Scenario/Role play

[Drac]

Thanks, I was trying to get a clearer picture of how things worked over there.
Here in Ireland, or at least Navan the town Im from, response time to a domestic disturbance(or any kind of disturbance) tends to be about an hour or so, unless its to a business.
So its usually either fizzled out or blown up by the time there is any police intervention anyway.

Over here response time to a domestic where the dispatcher can hear yelling or screaming on the phone is about under 5 minutes..If things have fizzled out the first unit in will cancel the other units

Its a case of "yeah my brother and I get into fistfights...but you better not let me catch you picking on my brother."

Many are under the assumption that domestic is strickly husband-vs-wife..It can be any famly member...

 

[jks9199]

Speaking for myself, more than I care to remember..

Let's see... A "well thrown spatula to the head..."

I worked one wear an airborn frying pan shattered an elbow.

Actual physical assault -- plenty. Verbal only -- even more. Verbal that became physical or escalated when we arrived -- quite a few. One of my partner's and I even locked one guy up for assault on an officer because he didn't want to talk to us after verbal disputes with his family.

As I said previously -- I've called the local cops where I live quite a few times for domestics in my "happy neighborhood." (Don't worry -- they go on in yours, too, you just don't see or note the signs like I do. A 1970s TV star's house is well known to cops in a jurisdiction near mine thanks to the frequent domestics there... And, yes, the star still has plenty of money as does the spouse.) I've gotten personally and directly involved exactly once, when I knew a physical HAD occurred and WOULD occur again if I didn't do something. And, even then, I only gave the victim shelter till the cops arrived.

While I believe I'm largely preaching to the choir now -- Domestics, especially, are not things for well meaning amateurs to jump into. What I want is you to call it in, report if there are any weapons involved, or if you believe that either of the parties is drunk or high, and NOT become another victim.

 

[jks9199]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shotgun Buddha
Thanks, I was trying to get a clearer picture of how things worked over there.
Here in Ireland, or at least Navan the town Im from, response time to a domestic disturbance(or any kind of disturbance) tends to be about an hour or so, unless its to a business.
So its usually either fizzled out or blown up by the time there is any police intervention anyway.

Over here response time to a domestic where the dispatcher can hear yelling or screaming on the phone is about under 5 minutes..If things have fizzled out the first unit in will cancel the other units

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blotan Hunka
Its a case of "yeah my brother and I get into fistfights...but you better not let me catch you picking on my brother."

Many are under the assumption that domestic is strickly husband-vs-wife..It can be any famly member....

A couple of further "definition" points, with the caveat that each state defines "family member" for itself here in the US. The odds are very good (in fact, I'm almost certain) that Drac's definition includes some mine wouldn't -- and mine includes some his probably doesn't. Basically, in VA, it's blood relatives (mom, dad, kids, grandparents IF they live in the house), step-relatives (step-parent, step-sib, etc), and folks with a child-in-common. (I'm paraphrasing or capsulizing several paragraphs worth of definition here.) If we find that there is probable cause to believe a domestic assault has occured between covered parties (kid-vs-kid, mom-vs-grandmom, baby momma-vs-baby daddy), we almost MUST make an arrest.

In my area, cops respond to all domestic calls. The information that the calltaker gathers dictates how we respond; "parties are arguing" is different from "son pushed dad" and vastly different from "calltaker hears screaming in background." Verbal domestics -- we can often resolve by "encouraging" one party to spend the night with friends, and directing the appropriate party to other resources. As I said -- once it becomes physical, we almost have to arrest. If, in some rare circumstance, we don't make an arrest, we actually have to do MORE paperwork to justify that than actually making an arrest.

Domestic violence is a very serious, and under-reported, crime here. It's treated as such. And, as much as "in the good ol' days", cops could "fix" the problem with creative police work -- there were plenty of times that the "creative" approach failed.

OK...I'm off my soapbox now!

 

[Tez3]

Quote In my area, cops respond to all domestic calls. The information that the calltaker gathers dictates how we respond; "parties are arguing" is different from "son pushed dad" and vastly different from "calltaker hears screaming in background." Verbal domestics -- we can often resolve by "encouraging" one party to spend the night with friends, and directing the appropriate party to other resources.Unquote

This is why I believe calling the police if you have any concerns is the right thing to do.The police officers have probably seen everything in the way of altercations and will handle the situation appropriately. If you call the police and it turns out you mistook the situation and it really was nothing far better that than barging in and turning it into a potential fight! On the other hand the situation may be a dangerous one and by calling the police you may save lives even your own!

 

[stabpunch]

Yes i am willing to accept the responsibility of my decisions.

All these words and i still don't regret attending the situation.

'Jack' came over for dinner the other night and he is greatful that:

A) I didn't sit on my hands and
B) I didn't get the police involved.

For me his appreciation is far more weighty than all the talking you guys can type. It's horses for courses.

If you don't trust my judgement that's fine. I do.

Seasons greetings.

 

[MJS]

Yes i am willing to accept the responsibility of my decisions.

All these words and i still don't regret attending the situation.

'Jack' came over for dinner the other night and he is greatful that:

A) I didn't sit on my hands and
B) I didn't get the police involved.

For me his appreciation is far more weighty than all the talking you guys can type. It's horses for courses.

If you don't trust my judgement that's fine. I do.

Seasons greetings.

Thats fine, but I'd like to say a few things.

1) Has the thought ever occured to you, that perhaps domestics happen on a regular basis over at "Jacks" house and he is greatful that you didn't call the police because he wants to continue to subject his family to domestic violence?

2) If you didn't want anyones opinion, why did you start this topic???????????????

3) Seeing that you still did not answer my question, I'll close by saying...did you ever sit and take some time to think about the outcome if your "verbal Judo" doesn't work?

 

[Tez3]

I have to second MJS' post. Why on earth post if you didn't want anyone's opinion? Unless it was confirm your own opinion of yourself? As I assume it didn't, this is why we've had the 'well you're all wrong I'm right anyway' post.
Oh well, I'm not too proud to say I learned something from "all the talking you guys type" ( I'm sure that's an oxymoron!) I don't want to stop learning till I die and even then who knows lol!

 

[Blotan Hunka]

Thats it. Time for the ignore feature.

 

[Drac]

Thats it. Time for the ignore feature.

I'm with you before my inner demons make me post something that I'll be sorry for...

 

[Drac]

While I believe I'm largely preaching to the choir now -- Domestics, especially, are not things for well meaning amateurs to jump into. What I want is you to call it in, report if there are any weapons involved, or if you believe that either of the parties is drunk or high, and NOT become another victim.

If concerned citizens REALLY wanna do the right thing CALL US...CALL 911 and stay on the friggin line...

 

[Rich Parsons]

If concerned citizens REALLY wanna do the right thing CALL US...CALL 911 and stay on the friggin line...

Drac,

I hope you do not mind, but in my experience 911 has not been trained or worth my time. Calling the local police directly has always gotten a much more informed and better response for me. But 911 is universal and will work on any cell phone and I understand why you say what you say. I just know I am not thrilled with their local performance.

Thanks

 

[jks9199]

Drac,

I hope you do not mind, but in my experience 911 has not been trained or worth my time. Calling the local police directly has always gotten a much more informed and better response for me. But 911 is universal and will work on any cell phone and I understand why you say what you say. I just know I am not thrilled with their local performance.

Thanks

It's important to understand how 911 works -- and how it doesn't. First, there are still some places in the US that DO NOT have 911! So, you'd better know whether or not the system is even available if you're spending time there. (Cell calls will go to a 911 dispatch center based on the towers...which may not be exactly where you need help; more on that in a bit.)

Second, 911 calls go to a 911 dispatch center, not necessarily your local police. Where I work, for example, all 911 calls go to the regional 911 call center that dispatches fire & EMS first; if it's not a fire & rescue call, it gets referred to either the appropriate local police dispatcher, like mine, or the county police dispatchers. BUT... it's gotta get through the fire side first! (And then the call taker has to get jurisdictional boundaries right... which doesn't always happen. One more reason to know who "your" cops are...) This makes sense; after all, medical issues can be a matter of seconds -- but it does delay police dispatch sometimes. If you know the number to our dispatcher direct (we've got it on the back of all our police cars...), you can cut that middleman out.

Now... Cell phones and internet phone service. I'm leary of these... Cell calls don't link to a land address; they go to the 911 center for the tower. Guess what? That CAN be someone different if you're close to jurisdictional boundaries. And internet phones can be even worse; they may not be able to route a 911 call to your 911 center. I personally suggest having at least one landline (traditional phone), and not a cordless phone, either. They may not work if there's no power...

One final note... 911 is an EMERGENCY line; it's not for "my neighbor's stereo is too loud" and it's not for "I got a parking ticket; what do I do?" There are non-emergency numbers for stuff like that; take a few minutes, and LEARN THEM. (I know the non-emergency numbers for about 4 to 6 jurisdictions off the top of my head.) Use 911 for crimes in progress, especially crimes where someone might get hurt (yes, that domestic does count!), for medical emergencies, or for fire emergencies. If in doubt that it's an emergency -- call 911, but be reasonable. Your car that was taken sometime overnight isn't typically a life threatening emergency, no matter how mean your boss is!

 

[KenpoTex]

One final note... 911 is an EMERGENCY line; it's not for "my neighbor's stereo is too loud" and it's not for "I got a parking ticket; what do I do?" There are non-emergency numbers for stuff like that; take a few minutes, and LEARN THEM.

This varies...In my area, if you call the PD or the SD, you'll get a recording that basically says "if you need an officer to respond for any reason, hang up and call 911"

Our 911 center will directly dispatch the city, county, state-patrol, and the fire/ems services as appropriate.

 

[Drac]

Drac, hope you do not mind, but in my experience 911 has not been trained or worth my time. Calling the local police directly has always gotten a much more informed and better response for me. Thanks

Up here the same operator that answers the 911 line is the same person that answers that non-emergency line...

 

[Drac]

One final note... 911 is an EMERGENCY line; it's not for "my neighbor's stereo is too loud" and it's not for "I got a parking ticket; what do I do?" There are non-emergency numbers for stuff like that; take a few minutes, and LEARN THEM.

Usually it's your area code and the first 3 digits of your exchange followed by 1234..Check out the White Pages to be sure..

 

[Kacey]

Usually it's your area code and the first 3 digits of your exchange followed by 1234..Check out the White Pages to be sure..

I know the non-emergency number for my area... but it's nothing close to that. One of my neighbors gave it to me when I moved in; we live across the street from a park where lots of loud music is played during the day and evening, people drink beer and leave bottles all over the park, and teens/young adults pull up for 10-15 minutes while exchanging paper bags... I call that number regularly on summer nights, and the response has been good enough that I call less than I used to, as the ones who hung out there have learned the police do show up. Also, every time I've told them I did anything but call first (like go out and tell noisy teens, phone in hand, that I have their plate number - they usually leave then), they calmly and politely tell me why I should have called instead.

 

[Tez3]

We have 999 for emergencies, this is put through to an operator and they'll ask what service you require, usually fire, police or ambulance. In coastal areas you can get the coastguard too ( for a lifeboat callout etc). round my area we have mountain rescue as well! Like 911, 999 is for emergencies only. We do have local numbers to talk to the police. Response is pretty good in our area bearing in mind we are rural (if you've ever watched the James Herriot films/series thats where I live, Yorkshire Dales) we have a helicopter ambulance service because of the difficulties we face in winter.The reverse of the distance probalem is that everyone tends to know everyone and everything! The Garrison while there are thousands of soldiers tends to be a very friendly place, if you know service people you will know what I mean, to a large extent it's self policing. Trouble doesn't break out very often thank goodness. The Garrison is very quiet at the moment, everyone is in Iraq. I would give an awful lot to have a few scuffles breaking out in the local pubs at the moment! My thoughts are very much with the families and the soldiers at this moment and I shal have a very special thought for stabpunch who has endeared himself to so many of MTs wisest heads with his unique outlook on life and martial arts. We have learned from him exactly what we should be teaching our students!

 

[Drac]

I know the non-emergency number for my area... but it's nothing close to that

I keep forgetting that the burbs here are NOTHING like the burbs there..Sorry..

Also, every time I've told them I did anything but call first (like go out and tell noisy teens, phone in hand, that I have their plate number - they usually leave then), they calmly and politely tell me why I should have called instead.

Yep..That's because you NEVER know what drugs or the amount of alcohol that they have ingested, usually a combination..It's the weapons that is their biggest concern..It an effort to imitate the hard core "rappers" they will carry semi-automatic pistols and in some cases FULLY automatic..

 

[jks9199]

This varies...In my area, if you call the PD or the SD, you'll get a recording that basically says "if you need an officer to respond for any reason, hang up and call 911"

Our 911 center will directly dispatch the city, county, state-patrol, and the fire/ems services as appropriate.

Are you certain that there's not a separate non-emergency number? I cannot imagine that the 911 center wants every single police call for service to come in on 911... There are only so many 911 lines available, and in many cities, it's actually very possible to end up getting a recording on 911 until a line/calltaker is available.

It may not be literally to a desk in the local PD; it might go to the same dispatch center because you use regional dispatch (several areas near me are like that) -- but I'm pretty confident that there is a non-emergency number.

We actually had to change a lot of our published information, because we listed an our-PD only emergency number, and, apparently, some laws have changed and we can't have a separate emergency number and 911 service. Still... knowing the appropriate local number (maybe it's to that regional call center; maybe it's to a desk in the PD) can often get a faster police response than 911. And there are times not to call 911, and instead use the non-emergency number.

 

[jks9199]

I keep forgetting that the burbs here are NOTHING like the burbs there..Sorry..

And that's why I didn't try to list any... Some places have 311 for police service calls, others have a "regular" phone number, and some are just calls to the 911 call center on a non-emergency line. If I'm travelling, and staying somewhere for several days, I'll often check the local phone book for the police numbers. Beats having some hotel clerk try to talk you out of calling the cops for a problem...