Everyone say kicking is not pactical in Self defense well what is your take on it, why or why not?
Kicks Kicks and more Kicks
- Thread starter terryl965
- Start date
Whoa, there!
I, for one, have never said kicks are not practical in self-defense. I have said that HIGH kicks are seldom practical, but even then I leave the window open for the opportunity that may arise, for the right person, in the right circumstances.
For practical self-defense, I generally feel that kicks from the waist down are about all that will commonly be useful. You're not compromising your balance for as long, they're not as easy to see (or stop), and you're less likely to need either a warm-up or loose clothes to be able to do them. Most people are also more likely to be able to execute lower kicks with more power, accuracy, and effect. But that don't mean kicks are useless!
I, for one, have never said kicks are not practical in self-defense. I have said that HIGH kicks are seldom practical, but even then I leave the window open for the opportunity that may arise, for the right person, in the right circumstances.
For practical self-defense, I generally feel that kicks from the waist down are about all that will commonly be useful. You're not compromising your balance for as long, they're not as easy to see (or stop), and you're less likely to need either a warm-up or loose clothes to be able to do them. Most people are also more likely to be able to execute lower kicks with more power, accuracy, and effect. But that don't mean kicks are useless!
OP
- Thread Starter
- #3
I would agree below the waist is the best for most cases. I'm asking this for this reason tonight at dinner a friend that has no Martial Art training was looking at different Arts to take, he ask me about my programs and I told him and aso told him to check out some other style he was interested in and come back and talk when we was talking to gentleman that runs the Grabbling school told him that no art that throws kick could be any good for a SD way of life. He told him all kicks are worthless.
Sounds like a grappler who's never been in a real fight. Kicks, punches, locks, holds, & throws all have a place in defending yourself, and they can all be the wrong choice, too. What good is that grappler's skill gonna do when you kick out his knee -- or, since I suspect you are one of those who can use high kicks effectively, you knock him out with a round kick to the chin...
Knock me to the ground, and I'll use kicks to keep you away until I can regain my feet -- or even to take you down so that I can get up!
dancingalone
Grandmaster
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Well, I'll argue that a complete martial artist should be versed in all ranges, long, medium, and close. Kicking is an obvious weapon when fighting in the long range, and it can even be used as an effective means to close the gap and get into grappling distance if that's what you prefer to do.
newGuy12
Master of Arts
High kicks can be absolutely devastating, *IF* the one doing the kicking is proficient enough.
Many people live and die without ever meeting anyone that skillful. I have known people who are that skillful. A high kick can bust someone's head, its no joke.
Many people live and die without ever meeting anyone that skillful. I have known people who are that skillful. A high kick can bust someone's head, its no joke.
Legs are (generally) longer and stronger than arms - and therefore I'd rather kick than punch. People who say that kicks, in general, are ineffective in SD are those who have no experience with kicking and/or SD.
That's one of the main reasons why our organization doesn't allow head kicking in sparring at our tournament. A kick to the head can do serious damage when done well. And that between trained martial artists. Now imagine that same kick done to an untrained martial artist or drunk.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #10
This is true
CoryKS
Senior Master
Didn't think there was a man alive that had never been kicked in the sack before. I guess there's at least one.
I fully concur that high kicks, performed 'cold', in normal clothes, on possibly uncertain surfaces would not be a choice I would make. Low kicks are much more sensible. In my Lau gar days, my 'style' would often fall into the pattern of defending with the arms and attacking with the legs - after all, as Kacey said above, legs are stronger 
.
To say that all kicking techniques have no value is a falsehood (as I can attest from practical experience) and the chap Terry's talking about could do with a little 'view correction' on the martial arts front.
.To say that all kicking techniques have no value is a falsehood (as I can attest from practical experience) and the chap Terry's talking about could do with a little 'view correction' on the martial arts front.
Miles
Senior Master
ROFLOL! To say no kick has value is pretty silly in general and absolute heresy in TKD circles. Even among trained fighters-TKD, MMA, etc., there are a number of knock-outs using kicks.
Miles
OP
- Thread Starter
- #14
LMAO I never really tought of that should have.
FearlessFreep
Senior Master
No personal experience but I've talked to enough people who have and read enough news stories and stuff to know that kicking "can" be (has been) effective, even high kicking. But like joint locks and many other techniques, for it to be effective you have to *really* know how to do it and mostly *when* to do it in the midst of the encounter. Kicking and *especially* (head) high kicking is a high-risk, high-reward scenario.... minimize the risk by training, especially situational training to know when to throw a technique
Even in "No Rules" competitions (UFC, Pride, etc...) there are a few who have excellent head-high kicking techniques who train them well and then use them well again highly trained opponents who know it may be coming.
I think one big issue in using (high) kicks for self-defense is explaining to the jury why you did a jump spin hook to the guys head rather than something a little less... devastating
But the setups and scenarios for SD are a lot different than sparring
Just anecdotal and speculative information, no personal experience
Even in "No Rules" competitions (UFC, Pride, etc...) there are a few who have excellent head-high kicking techniques who train them well and then use them well again highly trained opponents who know it may be coming.
I think one big issue in using (high) kicks for self-defense is explaining to the jury why you did a jump spin hook to the guys head rather than something a little less... devastating
But the setups and scenarios for SD are a lot different than sparring
Just anecdotal and speculative information, no personal experience
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Well it's real simple:
Basic physiology tells us that when an average person stands normally still, their hands come to rest give or take just above the middle of the thigh.
It naturally follows then, that If you choose to kick higher than the mid thigh, and do NOT *also* do something to make their hands unable to catch the kick, that you have decided to run the risk of your kick being caught.*shrug*
I generally like a front/round kick to just above the knee on the femoral nerve inside the thigh. The one time i used it ( I was surprised by a coworker who thought it would be cute to "ambush" me) i found quite by accident that kicking there without even a huge amount of force, made the guy's legs give out and he fell. He wasn't seriously injured but never tried that again.
I am not someone whose current leg flexibility and current kicking skill make high kicks a realistic option , however, if you are such a fortunate individual, and you have tied up the attacker's hands( say as an example, you've moved a bit off to his left and youre left hand has grabbed/pulled his left arm straight such that he cannot use it to block your kick and exposes his left flank), then by all means--Fire The Headsmasher. You now even have the legal argument that all your other tools were tied up and he was still a threat and that was your only option to end it ASAP, so there you go
Basic physiology tells us that when an average person stands normally still, their hands come to rest give or take just above the middle of the thigh.
It naturally follows then, that If you choose to kick higher than the mid thigh, and do NOT *also* do something to make their hands unable to catch the kick, that you have decided to run the risk of your kick being caught.*shrug*
I generally like a front/round kick to just above the knee on the femoral nerve inside the thigh. The one time i used it ( I was surprised by a coworker who thought it would be cute to "ambush" me) i found quite by accident that kicking there without even a huge amount of force, made the guy's legs give out and he fell. He wasn't seriously injured but never tried that again.
I am not someone whose current leg flexibility and current kicking skill make high kicks a realistic option , however, if you are such a fortunate individual, and you have tied up the attacker's hands( say as an example, you've moved a bit off to his left and youre left hand has grabbed/pulled his left arm straight such that he cannot use it to block your kick and exposes his left flank), then by all means--Fire The Headsmasher. You now even have the legal argument that all your other tools were tied up and he was still a threat and that was your only option to end it ASAP, so there you go
FearlessFreep
Senior Master
Every technique has a counter. You really only have two choices, actively work to eliminate the counter, or beat the counter (speed, strength, whatever).
As I said, kicking is "high-risk, high-reward". Work to mitigate the risk if that's the reward you want
As I said, kicking is "high-risk, high-reward". Work to mitigate the risk if that's the reward you want
FearlessFreep
Senior Master
average person.
Average defender or average attacker?
Average defender or average attacker?
Sorry...
For the person who is not trained at throwing high kicks.
Even me I wouldn't try to kick someone in the head unless I was doing MMA. The only kick I would use in a street fight would be a front kick to the groin. I wouldn't use a front leg round kick. I think it would do little. As for a back leg round kick you can see it coming and you have to pivot more which (for me ) would be kinda ackward and (in my opinion) would leave you open for attck if you aren't fast enough. I wouldn't do a side kick either and as for hook kicks, axe kicks, cresent kicks those are the last things I would use in a fight.
I would never throw a head kick. Period.
Unless of course I was fighting in the UFC or Pride.
For the person who is not trained at throwing high kicks.
Even me I wouldn't try to kick someone in the head unless I was doing MMA. The only kick I would use in a street fight would be a front kick to the groin. I wouldn't use a front leg round kick. I think it would do little. As for a back leg round kick you can see it coming and you have to pivot more which (for me ) would be kinda ackward and (in my opinion) would leave you open for attck if you aren't fast enough. I wouldn't do a side kick either and as for hook kicks, axe kicks, cresent kicks those are the last things I would use in a fight.
I would never throw a head kick. Period.
Unless of course I was fighting in the UFC or Pride.
