First Aid Training

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Talk' started by Big Don, Jun 8, 2008.

  1. Big Don

    Big Don Sr. Grandmaster

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    My Sifu and I were talking the other day and we discussed First Aid.
    How much first aid training have you had?
    When was your last refresher course?
    What supplies do you keep on hand?
    Should some/all students be required to know first aid?


    ________________________
    I have had fairly extensive First Aid training.
    I haven't had a refresher course since 92 (hanging my head in shame)
    Bandages, gauze, tape, not much else
    I think so. We, as students have a responsibility to our fellow students, IMHO.

    We will be discussing first aid this week. Possibly taking a few people to the Red Cross office in town for formal training, etc.
     
  2. Deaf Smith

    Deaf Smith Master of Arts

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    First aid from the Red Cross. CPR from the American Heart Assoc. I'm also part of my company's ERT, emergency response team (hazmat guys, not the bomb squad) and we do all kinds of scenarios.

    At the gunrange we keep a Red Cross first aid kit. It's expensive I might add, well past 100 bucks and I even added gun shot bandages.

    I feel every dojo should have a good first aid kit, even a defilibrator and knowledge on how to use it. Never know if someone has a heart attack there. And of course, the training to back it up whatever happens. Add an good phone with emergency numbers taped to it.

    Deaf
     
  3. Kacey

    Kacey Sr. Grandmaster

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    I am certified by the American Red Cross

    February

    Bandaids, gauze, Ace bandages, ice packs, alcohol, cotton - that's in my gym bag. The YMCA where I teach has a larger/more complete kit... and we're right next to a fire station should something really nasty happen (knock on wood).

    Instructors and assistant instructors - yes. All students? I don't see how. My class at the moment ranges from ages 14-45 - and while the 14 year-old could handle it easily, two of the adults are developmentally delayed, and I don't think they're cognitively capable - and one has cerebral palsy; his fine motor skills are pretty iffy, and I don't think he could do much with an emergency except go for help. Other classes have different issues - the age of the students, the abilities, liability issues, etc.

    I think that all adults and older teens should know when they can treat injuries (theirs or others) themselves, and when to call for help - but that's independent of martial arts; that's just sensible, IMHO.
     
  4. Xue Sheng

    Xue Sheng All weight is underside

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    Interesting you should post this; I was just thinking last week that I really need to renew my Red Cross Certification. It lapse years ago, but then it has been years since I taught. I had it when I taught and when I worked in Security. I need to go do the whole program all over again because I think it is a good thing to have even though I no longer teach.

    As for students, now I do not think they should be required to have the certification. I do agree with what has been posted here that teachers should and I also agree that "official" assistant teachers should as well.

    As to my 2 CMA sifu's Taiji he is an MD, Sanda.... well... also an MD
     
  5. ktaylor75

    ktaylor75 Orange Belt

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    First Aid and CPR certified from the Red Cross. I do specialized foster care and have to get re-certified each year.
     
  6. MBuzzy

    MBuzzy Grandmaster

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    Let's keep in mind also the Good Samaritan laws. It can be a double edged proverbial sword as well. If you ARE CPR certified and DO NOT help, you can be held liable. If you ARE NOT CPR certified and DO try to help, you can also be held liable. The good thing is that if you are certified and help, you can't be held responsible if something goes wrong.

    Personally, I'm CPR and First Aid certified, renewed last December. My Combat Life Saver certification just went overdue, but it is VERY hard to get renewed.

    I feel that any school should have at the very least a basic first aid kit. You can pay anywhere from $10 to $500 depending on what you want in it and that's not even starting to discuss AED's...which could also be useful in some cases. I'd say the most important first aid thing you can have in this day and age is GOOD INSURANCE. :shrug: But that's another topic entirely...

    I definately wouldn't say that every student should know it, but it would be ideal to have at least one per class. Instructors and Assistant Instructors are a big yes....
     
  7. chinto

    chinto Senior Master

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    if you have been a medical professional though the legality's become nasty. in my state as an ex EMT I can not treat any one. the good Samaritan law does not cover you unless you treat to your level of training. and if you do its practicing medicine with out a license at that level. That is a felony, and you are really in trouble... so I will call 911 but I will NOT touch any one on advice of an attorney.

    ohh by the way at least in my state you have no duty to treat any one unless you are a medical professional who is in public employment in that aria .. then your responsibility and duty to treat would only aply in your aria, city or county that you are employed.
     
  8. MA-Caver

    MA-Caver Sr. Grandmaster

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    Very good thread/topic and an important one.

    Personally my (certified) first aid training has been somewhere along the lines of
    Advanced First Aid by the Red Cross (which they no longer teach and to my understanding turned out to be roughly EMT level at the time) ... no longer certified in that anyway.
    First Responder, which included the basic CPR, First Aid... that certification lapsed a while back.
    Wilderness First Aid, which is to say is basic first aid with a few specialty treatments thrown in (snake/animal bites, poisoned by wild plants mistakenly eaten, etc.), was told the cert was for life but lost the paperwork/card some years ago so... :idunno:
    I would very much like to get re-certified in First Responder at least. I can't stand the thought of seeing someone in need of help and not doing anything. I'd want the same if it were me.

    I usually try to keep a moderate first aid kit in my vehicle and a smaller simpler one in my (caving) pack.

    IMO all students should learn because of the nature of the training involved. Accidents happen during training and it's a good idea to be able to at least DO something more than just call 911.

    On the "Good Samaritan Law" comments... I agree that it sucks pretty much and is a double edged sword in some states. My cave-rescue instructor who was a (licensed) paramedic at the time (now retired) told me that he wouldn't do CPR on anyone ... especially in a cave away from Defib equipment because he said that legally once you START CPR you cannot STOP doing it until the person is turned over to other EMS or is hooked up to a Defibrillator for reasons that CPR is very tiring and if you stop and the person dies you could be held to blame for not keeping their heart pumping.

    Basically the damned if you do and damned if you don't laws were written by those same type of detestable lawyers who'd sue you for defending yourself against a psychotic serial killer.
    So coming up on an accident or someone in serious need of first aid I'm gonna help and stay with them til EMS arrives and then quietly fade off in the background. Damned what the lawyers say. They'd probably think different if they're in their wrecked vehicle and bleeding to death and see a bunch of people standing around not making a move to help because they might get sued for doing so.
     
  9. Drac

    Drac Sr. Grandmaster

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    Most of the the officers in my departments have had First Responder training....We renew every year..It's a good idea that all Sifu, Sensei's and their assistants have a good working knowledge of CPR and Basic First Aid..
     
  10. Tez3

    Tez3 Sr. Grandmaster

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    I have to be first aid trained for my work, my instructor is a first aid trainer. All the adult students are first aid trained by the army, ordinary and battlefield first aid. We have a comprehensive first aid box but we also have Army medics and doctors on site so never have far to go. I looked into getting a defibrillator after reading anothe thread but it's far too expensive here to get one (£1000/$2000 for basic one)
    We have no laws here about whether or who should help in a situation. No one has been sued either for rendering first aid.
     
  11. Mr G

    Mr G Orange Belt

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    I am an ED RN and the EMS coordinator for our volunteer fire dept. I asked at our dojong, but the First Aid kit is just a box of band-aids. I think the best investment would be a defibrillator. It could make the biggest bang for the buck[​IMG]... Most of the bleeding / broken stuff can wait for EMS if you just keep the patient stable. A heart attack needs a jolt right now!

    Most states good sam laws protect you as long as you don't do something really outrageous and don't charge for your services
     
  12. PictonMA

    PictonMA Orange Belt

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    The organization I belong to requires all instructors (and recomends that all Brown and Black Belts) be First Aid and CPR certified - renewed annually.

    I've had mine renewed every year since 1990. My wife is a Registered Nurse and renews hers annually as a part of her qork requirements.

    Annually we try to also have a course hosted / recommended by our club that students / family members can attend.
     
  13. Blindside

    Blindside Senior Master

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    Wilderness First Responder, and the usual CPR/AED certs. I've had continuous basic first aid certifications since my time in Boy Scouts. I increased my skill level after having twice been the first person on the scene of car accidents in the boonies of Wyoming. I keep a first responder bag in each of the cars and in the house.

    I think everyone should know first aid, you never know when something stupid is going to happen.

    Lamont
     
  14. masherdong

    masherdong 2nd Black Belt

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    Ditto.

    Last refresher course for both was almost a year ago.
     
  15. GradualProgression

    GradualProgression Yellow Belt

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    I'm CPR certified.
     
  16. Brian R. VanCise

    Brian R. VanCise MT Moderator Staff Member

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    We just had a Red Cross Heart Saver CPR class in the Training Hall last month.

    In the past I have been a First Aid and CPR instructor.

    This is an important skill set that everyone should know.
    Good thread! [​IMG]
     
  17. clfsean

    clfsean Senior Master

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    CPR/AED & First Aid certified here. Last refresher was Aug last year. It was required by the college I was teaching at.

    It's not a bad idea to have & use, but as many have already stated & I'll parrot... know your local Good Samaritan's laws & how they apply.
     
  18. SenseiBear

    SenseiBear Blue Belt

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    My instructor has required all students to be CPR certified and to keep it current for about the last 15 years. My last re-cert was March.

    We are a small, non-commercial class of all adults. We had a student have a heart attack and die during class in the early 90's. Sensei performed CPR til the paramedics arrived, but Bob was gone.
     
  19. chinto

    chinto Senior Master

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    OK, I used to teach that advanced first aid class when I was an EMT.. it was not and is not a first responder level, and defiantly not an EMT level.. you were not taught to use airways of any kind, or to prep IV's or to use mass trousers, or do injections or deal with any number of things that an EMT has to know.
    if you treat as a "first aider" you are not a medical professional with a state or federal license/certification.. this means that most states good Samaritan laws do protect you!
    You are not bound by law to meet the "standards of care" and some other things, and are not a "medical professional" under the laws.
    I don't care about getting sued.. but charged with felony or capital murder is a completely different animal! that is the damned difference!
    you do not face that possible outcome.. I would according to the attorney that I consulted back then. so you feel free to do so. I was the same way, but now because of the stupid way some of the laws are written, I can not help.. I can call 911 and that is about all I can do for you. if you are not my family or a very few 4 or so other people, so sorry but you are on your own. I might advise a bystander that some one should do so and so.. but touch you.. nope.. that leaves me open to to much legal jeopardy! I have found over the years that the old cynical adage is true: "no good deed will go unpunished more often then not."
    if you had the state/federal certification of First Responder , that used to be 45 hours or so of training and continuing ed to keep it, and its expired, go consult an attorney before you find out some how you are in the same boat and face serious criminal charges possibly if things go sour and you did treat to that level... not sure if you do as an ex First Responder... but at least I was told I do as an ex EMT.123
     

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