How often do you use the more fancier Kicks?

[Instructor]

i am getting more and more convinced there are several people on this board who have never in thier lives been hit by an ungloved hand.....

Oh man...it sucks!

 

[Instructor]

A boxer hit me once without the glove. He had his hands wrapped really tightly with some kind of tape. It was like getting hit with a rock.

 

[ralphmcpherson]

So is your training geared toward protecting yourself in drunken bar fights, with a methodology based on info culled from drunks exchanging blows and data and advise filtered from cop stories? What is the role of your sabum in all this?

Oh, and I know one or two things about the "real" world and that knowledge doesn’t stop me from making a daily effort of sharpening one of my main weapons: my legs.

I live in a place that last year was infamously ranked (http://urbantitan.com/10-most-dangerous-cities-in-the-world-in-2011/) as the most dangerous city in America and the 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] most dangerous city in the world: St. Louis, Missouri. Three years ago there was a gun fight outside my dojang at about 7 p.m. Two years ago a rookie student of mine was gunned down in the city, and I didn’t know about it because his death was buried deep inside the newspaper, overtaken by a page one story, about a deadly shootout of gangbangers at a wake in a funeral home, a few blocks from my dojang.
In the early 1990s I lived and attended university, worked and taught and studied taekwondo in another city with high ranking on the most dangerous city list, Kankakee, Illinois. This was at the height of the crack cocaine wars. In my early journalism day, I worked on the police beat for the Daily Journal (Kankakee) and later went on to cover major crimes as part of my newsman job for the Associated Press.

My taekwondo students – in a predominantly adult dojang -- include people who know violence in and out. They include old-school taekwondoin, elite special forces vets, regular military vets, cops, and security personnel.

Our training is geared towards self defence, whether it be in a pub, a dark alley, the school yard, walking along the street, wherever it may occur. My instructor's role in this is to best prepare us for these sorts of altercations. He regularly seeks advice from two 6th dan high ranking police officers who train in our class, he quite often lets them take the class and they run us through a variety of self defence scenarios which is always interesting and informative, especially considering one of them works in training police recruits in unarmed fighting. Our school has a curriculum yet lets each instructor put their own 'flavour' to what they teach. My instructor's 'flavour' is making sure his students are are as best prepared as possible to defend themself, he is the first to admit that there is no sure fire way to ensure everyone can fight if need be, but does his best to cover all areas of attacking and being attacked. He loves kicking and teaches a lot of kicking but is sure to keep us 'realistic' as to what the higher % techniques are. Most of his defence is centred around defending things that will most probably occur in a real situation. He teaches wtf sparring to improve our reflexes, distancing, timing and to help improve our kicking. He uses many other forms of sparring though because he believes constant sparring under that ruleset encourages bad habits not conducive to real situations. His favourite form of sparring is a 'knockdown' type where basically anything goes (except for the obvious) and the idea is to knock your opponent to the floor as quickly as possible.

 

[Archtkd]

His favourite form of sparring is a 'knockdown' type where basically anything goes (except for the obvious) and the idea is to knock your opponent to the floor as quickly as possible.

That sounds interesting. Do you have a line of people doing it? Meaning does the person who wins remain standing until someone knocks him to the floor? What are the basic takedowns used?

 

[Instructor]

That sounds interesting. Do you have a line of people doing it? Meaning does the person who wins remain standing until someone knocks him to the floor? What are the basic takedowns used?

Knocking down high kickers is not really all that difficult.

 

[ralphmcpherson]

A boxer hit me once without the glove. He had his hands wrapped really tightly with some kind of tape. It was like getting hit with a rock.

I got in a fight in high school with a boxer (I didnt know at the time he was a boxer), I had been doing a couple of years of shotokan at the time and when the fight started I threw two good front kicks, the second one got him pretty good. Just as I was thinking I had him covered he hit me with so many punches to the face I didnt know what was happening. Each one hurt, and hurt bad. I tried to defend my face, so he just pounded my ribs and stomach. In no time I was lying on the ground covered in blood from a broken nose and two black eyes and badly winded. I still have nightmares about that, the punches were like bullets.

 

[ralphmcpherson]

That sounds interesting. Do you have a line of people doing it? Meaning does the person who wins remain standing until someone knocks him to the floor? What are the basic takedowns used?

He mixes it up a lot. He also mixes up the ruleset in this form a lot to keep us on our toes. Usually we get a partner, spar fro 30 seconds and then rotate clockwise so we get to spar a few different people. Once experienced, it gets rarer that someone gets knocked down as it really improves your evasiveness. Most times someone is knocked down its because of a quick combination, such as a couple of quick punches, then a sidekick. Against lower belts, they will generally charge in with no thought of self preservation and end up charging into a prop side kick. It really varies though, as most people work to their strengths and everyone has diffent strengths obviously. Turning side kick works a lot, or a good punch. Usually a good punch is evaded leaving the defender off balance and then they are easy to knockdown. Knowing your opponent's main goal is to knock you down as quickly as possible, and vice versa, gives you a different mindset to normal sparring where people are going for points or combinations. It works well in conjunction with other forms of sparring. Its great fun, give it a try. Another one we do is to have 5 people with 4 on each corner of a square (5m x 5m) with one in the middle. When the instructor yells "go" one of the 4 can run in and try to knock the guy in the middle down, each time the instructor yells "go" a different attacker shouts and then runs in and takes over while the other returns to the vacant corner. The idea for the attackers (who can come in in any order they like) is to send in whoever is in the defenders blindspot each time. The instructor mixes up how long each attacker is in there for, it may be 30 seconds, it may be 5 seconds, it may be 1 second. The guy in the middle gets a real workout and has no idea who will come in next so must keep an eye on all angles. This one is heaps of fun.

 

[Instructor]

Yep....boxing, safe to say is the king of all punching.

 

[mastercole]

Knocking down high kickers is not really all that difficult.

Unless of course the high kick knocks you out before you can do anything about it, then it becomes very difficult.

It's the skill of the kicker compared to the kicked that determines everything when it comes to kicking. I can certainly down a person of low skill who attempts to kick me high, or anywhere for that matter. However, a highly skilled elite kicker can kick a lower skill person from the bottom of their ****, to the top of their head at will.

 

[Twin Fist]

keep thinking that

 

[Instructor]

Unless of course the high kick knocks you out before you can do anything about it, then it becomes very difficult.

It's the skill of the kicker compared to the kicked that determines everything when it comes to kicking. I can certainly down a person of low skill who attempts to kick me high, or anywhere for that matter. However, a highly skilled elite kicker can kick a lower skill person from the bottom of their ****, to the top of their head at will.

Admittedly I seldom run across kickers of that skill level.

 

[Instructor]

I am not saying I am king high kicker of the universe but I taught my white belts how to sidestep and knock me on my *** in an afternoon and I've been kicking for 20 years or so.

 

[Emanuelle]

Most Taekwondo clubs in my area have a mandatory self-defence lesson once a week in addition to Olympic sparring the rest of the week, the fast, relatively complex or 'fancy' kicks help with balance, coordination and a bunch of the other stuff, and in the weekly SD lessons we learn practical variations of those techniques amongst others. It's a good system, and besides, most guys you encounter on the street will be taken aback, if only momentarily, if you unleash a barrage of fancy kicks, if you can manage them off.

Just my two cents,

 

[Gorilla]

Emanulle... Exactly...great post

 

[Archtkd]

Knocking down high kickers is not really all that difficult.

So is knocking down punchers with slow feet

 

[Archtkd]

I got in a fight in high school with a boxer (I didnt know at the time he was a boxer), I had been doing a couple of years of shotokan at the time and when the fight started I threw two good front kicks, the second one got him pretty good. Just as I was thinking I had him covered he hit me with so many punches to the face I didnt know what was happening. Each one hurt, and hurt bad. I tried to defend my face, so he just pounded my ribs and stomach. In no time I was lying on the ground covered in blood from a broken nose and two black eyes and badly winded. I still have nightmares about that, the punches were like bullets.

If you threw two good front kicks how come he was left standing? What was good about the kicks?

 

[Cyriacus]

If you threw two good front kicks how come he was left standing? What was good about the kicks?

I imagine the issue was Range.

Boxers get hit in the Midsection literally every time They Spar. Theyre used to it. Alot.
In order for a Front Kick to have been effective, it would have needed to have a good push in it. And for there to have been two Front Kicks, I imagine They werent too linear.

I also imagine They were good because They were forceful.

 

[ATC]

I let my son read this thred. He is an up and coming Olympic style competitor. He can throw the all of the fancy kicks with relitive ease, and this is what he said.

If in a street fight he would kick the body, then once bent over he would kick the head. He said that most people would be done from simple kicks to the body and that head kicks would not really be needed. He says that he only kicks to the head in competition becaues it scores more points. He also said that it is hard to kick people in competiton to the head because they train to look out for them. He states kicking people that don't train to defend from head kicks is easy and if in a street fight he could most likely kick anyone in the head easily if they were just non martial artist. So after that thought he said he would still kick the body first but if he could tell they were not tained he would end it quickly with a head kick.

When you compete you get to the point where you asses your opponent rather quickly. This is just how competitors think. This then leads me back to my statement of, if you can you will, and if you can't you won't. Many can't so they just put down or dismiss head, high, fancy, whatever kicks. The ones that can know when to and will. Those that think they can, but are not that good at it, will try and some will succeed, and some will fail. Simple as that.

No one can 100% say it works, and know one can 100% say it does not. It is up to each individual and that individuals skill level.

 

[Archtkd]

This then leads me back to my statement of, if you can you will, and if you can't you won't. Many can't so they just put down or dismiss head, high, fancy, whatever kicks. The ones that can know when to and will. Those that think they can, but are not that good at it, will try and some will succeed, and some will fail. Simple as that.

No one can 100% say it works, and know one can 100% say it does not. It is up to each individual and that individuals skill level.

Thank your son for us for his input in a great post.

 

[Cyriacus]

I let my son read this thred. He is an up and coming Olympic style competitor. He can throw the all of the fancy kicks with relitive ease, and this is what he said.

If in a street fight he would kick the body, then once bent over he would kick the head. He said that most people would be done from simple kicks to the body and that head kicks would not really be needed. He says that he only kicks to the head in competition becaues it scores more points. He also said that it is hard to kick people in competiton to the head because they train to look out for them. He states kicking people that don't train to defend from head kicks is easy and if in a street fight he could most likely kick anyone in the head easily if they were just non martial artist. So after that thought he said he would still kick the body first but if he could tell they were not tained he would end it quickly with a head kick.

When you compete you get to the point where you asses your opponent rather quickly. This is just how competitors think. This then leads me back to my statement of, if you can you will, and if you can't you won't. Many can't so they just put down or dismiss head, high, fancy, whatever kicks. The ones that can know when to and will. Those that think they can, but are not that good at it, will try and some will succeed, and some will fail. Simple as that.

No one can 100% say it works, and know one can 100% say it does not. It is up to each individual and that individuals skill level.

When will He be old enough to make an Account on here?