Villari's masters Program

[KempoFlow]

As John Bishop said in the sticky, there are always exceptions within organizations, and if you've found one, then I'm happy for you.

Exactly my point in my OP.

 

[Tenguru]

Allow me to introduce myself. My name is Tenguru, and I used to train at Villaris. In fact, I trained there for about 5 years.

Let me point out that MY IMPRESSION of the entire Shaolin Kempo ranking structure is that it is designed to make money for the company, not to provide any accurate measure of fighting ability. In fact, MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE is that most of the practitioners I trained with (and learned from) sucked at actual hand-to-hand combat.

yellow,orange,purple,blue, blue w/stripe, green, green w/stripe, brown 3rd, brown 2cd, brown 1st, black. Each "test" costing about $40(in the early nineties). Want to "learn weapons"? Better pony up a few hundred bucks to learn a form.

Learning "material" from a DVD.

The "masters" program sounds like another variant of the "ATP" (Advanced Training Program) that Villaris had back in the 90's.

I recommend that you all stop paying $200/month to learn to defend against telegraphed step-through lunge punches and rediculous wrist-graps and improperly applied chokes. Train in applied martial arts where you learn to defend against people actually trying to **** you up in class.

I can not spell very well.

Thank you.

P.S. You shouldn't give a darn if some people pay extra in order to advance more quickly. Just because the instructor is giving them more "material" (my favorite word of Villari speak) doesn't make him more skilled. Just because John Smith, who has been training the same amount of time as you (but in the masters club) knows 2 Kata, and you dont .... .... do you think that means he can magically kick your ***? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Of course not. It just means he fell for the marketing ploy. $50 bucks for a belt does not a fighter make.

 

[Mariachi Joe]

So what style or dojo would you recommend Tenguru?

 

[Tenguru]

So what style or dojo would you recommend Tenguru?

It's not so much the style. There are some very good Ke(m|n)po organizations out there. I was referring to my specific experiences with one in particular.

If you are in reasonable health I recommend schools that emphasize contact sparring. There are good karate and kung fu schools that do this. Kyokushin, San Shou, some Kenpo/Kempo schools, Boxing, Wrestling, Mauy Thai, Sombo, Judo, Gracie JuJitsu, etc. And crosstrain if you can.

 

[Mariachi Joe]

I've thought about cross training. There's a place that teaches Brazilian Jujitsu close to where I work ( my supervisor trains there and recommends it highly) and I'd like to check it out sometime.

 

[Tenguru]

I've thought about cross training. There's a place that teaches Brazilian Jujitsu close to where I work ( my supervisor trains there and recommends it highly) and I'd like to check it out sometime.

If you have the time, take a few classes. Most of the BJJ places I have visited allow you to train for a few weeks without requireing a commitment. Grappling arts are great because the physicality of the training will make you tough as nails. The cardio and fatigue you experience is awesome. Grapplers get to apply their techniques at full speed and power against resisting opponents. That said, you still need to know how to strike and work the clinch to be a complete fighter. If you just want to learn some basic self defense, learning all ranges of hand-to-hand combat may be overkill, though. It depends on your goals.

 

[Mariachi Joe]

My aim is to be the best all around martial artist that I can be. I've been in love the martial arts since I was a kid, and it's a thrill to finally be able to be a part of it.

 

[Danjo]

I've thought about cross training. There's a place that teaches Brazilian Jujitsu close to where I work ( my supervisor trains there and recommends it highly) and I'd like to check it out sometime.

BJJ is a very good art for ground work.even if you only take if for a few months, it's well worth it.

 

[Mariachi Joe]

Yeah maybe when I'm done with ussd and have a little extra $ I'll do some BJJ

 

[Danjo]

Yeah maybe when I'm done with ussd and have a little extra $ I'll do some BJJ

USSD+ 215.00 per month (165.00 per month w/discount but I don't count that since I had to pay it back when I quit)

Ralph Gracie JJ = 110.00 per month

I don't know what the prices are where you're at now, but that was what it was here a couple of years ago. So if you can afford USSD, you should be able to afford BJJ.

 

[shaolin ninja 4]

Yeah maybe when I'm done with ussd and have a little extra $ I'll do some BJJ

Hey joe did you ever call that shaolin arts place?

Before you jump in to another school check out the rec centers first.
You might just find the right instructor/style your looking for!

Just because a guy rents a place doesn't mean he knows what he is doing.
A lot of instructors just want to teach but can't afford a retail center.

 

[Mariachi Joe]

No the only one I've contacted so far is Jeff Hayes, he teaches Kara-Ho. I tried contacting a couple of epak dojos but one # was a teenage girls cell phone who had no idea what epak was and the other was a child who also had no idea what epak was. Still planning on calling the shaolin centers, arrowhead, and a BJJ studio.

 

[shaolin ninja 4]

No the only one I've contacted so far is Jeff Hayes, he teaches Kara-Ho. I tried contacting a couple of epak dojos but one # was a teenage girls cell phone who had no idea what epak was and the other was a child who also had no idea what epak was. Still planning on calling the shaolin centers, arrowhead, and a BJJ studio.

You'll like shaolin centers teaches real shaolin kung fu and they promote you on fighting not sales.

 

[Gufbal1982]

USSD+ 215.00 per month (165.00 per month w/discount but I don't count that since I had to pay it back when I quit)

Ralph Gracie JJ = 110.00 per month

I don't know what the prices are where you're at now, but that was what it was here a couple of years ago. So if you can afford USSD, you should be able to afford BJJ.

If you can afford USSD, you can afford anywhere to be honest.

 

[Mariachi Joe]

I'm having a hard time affording ussd, that's why I've started looking elsewhere and am not staying past my contract.

 

[shaolin ninja 4]

I'm having a hard time affording ussd, that's why I've started looking elsewhere and am not staying past my contract.

How much longer do you have?

 

[MeatWad2]

Allow me to introduce myself. My name is Tenguru, and I used to train at Villaris. In fact, I trained there for about 5 years.

Let me point out that MY IMPRESSION of the entire Shaolin Kempo ranking structure is that it is designed to make money for the company, not to provide any accurate measure of fighting ability. In fact, MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE is that most of the practitioners I trained with (and learned from) sucked at actual hand-to-hand combat.

yellow,orange,purple,blue, blue w/stripe, green, green w/stripe, brown 3rd, brown 2cd, brown 1st, black. Each "test" costing about $40(in the early nineties). Want to "learn weapons"? Better pony up a few hundred bucks to learn a form.

Learning "material" from a DVD.

The "masters" program sounds like another variant of the "ATP" (Advanced Training Program) that Villaris had back in the 90's.

I recommend that you all stop paying $200/month to learn to defend against telegraphed step-through lunge punches and rediculous wrist-graps and improperly applied chokes. Train in applied martial arts where you learn to defend against people actually trying to **** you up in class.

I can not spell very well.

Thank you.

P.S. You shouldn't give a darn if some people pay extra in order to advance more quickly. Just because the instructor is giving them more "material" (my favorite word of Villari speak) doesn't make him more skilled. Just because John Smith, who has been training the same amount of time as you (but in the masters club) knows 2 Kata, and you dont .... .... do you think that means he can magically kick your ***? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Of course not. It just means he fell for the marketing ploy. $50 bucks for a belt does not a fighter make.

I attended a Villari's back in the 90's and I remember the ATP patches. They were cool. I wanted a patch because I was an instructor and the other ones had one...so, I asked him if I could buy one. He had NO IDEA what ATP stood for, so he said it stood for "Advanced Teaching Program" and I couldn't get one till I turned 21 or owned my own school. So, I bought a license for a school. Where's my patch??

 

[Mariachi Joe]

I've got 10 months left.

 

[Gufbal1982]

I attended a Villari's back in the 90's and I remember the ATP patches. They were cool. I wanted a patch because I was an instructor and the other ones had one...so, I asked him if I could buy one. He had NO IDEA what ATP stood for, so he said it stood for "Advanced Teaching Program" and I couldn't get one till I turned 21 or owned my own school. So, I bought a license for a school. Where's my patch??

You mean they never gave you your patch? What a rip!

 

[yogaji]

The school I am at now has a new program they call the Masters program. You get 4 classes a week and 1 private lesson plus a new uniform with the new villaris logo on the Gi and a racing stripe down the sides, with free patches, and the Villaris White Belt to Black Belt DVD set. And seemingly accelerated advancement. Here is the thing though. It seeems to me since they started this that the rest of us (I am not in the program, it costs much more than the regular program.
They have been running the program since I was an orange belt, I am a blue belt now. I don't have a problem with the program, I know someone who is in it and he is progressing nicely. BUT, I have noticed that as I am advancing now, I am NOT beign show new material for my new belt levels in class, but the Masters are. It happened at purple and again at Blue. I asked repeatedly to be show several combinations and forms and neither my main instructors or any of the other instructors did. I only learned the new material from the DVD set I bought, and then my Main instructor recently told me I was doing one of the combinatins wrong, that he doesn't teach it the way it is on the dvd. I bought the DVD from him when he was trying to sell me on the Master program. I'm a little frustrated as I have been really working hard to improve. Before this program started after each advancement we were shown the new material we needed to learn for our next ranks. And in class we would break up into groups by levels so we could practice more advanced materials. Now the ONLY material he seems to focus on in class is the basic material Piono one, combo 6,7, and 8 point blocking system, etc. Nothing really above yellow belt. We have had a lot of turn over lately, new people come in, but don't seem to stay past yellow or orange. I know hee needs to teach them, but I feel I am missing out because I have advance and am not in the special Masters program. I think my money should at least get me the basics of my belt level. Has anyone else here had any experience with this program in their school?

This is not to discredit FV, the man is awesome. however has told several versions of his truth for yrs. I am a former Fred Villari instructor and school owner in RI. I can tell you from when i first started studying in 1976, I remember seeing his brochure which stated that he studied in China. Giving the whole history of shaolin Kempo. then years later he finally says that he created the systems he originally said he studied. And then years later he says he studied with Master Chow and Nick Cerio. Funny thing is though why did he wait to say he studied with Master Cerio untill Master Cerio passed away. He had over two hundred schools in the usa and canada. most went under because of his unethical business practises. Masters program is nothing more that the brown and black belt programs he used to offer in his schools. A student paid approxiamately $2600. for a black belf program which says that you didn't have to pay again until you reached the rank of black belt. There are things you need to remember. 75% of students will drop out or discontinue their training before the rank of black belt. But the real story is how the FV schools began selling black belt cards for $350. Sure they had a couple of months, but within 3 to 4 months 3/4 of the school were no longer paying any tuition. Schools started going under. I purchased a franchise in RI and my wife and i didn't check the books. 3/4 of the school weren't paying tuition. It forced RI to create a law that health clubs weren't allowed to offer any membership programs that promised anything over a yr.
I'm not bashing FV fighting ability, however when someone doesn't tell the truth you have to begin to question what else are they lieing about?