Discussion in 'Karate' started by Henderson, Dec 4, 2005.
How many practitioners of Goju Ryu do we have here at MT?
Studied Goju-Ryu under Sensei Sonny Ono in my younger years and it helped me make the transition into Kempo.
I studied it many years ago (Okinwan Goju-ryu Karate-do Shobukan), but not now.
Studied with Firdaus S.A in High school, never went beyond Saifa, Sanchin and Tensho though. During my university days I switch to Wado-ryu. But I still do Sanchin and Tensho almost everyday.
Incidentally, my Wado sensei also holds a Shodan in Goju. So he was like me, he studied Goju a little before switch to Wado.
I found the breathing Katas of Goju far superior than any Wado Kata. So I am keeping my Goju Kata in my personal training sessions. I also like the body conditioning like arm pounding, exchanging leg kicks etc.
I loved Tensho. What a great kata!
Some people told me that the tensho hand movements (the pushing and pulling and craneblocks etc) has some resemblances to arnis hand trapping techniques, is this true?
You can make a cse for that. I wouls say that I notice a huge resemblance of Tensho to Wing Chun, and a resemblance of Wing Chun to arnis.
"notice a huge resemblance of Tensho to Wing Chun"
This is not too surpising since Goju Ryu is essentially a Chinese art. You can go to places in southern China where they still practice the Goju Kata almost exactly the same, of course with the exception of the Miyagi created kata.
I studied Goju Ryu in the National Karate and Jiu Jitsu Union under Bill Knoblock and also in IOGKF under Jong Lee.
One of my Aikido teachers also taught Goju Ryu at another school. He used to bring his Goju students to Aikido class to further explore the bunkai to thier kata. He said that every Aikido technique is found some where in Goju Ryu. I believe that.
I knew of the similarities to Five Ancestor Fist and crane styles, but was surprised how very similar Tensho and the basic moves of Wing Chun were.
Uh oh.. so.. Goju, Wing Chun, Arnis, all rooted in South China and therefore all are same concepts with different packaging?
I thought GM. Miyagi created tensho from his own head?
But apparently the movements he used to construct tensho already existed in the older arts?
Well, Wing Chun and Goju have roots in Southern China, but not arnis. I think that's more a matter of coincidence. There are also fewer similarities there.
Isn't Tensho a modification by Chojun Miyagi of an older Chinese form? Rokkishu, maybe?
The current issue of JAMA (Vol. 14, No. 4) has an article on Yagi Meitoku and the 5 paired kata he contributed to the art. It was interesting reading.
As far as I know, the only kata that Miyagi created are the Gekisai.
Is Tensho not found in other styles?
I don't think it's in other Karate styles (that aren't variants of Goju), but I do think it's from a Chinese original. I don't know how modified it is.
Some of the open palm movements looks like "Saamchien" done in south china Kuntao. We have Kuntao people too here in Indonesia.
The Okinawan Sanchin is absolutely the same as the Chinese Sam Chien, albeit modified. Tensho has some similarities to it but is softer. They're related; I've seen them compared to Yin and Yang aspects (Sanchin being hard, Tensho being soft).
I have videoclips of Chinese people doing Saam Chien. Is it ok to post it here?
"Some of the open palm movements looks like "Saamchien""
Isn't this nearly identical to the original Sanchin?
There is a video from Dragon-Tsunami on the Saamchien from Feeding Crane Style. I have not seen the video but it was reccomended to me in order to see the close Chinese connection.
Well, it's certainly OK by me. What's the concern? Copyright?
Yup, that's one. But I will go ahead and post it within a few days. The people demonstrating this aren't professionals mind you, they just plain chinese citizens who train at parks at their spare time. They dont even have uniforms on. However their technique are very good. I guess that's one proof that we dont really need high-tech training centers to become good in the martial arts.123
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