Guardian
Black Belt
All the comments have been used. Nothing more to say other then. I've seen it all now.
Play the Game - and Protect Your Life
- Thread starter TaiChiTJ
- Start date
ninjachamp3
White Belt
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2009
- Messages
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Too often in the martial arts, students learn self-defense that is unrealistic and possibly detrimental to the defender. When it comes to practicality, fight with facts, do not be fooled by your training. Below is only a small list of realities that you can use as a guide to build a better basis for your protection.
- Most fights end up on the ground.
Prepare by improving your grappling skills. - There are no rules and no judges in combat.
If it works, use it, and do not stop until it does. - Kicks above the waist are unrealistic.
It is better to be safe than sorry. - How you train is how you will fight.
If it is not contact you will be surprised. - Point sparring is not realistic for true combat.
Pull your punches and pull your chances. - Most people punch to the face or head.
Get used to hooks and crosses, wild and fast. - Attackers do not hold their punch in the air.
Learn to control your opponent, not dance around a frozen one. - Everything is forgotten in a fight.
All defenses will be natural reactions from years of practice. - Punches and kicks can hurt you too.
The attacker might also be prepared, do not underestimate an
opponent. - Most punches and kicks are off target, thus useless.
Do not waste energy, focus on primary striking areas. - Reality is nothing like a movie.
Survival is the name and it is not a game.
Chris Parker
Grandmaster
Hmm. While I agree in principle with the basic concept you're talking about here, the specifics I think need some work.
To begin with, you talk about students learning self defence that is unrealistic or possibly detrimental, which I agree with, but you then go on to say a few things that are less correct. You state that people should fight with facts, and not be fooled by their training... not exactly sure what you mean by that. It reads as if you are saying that if you get into a fight, use common sense instead of anything you have been taught, as what you have been taught may not be right. Is that a correct reading of your statement? If so, then what is the point, in your opinion, of training in anything whatsoever, as it could be "fooling" you? And what place do facts come into it? Facts are a part of your conscious processing, and as you yourself state a little later, that goes pretty much straight away. So facts will have no place, and training should be ignored? Okay.
As to your "realities", some are fine, others need clarification. To start with, number one. The propulgated idea that most fights go to ground is a little erroneous, and originates from a study of LEOs based on their prevalent tactic of taking the bad guy down in order to cuff them. It was then latched onto by the Gracies and their counterparts to aid in the promotion of BJJ back in the day, and doesn't seem to go away. But, in short, no, they don't. At least, not to the point of groundfighting, it is more often slipping, getting back up, and so on.
Number 2 is fine, to a point. For one thing, by being so definate in your phrasing, you are not taking into account the different circumstances you may find yourself in. "Not stopping until it (works)" can lead to being overly aggressive, and that can lead to jail. But you whole premise here is a little flawed. Your exact "reality" is as follows: If it works, use it, and don't stop until it does. If it works, and it is applicable to the situation, then use it. If it is a viable tactic/technique, you apply it, and it doesn't work, don't keep going, change to something else. If it works, there is no need to continue.
Oh, and you contradict yourself later. We'll get to that.
Number 3. Such blanket statements are dangerous as they can leave you open to things you discount, you miss openings, and basically limit yourself. For the record, I don't do any high kicks, but I don't discount them completely, and I'm sure our Tae Kwon Do guys here (and others, obviously) will be very comfortable with their ability to use their high kicks realistically.
Number 4 is okay, but it actually goes a lot deeper than you seem to be aware of here. Contact in some form I feel is essential if a realistic self defence is what you are after, but that is one tiny part of it, and is not even the most important. And if the way you train is the way you fight, how do you not get "fooled" by your training and fight with facts instead, as you originally stated?
Number 5 is only dealing with one form of training. And bear in mind that not everyone will be training for self defence, or the same reasons that you are. And really, point sparring has some definate benefits, so another blanket statement about something you don't train in aren't really what I will consider informed commentary.
Six is good again, but limited. For example, most knife attacks are shanking style actions to the body. I'd suggest, if true self defence is what you are after, get used to recognise those actions as well as others, as you won't see the knife. Really, you just won't.
With number 7, ha, yes. The problem is that too many people take the training drills and skill building exercises as self defence techniques, and that is one thing that leads to such training habits. But yes, agree completely.
Number 8, though, again contradicts your opening statements. Here we are dealing with the effects of adrenaline and acing under stress and pressure. And the important thing is to know how to train to make the most of that, recognise what the effects will be, what the restrictions and limitations will be, and how to deal with it all. Really, if you forget everything, what use is the training?
For the last few, they're pretty good. So I have little to add. But one thing I will say is that you may look to your own understanding, as you are contradicting yourself a fair bit here. Your first point is about most fights going to the ground, and that is the last mention of a grappling/ground range you mention. So it would appear that although you consciously believe it, you really don't on an unconscious level. And that usually stems from one of a couple of sources, but I won't go into those here. I simply suggest you look closer at what you actually believe, as it is a little confused here.
To begin with, you talk about students learning self defence that is unrealistic or possibly detrimental, which I agree with, but you then go on to say a few things that are less correct. You state that people should fight with facts, and not be fooled by their training... not exactly sure what you mean by that. It reads as if you are saying that if you get into a fight, use common sense instead of anything you have been taught, as what you have been taught may not be right. Is that a correct reading of your statement? If so, then what is the point, in your opinion, of training in anything whatsoever, as it could be "fooling" you? And what place do facts come into it? Facts are a part of your conscious processing, and as you yourself state a little later, that goes pretty much straight away. So facts will have no place, and training should be ignored? Okay.
As to your "realities", some are fine, others need clarification. To start with, number one. The propulgated idea that most fights go to ground is a little erroneous, and originates from a study of LEOs based on their prevalent tactic of taking the bad guy down in order to cuff them. It was then latched onto by the Gracies and their counterparts to aid in the promotion of BJJ back in the day, and doesn't seem to go away. But, in short, no, they don't. At least, not to the point of groundfighting, it is more often slipping, getting back up, and so on.
Number 2 is fine, to a point. For one thing, by being so definate in your phrasing, you are not taking into account the different circumstances you may find yourself in. "Not stopping until it (works)" can lead to being overly aggressive, and that can lead to jail. But you whole premise here is a little flawed. Your exact "reality" is as follows: If it works, use it, and don't stop until it does. If it works, and it is applicable to the situation, then use it. If it is a viable tactic/technique, you apply it, and it doesn't work, don't keep going, change to something else. If it works, there is no need to continue.
Oh, and you contradict yourself later. We'll get to that.
Number 3. Such blanket statements are dangerous as they can leave you open to things you discount, you miss openings, and basically limit yourself. For the record, I don't do any high kicks, but I don't discount them completely, and I'm sure our Tae Kwon Do guys here (and others, obviously) will be very comfortable with their ability to use their high kicks realistically.
Number 4 is okay, but it actually goes a lot deeper than you seem to be aware of here. Contact in some form I feel is essential if a realistic self defence is what you are after, but that is one tiny part of it, and is not even the most important. And if the way you train is the way you fight, how do you not get "fooled" by your training and fight with facts instead, as you originally stated?
Number 5 is only dealing with one form of training. And bear in mind that not everyone will be training for self defence, or the same reasons that you are. And really, point sparring has some definate benefits, so another blanket statement about something you don't train in aren't really what I will consider informed commentary.
Six is good again, but limited. For example, most knife attacks are shanking style actions to the body. I'd suggest, if true self defence is what you are after, get used to recognise those actions as well as others, as you won't see the knife. Really, you just won't.
With number 7, ha, yes. The problem is that too many people take the training drills and skill building exercises as self defence techniques, and that is one thing that leads to such training habits. But yes, agree completely.
Number 8, though, again contradicts your opening statements. Here we are dealing with the effects of adrenaline and acing under stress and pressure. And the important thing is to know how to train to make the most of that, recognise what the effects will be, what the restrictions and limitations will be, and how to deal with it all. Really, if you forget everything, what use is the training?
For the last few, they're pretty good. So I have little to add. But one thing I will say is that you may look to your own understanding, as you are contradicting yourself a fair bit here. Your first point is about most fights going to the ground, and that is the last mention of a grappling/ground range you mention. So it would appear that although you consciously believe it, you really don't on an unconscious level. And that usually stems from one of a couple of sources, but I won't go into those here. I simply suggest you look closer at what you actually believe, as it is a little confused here.
Xue Sheng
All weight is underside
Thank You :asian:
I was about to start a thread asking for proof of that statement because to be honest I am getting sick of it. Sadly I have been in a few fights in my time and only one ended up as a fight on the ground any other altercation that ended up on the ground was for restraint purposes, when I was security in a hospital with a mental health and detox unit.
