Issue Belts to Son?

[Rumy73]

Exactly, in Kukkiwon terms a 1-3rd Dan is only a trainee and not an instructor yet. In Korea that doesn't happen until they get their 4th Dan and have sat the instructor course at the Kukkiwon.

I respect kkw tkd very much. However, the extra costs and mandatory extra programs schools attach to the pursuit of rank stopped my pursuit of a higher dan ranking. Maybe when we go back to Seoul, I will just test at the kkw.

 

[Kong Soo Do]

I have 1st dan "official status" (meaning I was sucker enough to pay for it) in TKD and HKD. I was wondering what the rules/ethics of issuing belts to my son who is learning TKD? I am de-enrolling him from a McDojo, as the contract is up. I want him to continue to learn and when it is appropriate, I would issue a higher belt. Suggestions?

Many arts were passed down from father to son, with no rank involved and it did just fine. Some orbs say you need to be 4th Dan to promote, but that is an arbitrary standard with more financial motivation than technical validity. Assuming your competent to teach the art, I see no issue whatsoever. I'm teaching my own son and his school group. So I say teach him and enjoy the time you spend with him.

 

[Earl Weiss]

Maybe your son should watch this:

 

[Rumy73]

Maybe your son should watch this:

Ok because much is lost in translation... When i say you are acting like an ***, i mean it as a joke.

 

[Earl Weiss]

Ok because much is lost in translation... When i say you are acting like an ***, i mean it as a joke.

OK, color me stupid. Have no idea why this is the response to post with the Karate kid video. (seems to reinforce your feelings about belts) If you want to take it to PM that's fine.

 

[outsider0506]

A couple of years ago our instructor closed shop, leaving my daughter and I without a school. At that time she was a green belt (4th Keup) and I was a Kukkiwon 2nd Dan. My options were to enroll her in another WTF school or train her myself at home and have our old instructor certify her for 1st Poom (Kukkiwon Jr. Blackbelt) when the time came.

So much of what we learn in TKD sparring comes from working with people of similar size and skill levels; especially in sparring. It really helps in developing skills without having the student be frustrated when working with someone of much greater size and/or much greater skill all the time. Also, learning to deal with a variety of opponent's skills and styles is preferable to only dealing with one or two.

My choice was to enroll my daughter in a school with an exceptionally strong sparring program for kids, but was very inconvenient for me to get to. For us, it was worth it because my daughter got the skills I was hoping for and was able to continue and excel at her competitive career.

The bottom line is that if you're looking at teaching your kid in a traditional manner, and you're not worried about certification or competition, you're fine to teach him on your own. If you're looking for external validation/recognition or competition, you should seek a school that will fulfill your needs.

 

[Kong Soo Do]

Or seek an organization that will back you with what you're doing, provide whatever support they can and not charge you expensive fees when it comes time to Dan testing and certification. One that offers free semi annual seminars. Now where would one find an organization like that? Perhaps in someone's sig line....

Yeah, shameless plug.

 

[TKDTony2179]

When an organization only requires 6 years to go from 1st Dan to 4th Dan that's not very surprising.

That sounds about how long it would take us to move up rank. Isn't it about whatever rank you are you hold it until and then test and move up? Like 1 dan 1yr, 2nd dan 2yrs and etc. When I do the math that sounds right. Upon that 6 yr you should either test for that 4th dan or getting ready to test.

 

[Archtkd]

When an organization only requires 6 years to go from 1st Dan to 4th Dan that's not very surprising.

What is not surprising? That 4th dans can issue their own guep certificates or that it takes about nine years -- at the minimum -- to get to 4th dan?

 

[RTKDCMB]

That sounds about how long it would take us to move up rank. Isn't it about whatever rank you are you hold it until and then test and move up? Like 1 dan 1yr, 2nd dan 2yrs and etc. When I do the math that sounds right. Upon that 6 yr you should either test for that 4th dan or getting ready to test.

IMHO 6 years sounds about how long it should take to get from 1st to 2nd Dan, and that's being conservative.

 

[andyjeffries]

IMHO 6 years sounds about how long it should take to get from 1st to 2nd Dan, and that's being conservative.

You're kidding, right?

In my mind, rank progression provides two things 1)a motivational opportunity and 2)a goal to aim towards peaking for. As you get higher in rank (and 1st/2nd Dan isn't high rank) the gradings get further apart for motivation, but you should still aim test when the time limits have been met so that you are working hard to be ready at that time (peaking) and therefore improving your overall skill level.

I think if a 1st Dan waits for 6 years to test for 2nd Dan, they have either been coasting and not really training hard during that time; or they have been, but just aren't as far along with rank as they should be. Particularly, 1st-2nd Dan is just a filter period - do people quit once they've got their coveted black belt - or do they then knuckle down and get ready to go further. It doesn't take long to find out what kind of person they are and when you do, then move them on (either way).

Each to their own though...

 

[Dirty Dog]

IMHO 6 years sounds about how long it should take to get from 1st to 2nd Dan, and that's being conservative.

Seriously?
So all Grandmasters would be at least 147 years old?

Seems a bit much, to me. I think it's reasonable to reach Grandmaster by the time you're 97 or 98...

 

[RTKDCMB]

Seriously?
So all Grandmasters would be at least 147 years old?

Not when they are 147 years old but not when they are 35 years old either.

 

[Jaeimseu]

Not when they are 147 years old but not when they are 35 years old either.

If 6 years is a conservative estimate from 1st to 2nd, what would be the minimum time from 3 to 4, 4 to 5, etc? And how long from white belt to 1st?

Sent from my SHV-E210K using Tapatalk 2

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

I have 1st dan "official status" (meaning I was sucker enough to pay for it) in TKD and HKD. I was wondering what the rules/ethics of issuing belts to my son who is learning TKD? I am de-enrolling him from a McDojo, as the contract is up. I want him to continue to learn and when it is appropriate, I would issue a higher belt. Suggestions?

If you know the material well enough to teach it, go for it. If you're teaching KKW TKD, I would strongly suggest the KKW textbook. It has a wealth of information in it. As I recall, you read Korean. The book has both English and Korean language and is well illustrated.

Secondly, so far as I know, WTF competition doesn't require you to be a member or training at a member school in order to compete, so non affiliation isn't an inhibitor to competition. I would suggest getting up to speed on the current WTF rules if you haven't competed in a while.

Presumably, you're teaching him as an independent. Nothing wrong with that. I teach as an independent as well.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

IMHO 6 years sounds about how long it should take to get from 1st to 2nd Dan, and that's being conservative.

I don't know of any organization that places that kind of time in grade requirement on a promotion for first to second. I don't even think Gracie Jiu Jitsu had that kind of requirement when they got the respect for having integrity in grading. Most schools that want to make their gradings "mean more" tend to stretch out the time in colored belts. I know some organizaitons require a time in grade equivalent to the dan grade you're going for, but that would still be only two years from first to second.

Integrity in grading isn't dependent upon time in grade but on clear communication as to what each grade represents and not promoting students who haven't met the standard. KKW grading requirements are fine, in and of themselves. The problems arise when the belt system is turned into a profit margin padding device and the black belt is inflated to mean more than the KKW makes it mean in order to justify an insane price tag, while students are being hurried through colored belts in order to grab as much money as quickly as possible.

 

[IcemanSK]

Not when they are 147 years old but not when they are 35 years old either.

According to the Kukkiwon textbook, the minimum age for 7th Dan (grandmaster) is 36 years old (Article #8). I'm curious as to what you think is so wrong about a 36 year old being named a grandmaster. Do you think that about other professions? It's not uncommon in the US for surgeons to be completely able to perform surgery at 30 years old. Is 30 too young to perform surgery due to maturity issues? Taekwondo is not surgery. Let's not pretend that what we're doing as needing the maturity level as surgery.

 

[RTKDCMB]

If 6 years is a conservative estimate from 1st to 2nd, what would be the minimum time from 3 to 4, 4 to 5, etc? And how long from white belt to 1st?

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In my school there are no minimum times, it depends on the student and the circumstances (i.e. how often they can get to class, the age they start etc.) Someone who starts at 7 years old might take 10 years to get to 1st Dan from white belt whilst an adult who picks things up easily, has good technique and has the right attitude could do it in 18 months (fastest ever) with the current color belt grading system. 2nd Dan comes after you have been an instructor for a few years and to be an instructor you have to be an adult with a 1st Dan, not a junior black belt. It might take a year or more to become an instructor and a few more years before you will be considered to run your own branch. 2nd ti 3rd Dan seems to take on average 4-6 years. All of the 4th Dans that I know personally have about 30-35 years of experience. I have never met any of our 5th Dans as they are interstate, there has only been about 5 that I know of, including the only 6th Dan promoted by the founding masters and he had about 45 years of experience. I realize other Taekwondo styles have a different grading system, and that's ok, to each their own. There is no consistency in Dan rankings between schools even in the same art let alone other arts so its not a very accurate measure of ones ability, knowledge and experience to anyone outside their own organization.

 

[RTKDCMB]

According to the Kukkiwon textbook, the minimum age for 7th Dan (grandmaster) is 36 years old (Article #8). I'm curious as to what you think is so wrong about a 36 year old being named a grandmaster.

You will probably find that most other martial arts styles will not have 7th Dans that young and that grandmasters are often 9th Dans and above.

Do you think that about other professions? It's not uncommon in the US for surgeons to be completely able to perform surgery at 30 years old. Is 30 too young to perform surgery due to maturity issues? Taekwondo is not surgery. Let's not pretend that what we're doing as needing the maturity level as surgery.

Its an analogy, it doesn't have to be literal.

 

[RTKDCMB]

I don't know of any organization that places that kind of time in grade requirement on a promotion for first to second. I don't even think Gracie Jiu Jitsu had that kind of requirement when they got the respect for having integrity in grading. Most schools that want to make their gradings "mean more" tend to stretch out the time in colored belts. I know some organizaitons require a time in grade equivalent to the dan grade you're going for, but that would still be only two years from first to second.

Integrity in grading isn't dependent upon time in grade but on clear communication as to what each grade represents and not promoting students who haven't met the standard. KKW grading requirements are fine, in and of themselves. The problems arise when the belt system is turned into a profit margin padding device and the black belt is inflated to mean more than the KKW makes it mean in order to justify an insane price tag, while students are being hurried through colored belts in order to grab as much money as quickly as possible.

We don't actually have a time in grade requirement, promotion to higher Dans is by invitation only.