Time in vs. Rank

[Han-Mi]

Something I saw in another post prompted this. I fealt it needed it's own topic for discussion.
When you talk to a fellow MAist, do you put more on their rank or years of experience? I know of plenty of good 1st dan BB's that are relatively equal to each other despite 1 or even 2 years in difference of training time. But, what about when it comes to 3-5 years or even 6 years of difference, while still being the same rank or lower.
Basically?
Do you ask how many years someone has trained, their rank or both?
Do you pass a judgement, even an innocent little comparason to yourself? And to what degree?

To add one more element, do you ask what their training experience is?
i.e style(s), Teaching experience, sport tournaments, MMA and Full contact fighting, etc.


I personally find myself wanting to test someones ability to an extent when I find that they are a higher rank than me with fewer years in. Not that I want to fight the person, I just would like to see their training regimen, and/or techniques.

Let's leave our ranks and years out of it, so we don't pass judgement on each other, though many of you know the basic rank of each other.

 

[MJS]

I take both into consideration. Keep in mind, that just because someone may be wearing a purple belt, doesnt mean that they could have trained in another art, therefore, offering more experience than the rank they are wearing is showing. Of course, if you saw someone with an 8th degree BB, one may assume that the person is a wealth of knowledge. This may or may not be true. Of course, the person, at that rank, should be able to provide you with very detailed knowledge of the subject that you're asking about.

I can however give one example from personal experience. I've spoken to a high ranking Kenpoist about may things in the art of Kenpo. He is fully capable of providing me with more info. than I could think of. My point? He is a perfect example of someone who has a wealth of knowledge as well as a high rank around his waist.

Mike

 

[OULobo]

This is kind of a interesting topic. I would say that I respect both, but in each in a different way. Time in usually allows for better knowledge of the system, traditions, history, culture and older versions. Rank, if it is given for the right reasons, is usually a measure of performance, ability to apply the art and understanding of the art. As always there are pitfalls to watch for. Like the guy who has been in the art forever, but still hasn't learned much or the people who use politics to try and get rank. In the end it is about the individual.

 

[Flatlander]

Usually, I'm interested in how long they've been doing the art they're currently studying, and what other arts and for how long. Rank doesn't tell me anything at all, as I have no first hand knowledge of what the rank requirements for their schools are. I haven't gotten around a lot.

 

[kenpo tiger]

Usually, I'm interested in how long they've been doing the art they're currently studying, and what other arts and for how long. Rank doesn't tell me anything at all, as I have no first hand knowledge of what the rank requirements for their schools are. I haven't gotten around a lot.

At least you ask. There are many people out there who are guilty of jumping to conclusions by judging superficials - like a belt. Or, they figure that their belt rank is higher, therefore they know more (without bothering to talk to the person they are making the assumption about) and thus butt in under the guise of "helping" because they are of higher rank and THEY know (being nice here).

As was stated upthread, you can have someone of a lower rank with a wealth of knowledge acquired through their experience in ma generally, or you can have someone with a higher rank who doesn't know a from b (also being nice here) - I've trained with a couple of those. KT

 

[Mark Weiser]

If you were to walk into the school I attend and see me wearing a purple belt you would not suspect that I have over 24 years of MA experience.

 

[Flatlander]

At least you ask. There are many people out there who are guilty of jumping to conclusions by judging superficials - like a belt. Or, they figure that their belt rank is higher, therefore they know more ... KT

And you know what? I'm not this balanced due to any amount of experience or innate openmindedness, that's just been the value of my time spent at Martial Talk. I've gained so much context here. Its all good.

 

[Bammx2]

I don't pay attention to rank too much.Never have.

I'm a 1st dan in a couple of different styles. I have started training at the age of 6.....I am 38 now.

And I have no desire to go any higher in rank.
But I will because of the litte grading and insurance papers only......

 

[kenpo tiger]

If you were to walk into the school I attend and see me wearing a purple belt you would not suspect that I have over 24 years of MA experience.

I'm sure it would show the moment you did a tech or drill. It always does, if one bothers to notice. KT

 

[7starmantis]

I tend to ask more about time in the art, although that can be decieving if I've been a member of a school for 20 years and attended 6 classes. I guess time and rank should be taken together, but with so many schools having different ranking systems and different systems not even using rank its a little off. Someone can tell me their rank and it basically means nothing to me. I place almost no importance on it, I really want to see how long they have been training, how they train, what kind of passion they have for their art. That type of thing.

7sm

 

[terryl965]

I look at time in alot of old timers like myself, been around since the early sixes and it just kills me when somebody a quarter of my age says WOW I the same as you with-out ever looking at the time spent. This October the 17th it's been 20 years since I last tested, see no real sense in it anymore. My training comes from knowledge of the Art, I'm always happy for those 6 and 7 Dans out there by the time they are 25 to 30 great for them. I hope one day they relize that the Art that they practice is more than a stripe on a belt as I did. My old Instructor once told me when I grow up then I will begin the full training of TKD the Art and so I have... GOD BLESS AMERICA and all the Old Timers who just enjoy the Art of TKD

 

[karatekid1975]

Someone found out that I did MA. He did ask me how long I have been with it. I just told him, "I'm a rookie." He said, "no, really. How long?" I told him 4 years. He was suprised that I said I was a rookie LOL.

Like it was said before, you can't really rely on a person's rank, because people like me that have done more than one art. No I didn't get that far in my previous art, but I gained enough knowledge (training 4 to 6 days a week for a year) from it that you could tell that I wasn't really a white belt in TKD when I started.

Both my instructors (TSD and TKD) did more than one art. So They are ranked in other systems. I asked my TSD instructor once what rank he was (4th dan at the time), he told me, but then he clued me in about his previous studies in another art (TKD and Hapkido mix, I think it was). So after that, I would ask people about years, not rank.

 

[Enson]

i think both would be important. i mean the guy/gal could have 35 yrs. in their art but never be able to pass to the next belt for whatever reasons. also one would assume if they have been promoted to their rank then they deserved it!

 

[OC Kid]

This is a tough one. I just got back from vacation and visited my old dojo it has a new instructor a guy I came up through the ranks with and my old GF who was I was her mentor. I also visited a school ran by a old instructor of mine I always called him my second Sensei.
Well they teach the same things that they did about 15 years ago. No or very little imagination though one guy showed a technique I used at a tournament he was judgeing but that was about 12 years ago.
I think time in rank is a good indicator , I think belt rank is a good indicator but imagination and learning new skills and techniques is the most important thing a person can do.

 

[kenpo tiger]

This is a tough one... I think time in rank is a good indicator , I think belt rank is a good indicator but imagination and learning new skills and techniques is the most important thing a person can do.

One cannot do that unless one is still training and learning. That's why I like kenpo. The art is constantly evolving, and it can be tailored to fit most situations easily. KT

 

[Zepp]

I don't usually ask what someone's rank is, unless we're getting into an in-depth discussion, or unless they practice the same style of TKD as I do. I usually just ask how long someone's been training, and sometimes I ask how often. I feel it tells me more about them.

 

[Rob Broad]

For me, I guage each person differently. I take them on what I see, and feel. If they move well and have a good attitude, I have no problem what tehy wear, but if they can't walk and chew gum at the same time and are wearing a high rank they will get no respect from me. I have seen too many inflated egos and inflated ranks, for me I prefer to see what the person can do,a dn judge for myself.

 

[kenpo tiger]

For me, I guage each person differently. I take them on what I see, and feel. If they move well and have a good attitude, I have no problem what tehy wear, but if they can't walk and chew gum at the same time and are wearing a high rank they will get no respect from me. I have seen too many inflated egos and inflated ranks, for me I prefer to see what the person can do,a dn judge for myself.

Exactly my point as well. Thanks Rob! KT

 

[terryl965]

Exactly my point as well. Thanks Rob! KT

I have to agree thanks KT and ROB..GOD BLESS AMERICA

 

[Shodan]

Yeah- each person is different, but I think I tend to pay more attention to time in the arts than belt color. My first instructor was a brown belt who, for some reason, felt inadequate to take the black belt test even though he'd been up for it several times. He was one of the best practitioners I've ever run into and had many years of experience under his belt.........even though during the time I trained with him, he couldn't or wouldn't move himself beyond first brown.

I also had a friend who, due to time away from the art (Gulf War), came back and chose to start over at white instead of wear the rank he'd achieved before time off. So.......if I'd seen him for the first time wearing his white belt (but not seen him move) and judged him by that, I wouldn't have known the guy had several more years than I did in the system and remembered quite a bit of it.

Sometimes people of a certain rank don't move very well for that rank also........it helps not only to know their background and time in, but also to see how they move.

:asian: :karate: