Questions about aikibudo, aiki jujitsu, and ninjutsu

[Charbel Hanna]

If you already have some MA knowledge, to get a training partner should be your highest priority.

If you spar/wrestle with your training partner 15 rounds daily, you will develop some good skill after a year.

Yes I'm trying to initiate my wife to that but it's not her biggest hobby haha! And my friends are not much into sparring/wrestling, except one. Last time I wrestled with him was at my bachelor party, I was quite drunk, and I ended up emptying my stomach 10 minutes after! Still worth it.

Joking aside, yes I should really focus on having a partner and train with him or her on a regular basis. You are right.

 

[Charbel Hanna]

Just don’t let yourself get pressured into fighting if you don’t want to. I’ve been in hundreds of competition gyms eg Muay Thai, boxing, MMA etc and some don’t care at all if you compete and have a wide variety of students who train for different reasons not just fighting. I’ve been in a Muay Thai gym where no one fights. They just didn’t do it. The coach was an ex fighter and British champ but none of the people in the gym were the right type for competition (to old, injured or just didn’t want to)

But I’ve also been in some where they want everyone involved to fight and if you say you’re not interested then they try and pressure you into it by calling into question your toughness and all that junk to try and bully people into fighting.

again those gyms are the minority and doesn’t happen a lot but it is something to watch out for. It’s easy to get sucked into the macho nonsense. I stupidly fell in for it once and took a fight I shouldn’t have. But again just keep an open mind and stick to your guns about not competing (but of course if you train and then you feel like you want to compete then by all means go for ) it but make sure it’s YOUR choice and not theirs.

Thank you for the advice! Yes I will keep that in mind.

 

[Headhunter]

Yes I'm trying to initiate my wife to that but it's not her biggest hobby haha! And my friends are not much into sparring/wrestling, except one. Last time I wrestled with him was at my bachelor party, I was quite drunk, and I ended up emptying my stomach 10 minutes after! Still worth it.

Joking aside, yes I should really focus on having a partner and train with him or her on a regular basis. You are right.

You don’t need to....you’ve got the training at your gym for that. There’s plenty of solo drills you can do by yourself which can be just as beneficial...frankly in martial arts you don’t NEED to do anything. It’s a hobby a pastime it’s not your job or your career you don’t need to take it to serious at start. You’re a beginner just enjoy it don’t get into pushing to hard because you think that’s what you’re meant to do. Go there however many classes you want to do have fun doing it, take days off to rest you do not have to train every single you don’t need to be practicing with a partner every day. Some people here....they get a bit to serious I find.... Just train wherever you want and have fun. Don’t worry about extra training or Finding an extra training partner or becoming the best ever or any of that.

 

[O'Malley]

Aikido nerd here, maybe I can help. Short answer: go to the dojos and see which one makes you want to stick around. Below is a longer answer, with some perspectives on the styles themselves.

Greetings! I'm looking to get back into martials arts. I am looking for something not competitive, but rather very oriented toward self defense and real-life scenarios. I want something generalist, such as jujitsu. As long as it is effective in real-life scenarios. My wife might also want to train with me, so that she may learn to defend herself against potential aggressors. We are both 25 years old.

Live training is essential to applying a martial art to real life self defense. And the arts with the best live training are competitive arts: in these, in order to survive, a dojo must teach its members how to apply their techniques on someone who doesn't let them.

Now regarding the arts. I can't comment much on ninjutsu so I'll talk about the other two.

1- Aikibudo. I had no idea what it was until googling it. It seems interesting, but I have a few questions about it.
1.1 Does it teach atemi waza (striking techniques)?
1.2 Does it teach ne waza (ground grappling)?
1.3 From the videos, it looked very circular, like a choregraphy, but I'm not sure if this is just because it was a demonstration. Is it effective in real-life scenarios for beginners, or is it rather like aikido, where you would have to train a lot before it becomes (very) effective?
1.4 Is it closer to aikido, or jujitsu, in terms of techniques?

The instructor learnt from interesting teachers. It's a form of aikido with a more complete curriculum than the mainstream dojos.

1.1 Probably.
1.2 Possibly
1.3 The problem with aikido (and aikibudo) is not that techniques take a long time to learn, it's that the teaching method is generally bad at teaching you how to apply it against a resisting opponent. As all they do is based on prearranged patterns, they are not used to dealing with a real human being that resists and acts unpredictably. So if you want to learn how to defend yourself "OPC" , there are many better options. If you still want to learn it because you like it, you may need to supplement the regular training with free practice. It's possible, though.
1.4 It's a variant of aikido

If you like aikibudo, there is also a Gyokushin Ryu aikido school in Montreal, which is similar in several aspects. It is kind of a reconstruction of the lost jujutsu school that had a major influence on M. Mochizuki (one of the interesting teachers above). They have an extensive and interesting curriculum of sacrifice throws: Qu'est-ce-que le Gyokushin Ryu? — FAGRI - IGRAF

2- Aiki jujitsu. Note that it is not Daito ryu. This one seems very much generalist and oriented toward self-defense.
2.1 Does it teach atemi waza?
2.2 Is it closer to aikido or jujitsu?

I can pretty much guarantee that it's nothing like Daito ryu. The founder says he's got black belts in 6 martial arts but I don't know whether he studied any of them in any depth. It's a modern synthesis of the his knowledge so the art's value will depend on his ability to put together a coherent system based on his knowledge and experience of combat.

2.1 Probably.
2.2 No idea, he probably threw some aikido-like techniques into the mix but this does not make it close to aikido.

 

[drop bear]

Yeah and I reckon his white belt friend would come last in a taekwondo competition. Really stupid statement. A Krav Maga guy lost a bjj match against a bjj practitioner....shocker

Lost against every white belt in the room.

This is a huge section of self defence fighting that that particular guy can't do at a beginner level.

 

[Charbel Hanna]

Aikido nerd here, maybe I can help. Short answer: go to the dojos and see which one makes you want to stick around. Below is a longer answer, with some perspectives on the styles themselves.



Live training is essential to applying a martial art to real life self defense. And the arts with the best live training are competitive arts: in these, in order to survive, a dojo must teach its members how to apply their techniques on someone who doesn't let them.

Now regarding the arts. I can't comment much on ninjutsu so I'll talk about the other two.



The instructor learnt from interesting teachers. It's a form of aikido with a more complete curriculum than the mainstream dojos.

1.1 Probably.
1.2 Possibly
1.3 The problem with aikido (and aikibudo) is not that techniques take a long time to learn, it's that the teaching method is generally bad at teaching you how to apply it against a resisting opponent. As all they do is based on prearranged patterns, they are not used to dealing with a real human being that resists and acts unpredictably. So if you want to learn how to defend yourself "OPC" , there are many better options. If you still want to learn it because you like it, you may need to supplement the regular training with free practice. It's possible, though.
1.4 It's a variant of aikido

If you like aikibudo, there is also a Gyokushin Ryu aikido school in Montreal, which is similar in several aspects. It is kind of a reconstruction of the lost jujutsu school that had a major influence on M. Mochizuki (one of the interesting teachers above). They have an extensive and interesting curriculum of sacrifice throws: Qu'est-ce-que le Gyokushin Ryu? — FAGRI - IGRAF



I can pretty much guarantee that it's nothing like Daito ryu. The founder says he's got black belts in 6 martial arts but I don't know whether he studied any of them in any depth. It's a modern synthesis of the his knowledge so the art's value will depend on his ability to put together a coherent system based on his knowledge and experience of combat.

2.1 Probably.
2.2 No idea, he probably threw some aikido-like techniques into the mix but this does not make it close to aikido.

Thank you for the very detailed answer! On a side note, I would love to do some aikido! I find locks fascinating. But not now, maybe later in life.

 

[Headhunter]

Lost against every white belt in the room.

This is a huge section of self defence fighting that that particular guy can't do at a beginner level.

A jiu jitsu competition isn’t self defence....far far from it

 

[drop bear]

A jiu jitsu competition isn’t self defence....far far from it

Neither is krav maga.

And neither is krav maga effective grappling.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

Lost against every white belt in the room.

This is a huge section of self defence fighting that that particular guy can't do at a beginner level.

The only arts I'd expect to do well in a BJJ comp are BJJ, JJJ and wrestling. Possibly sumo/mongolian wrestling as well. It's a very specific skillset, and if you don't train it you don't know it, no matter how good you are at striking/standup grappling.

You've basically got three options for self-defense in that regard. 1: Pray that you never end up on the ground. 2: Learn a ground-grappling sport. 3: Spend a lot of time learning (and practicing against grapplers) escapes to get back to your feet. Obviously 2 is ideal, but 3 can work too, and would still result in you losing the tournaments.

 

[drop bear]

The only arts I'd expect to do well in a BJJ comp are BJJ, JJJ and wrestling. Possibly sumo/mongolian wrestling as well. It's a very specific skillset, and if you don't train it you don't know it, no matter how good you are at striking/standup grappling.

You've basically got three options for self-defense in that regard. 1: Pray that you never end up on the ground. 2: Learn a ground-grappling sport. 3: Spend a lot of time learning (and practicing against grapplers) escapes to get back to your feet. Obviously 2 is ideal, but 3 can work too, and would still result in you losing the tournaments.

Or you could just say every combat sport isn't self defense and conveniently cover up the fact you can't kick punch or grapple.

I would love to show you my martial arts works but then you would have to die.

 

[drop bear]

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

Or you could just say every combat sport isn't self defense and conveniently cover up the fact you can't kick punch or grapple.

I would love to show you my martial arts works but then you would have to die.

Nah. If you train krav maga, you should be able to compete in kickboxing. Possibly in Judo comps as well. But BJJ isn't in the wheelhouse for krav. So I wouldn't expect to train krav and learn ground grappling, or expect a krav instructor to do well in a BJJ comp.

 

[Headhunter]

Neither is krav maga.

And neither is krav maga effective grappling.

You seem very insecure....

 

[Headhunter]

Nah. If you train krav maga, you should be able to compete in kickboxing. Possibly in Judo comps as well. But BJJ isn't in the wheelhouse for krav. So I wouldn't expect to train krav and learn ground grappling, or expect a krav instructor to do well in a BJJ comp.

Wow you actually have common sense...not a ridiculous bias. I say fair play to that Krav Maga instructor for testing himself in a totally different sport than his own....if a bjj guy went into a boxing match....guess who’d win (I’m sure drop bear believes the bjj guy would )

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

Wow you actually have common sense...not a ridiculous bias. I say fair play to that Krav Maga instructor for testing himself in a totally different sport than his own....if a bjj guy went into a boxing match....guess who’d win (I’m sure drop bear believes the bjj guy would )

Nah, boxing is one of the acceptable sports. Have the BJJ guy enter a WT TKD sport, either he'd win automatically, or lose because it's not a real comp.

 

[drop bear]

Nah. If you train krav maga, you should be able to compete in kickboxing. Possibly in Judo comps as well. But BJJ isn't in the wheelhouse for krav. So I wouldn't expect to train krav and learn ground grappling, or expect a krav instructor to do well in a BJJ comp.

So krav conveniently will do well in all those things we can't see.

It is amazing how common that is.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

So krav conveniently will do well in all those things we can't see.

It is amazing how common that is.

You can't see those? You don't have kickboxing or judo competitions in Australia? I knew Australia was lacking in some sports, but I didn't realize it didn't even have those at all. You should figure out a way to fix that.

 

[Headhunter]

So krav conveniently will do well in all those things we can't see.

It is amazing how common that is.

Why do you care so much about other people do or don’t do....like I said...insecure

 

[Steve]

The only arts I'd expect to do well in a BJJ comp are BJJ, JJJ and wrestling. Possibly sumo/mongolian wrestling as well. It's a very specific skillset, and if you don't train it you don't know it, no matter how good you are at striking/standup grappling.

You've basically got three options for self-defense in that regard. 1: Pray that you never end up on the ground. 2: Learn a ground-grappling sport. 3: Spend a lot of time learning (and practicing against grapplers) escapes to get back to your feet. Obviously 2 is ideal, but 3 can work too, and would still result in you losing the tournaments.

winning or losing the competitions is less important than competing. Win or lose, you will know more about your skilkset than if you just didn't compete.

Also, judoka areaare competent grapplers and tend to do better without training than a wrestler. Wrestlers often keep their hips high and so are pretty easy to sweep, and also tend to give up their backs to avoid a pin. Doesn't take long to fix these bad habits but without training they are common.

 

[Steve]

Why do you care so much about other people do or don’t do....like I said...insecure

Well in fairness the OP asked the question. Why are you so interested in stifling the discussion and shouting down opinions that are different from your own?