would rather attack the messenger than discuss the message.

 

[Feisty Mouse]

Thanks, Gary! Well, sometimes things do get out of hand, but (to me) it seems worth it for the other discussions we can have.

 

[Flatlander]

Above and beyond that, everyone gets a chance to really think about these issues, and get different points of view. Discussion of these topics is vital and necessary, IMHO, in order for us to test our beliefs, and reinforce our convictions. As well, it keeps us all informed of current events, and allows us to explore the the meaning behind those issues. Critical thinking is a good thing.

Go team!

 

[Lisa]

I don't post much in the study but that being said I do enjoy reading the opinions of the other people here on the board. Yes, sometimes it gets heated and turns into a he said/she said arguement but for the most part the conversations are interesting. I think it makes us better people to be able to at least admit that there is another side to a story. Many times I have read threads and have been enlightened by someone. I may not agree with their perspective but they have given me a reason to re-evaluate my position or at least agree that there is another side. Thank you for giving me the opportunity to grow.

As Flatlander said... Go Team!

 

[TwistofFat]

Above and beyond that, everyone gets a chance to really think about these issues, and get different points of view. Discussion of these topics is vital and necessary, IMHO, in order for us to test our beliefs, and reinforce our convictions. As well, it keeps us all informed of current events, and allows us to explore the the meaning behind those issues. Critical thinking is a good thing.

Go team!

I also think history shows the martial arts developed (in part) to defend country and beliefs (Shaolin Monks for example). I find it very interesting to see what modern day martial artists think about Political/Religious issues and how we react to verbal pokes as a reflection of how we might react to real ones.

There are, for example, some in consumption establishments (er..bars) that look for offense where often, none is intended. MA.com reflects real life...I love it. It seems certain to me that MA's in the 16th century did not agree on a whole host of issues we "fight" about today. We use the web, they used swords...this is only a bit safer.

Regards - Glenn.

 

[kenpo tiger]

If you start with debating stuff you sometimes go back and adress specific points people have raised. They address what you have countered with some oter peopple come in and in the end every body gets mad and bam you got a flame war. Sort of.
The study probably has the most flame wars simply because of te volital nature of what is being disscussed. We also learn more about the people we are meeting with. We also learn something about ourselves. I realized I'm kind of psuedo-agnostic in a way.
There does seem to be a lack of women who frequent the study. Just something I find intresting. I wonder if that is tied to this.
Most importantly though if I have offended anybody tthat wasn't my intent. If I offend you feel free to say it and I'll probably correct it if I see that it needs correction.
:asian:

As one of the only women who frequent the Study, I'm chiming in. There's a few good reasons for it, as we have all discussed in our private forum and in pms:
1) Most don't want to debate because they feel they aren't equipped to post all of the references that some of the other participants do. This is usually because women run households and have other things to do than sit on the Internet and surf.
2) Most don't want to debate because they do not want to be a target for some of those who insist on arguing for the sake of argument. They fail to realize that 'sticks and stones' is applicable here. I personally do not take any offense to what is said to me by any of the men here because I don't know them and I could care less what they are saying about what I've written. You disagree with my opinion? Too bad. That's why it's my opinion and not yours.
3) My personal peeve about the Study is that sometimes there are people who do get out of hand and feel that this is a place where they can prostelytize their religious beliefs. The world is made of many many diverse religions and cultures. I don't mind reading about another religion if it's factual and sensibly, sanely, accurately, and calmly explained. Ranting and raving drives me out of the thread, and I will always state that in hopes that a moderator will step in and quell it.

If someone objects to some of the content of the threads in here, then don't come into this area. I can't stand the threads elsewhere in the forum where it's bantering back and forth. My opinion, and I stay out of that area for that reason. There's plenty of information and wonderful wonderful people who belong to this forum. Use it wisely and you'll benefit. I have.

 

[GAB]

Hi KT,

Well said.

I think in reality women have more time on their hands, especially when they are not employed.

As far as opinions go, it is nice to read yours.

Regards, Gary

 

[raedyn]

What I like about discussing these topics on this board (versus others I've tried) is that the vast majority of the time, everyone here makes an honest effort at thoughtful, educated discussions, and there is generally an effort to listen and understand and inform each other.

 

[loki09789]

What I like about discussing these topics on this board (versus others I've tried) is that the vast majority of the time, everyone here makes an honest effort at thoughtful, educated discussions, and there is generally an effort to listen and understand and inform each other.

Awwwwww, I feel a group hug coming on .

I don't think the problem is the topics of discussion as much as how people deal with the discussion.

If people contribute/respond/start discussions on a topic but don't do so with the understanding that they are laying themselves/their values on the dissection table for examination - doom on them.

 

[Feisty Mouse]

Hi KT,

Well said.

I think in reality women have more time on their hands, especially when they are not employed.

As far as opinions go, it is nice to read yours.

Regards, Gary

I'm going to have to disagree with you there, if by "not employed" you mean "taking care of house and family".

Oh well.

I think part of the reason more women aren't in the study is... 1) not many ladies on MT in general, and 2) in my own experience, women tend to seek out conflict a bit less than men.

 

[loki09789]

I'm going to have to disagree with you there, if by "not employed" you mean "taking care of house and family".

Oh well.

I think part of the reason more women aren't in the study is... 1) not many ladies on MT in general, and 2) in my own experience, women tend to seek out conflict a bit less than men.

1. YUP.
2. Uh-Uh! Yes they do.....

 

[hardheadjarhead]

I like "The Study". Having been to other forums I find MT is one of the best for political/religious discussions. The mods have done a good job of keeping the discussions somewhat civil and the intellectual level of debate is high. Topics often have nothing to do with the martial arts, of course...but then "The Study" wasn't meant for that.

One of the things "The Study" has done for me is to show me the diversity of political opinion and the level of intelligence many martial artists hold. I had come to believe that a large number of us were what the public perceived us to be: Thick necked jocks lacking an education. While that may or may not be true, I took solace from the discussions here. They let me know that there were some martial artists out there who somehow convinced the man behind the curtain to give them a brain.

Such a forum as "The Study" will certainly lead to conflict. We are, if anything, political animals and often combative to boot given our training in the arts. People have been banned for posting inflammatory comments here...but some of those were abrasive in the martial arts sections as well. Is it the topic or the agent of discussion? Think too of all those who haven't been banned but have listened to the adomonitions of the moderators to be polite. Remember the misses, as well as the hits.

Keeping politics/religion out of our lives is impossible. Will barring it as a topic from MT do so? Can we discuss the ramifications of teaching martial arts to children with disabilities without bringing up the political challenges facing their parents and educators? Can we talk about martial arts schools and their insurance rates without talking about tort reform? Can we talk about self defense without talking about guns and gun control? When the mods start directing our conversations away from those areas in the name of civility how is that anything different from censorship?

And beyond that--political discussion is a requirement for each of us to claim membership in an informed electorate. We are a land of diversity and adversity and the only way to hammer out the issues facing us is to discuss them...not squelch them. I suppose we all could go elsewhere for such discussions but I'd miss those I've come to know here. They sponsored my membership in that informed electorate. For that I'm grateful.


Regards,


Steve

 

[kenpo tiger]

Steve, You're my hero :boing2: :boing1: -- but you knew that. KT