Keysi Fighting Method/Defence Lab

Discussion in 'Western Martial Arts - General' started by Serpent Raptor, Jul 3, 2016.

  1. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

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    Does that hammer fist carry power? You said no power, it clearly has power, certainly enough to hurt someone, you can generate significant power with just your arm
     
  2. veritasAequitas

    veritasAequitas Green Belt

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    No power relative to a technique that uses the same line and your kinetic chain.


    Why don't you see muay Thai fighter's doing this?
     
  3. veritasAequitas

    veritasAequitas Green Belt

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    Would you rather me upper cut you or do that hammer fist?
     
  4. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

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    So it has power then and your previous statement it had no power was in error
     
  5. veritasAequitas

    veritasAequitas Green Belt

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    Relatively yes. Now answer the question, why do it?
     
  6. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

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    That's not really a reasonable question, you have to throw from the position your arm is in after the previous stike, which in the case was an elbow, then it's a time thing, reposition your arm for an upper cut, or throw the hammer, I've broken people noses, with a similar stike, so it more than effective, but no you probably won't knock them out, but if they are still standing after good elbow strikes your in trouble anyway
     
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  7. veritasAequitas

    veritasAequitas Green Belt

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    Thus my point about forcing, framing like defense does forces you to use less effective techniques.
    There isn't at elbow strike to the head till the third beat.
    How do you break a nose like that? The strike is under the jaw.

    How is this better than muay Thai cover,elbow to face?

    Instead of frame 3, upper hammer, frame2 elbow to body, to an ascending elbow.

    Do you not see all the point's of failure?
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2018
  8. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

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    PuncheS that travel a long way are general more powerful than those that go a shorter distance, so why not just throw haymakers, lots of people do,

    Well for one the longer distance takes longer to set up and longer to travel, so your trading power for efficiency, or a softer blow that is more likely to land as they have less time to move Or to counter punch
     
  9. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

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    I missed and hit his nose
     
  10. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

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    No one's claimed it better than MT,nothing is better than MT in my opinion, but that's not out discussion, which is the relative merits of bjj, and dl
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2018
  11. veritasAequitas

    veritasAequitas Green Belt

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    No it isn't the point is don't you see how this is a stupid system that uses long format drills that have so many point's of failure there's no way you can do it realistically.
     
  12. veritasAequitas

    veritasAequitas Green Belt

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    Seeing as defense lab is based on inosanto jkd/Kali as well as bjj why are we not comparing that?
     
  13. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

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    If you hit someone with aBarragee of elbows followed by a hammer fist, they will be in pretty bad shape, so that's a realistic technique for self defence, you picked thatVid as an example and that example shows a practical and effective technique, even if the hammer fist at the end isn't optimal and from where your arms are after the elbows, there's a limit to what you can do very quickly, in the same place I would have head butTed him to be honest, but that's just my preference, But if I catch them with a good elbow, I rather expect them to fall ovet, so the point is open
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2018
  14. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

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    Mostly coz you claimed bjj, was better, and that what we are discusing, are you also claiming bjj, is better than jkd,
     
  15. veritasAequitas

    veritasAequitas Green Belt

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    Because it is, the ground game of defence lab is bjj with skin tears and forced usage of framing
     
  16. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

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    Well clearly the ground game is NOT bjj, or it would include that mount escape you keep going on about,
     
  17. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    Not sure what any of that has to do with my statement.
     
  18. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    That's not how it works, either. Phrases, when used as accepted terms, have whatever definition they are accepted to have. That definition may or may not be tied to the actual definitions of the words making up that phrase. Words aren't numbers - you don't simply add them together to get a new meaning.
     
  19. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    I know the point you're trying to make, and I think it's a good one. But frankly in the chaos of a fight, things like this can be useful. Sometimes it's helpful to force a student into a position where you take away their "best" options to help build other options. Of course, if the overall approach (as you are implying) does this too much, then there's not enough training of the "best" options.
     
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  20. veritasAequitas

    veritasAequitas Green Belt

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    Except it is, its a mount escape with skin tears.

    Except you dont trap the arm or leg you use pain and force to drag the person of.

    If the person has base it posture it won't work, they will clear your arms and hit you.
     

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