Systema a discussion

[Gweilo]

I agree, Systema does not translate well in video.

99% of that video was crap, and not systema

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

it takes 3 to 5 years to master the very basics.

In 6 months, if someone can learn

- wrestling single leg and uses it to take down most people,
- boxing jab, cross combo and uses it to knock down most people,

his 6 months wrestling training or boxing training will be better than the 3 to 5 years Systema training.

You first set up your goal (be able to fight in 6 months). You then find a path to reach it. the Systema will not be the right path for you.

 

[Gweilo]

To be honest it was pretty much the first one on youtube
Any chance you could point me to a better reference video?

Thanks

You could try a search on the zettler twins, matt hill, or vladimir vasiliev or ryo onishi

 

[wab25]

99% of that video was crap, and not systema

You could try a search on the zettler twins, matt hill, or vladimir vasiliev or ryo onishi

Vladimir Vasiliev was in that video quite a bit, as was Mikhail Ryabko... these guys are decent Systema guys right?

 

[Gweilo]

In 6 months, if someone can learn

- wrestling single leg and uses it to take down most people,
- boxing jab, cross combo and uses it to knock down most people,

his 6 months wrestling training or boxing training will be better than the 3 to 5 years Systema training.

You first set up your goal (be able to fight in 6 months). You then find a path to reach it. the Systema will not be the right path for you.

I agree, but would it not depend on the response of the individual?
What is the point of learning jab hook cross, or a leg take down, if you freeze, or your mind falls to pieces at the very point it needs to be calm, how good is the jab hook cross, when 120kg man is bearing down on you, and it's your 1st or 2nd fight with no sparring experience. 6 months training is nothing

 

[Gweilo]

Vladimir Vasiliev was in that video quite a bit, as was Mikhail Ryabko... these guys are decent Systema guys right?

I just watched the video again, Ryabko is in the video, vladamir is not, there is a bloke that could be mistaken for a younger vlad, but he moves nothing like him.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Think about it like this. Does it take a boxer 5 years to be able to understand how to throw a decent punch

This is what I came to in forming my curriculum. I focus early-on in just a few areas, to build some ability quickly. It's narrow, but provides some tools (takedown defense, simple ground work, punching and knees). Then they get into the full curriculum, which builds on that foundation to give them a wider range of responses to a wider range of situations.

But it all starts with defending against and delivering a decent punch.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

6 months training is nothing

We all had 6 months of training at some point. It's not nothing. The question is, "Can it be more than we have made it in the past?"

 

[Gweilo]

We all had 6 months of training at some point. It's not nothing. The question is, "Can it be more than we have made it in the past?"

I will conceded 6 months is not nothing, but quality, and mind set are not formed over 6 months, most of us know the really hard work most MA practioners put in, and must understand there are no short cuts.

 

[Headhunter]

I agree, but would it not depend on the response of the individual?
What is the point of learning jab hook cross, or a leg take down, if you freeze, or your mind falls to pieces at the very point it needs to be calm, how good is the jab hook cross, when 120kg man is bearing down on you, and it's your 1st or 2nd fight with no sparring experience. 6 months training is nothing

If your doing boxing then you'll almost certainly have sparred in 6 months. If your a wrestler you'll have had a live wrestling practice. From what I've seen there's not any sparring in systema even the instructor in my area said there's no sparring in it and he's a student of this vladimir guy

 

[jobo]

this guy is definitely working up to blowing up a fuel depot

 

[wab25]

I just watched the video again, Ryabko is in the video, vladamir is not, there is a bloke that could be mistaken for a younger vlad, but he moves nothing like him.

It did look like Vladamir... and the description credited Vladamir...

Anyway here are some looks at your suggestions, to save people time.
Vladimir Vasiliev

Ryo Onishi

Brian Zettler

(if you see him miss the atomic butt bounce in the beginning, keep watching, he does connect the atomic butt bounce at the end... 3:30)

 

[Headhunter]

We all had 6 months of training at some point. It's not nothing. The question is, "Can it be more than we have made it in the past?"

6 months is plenty of time under good instruction. Sure you won't be an expert but you'll know the basics. You'll be fitter and stronger and more co-ordinated and should've had a bit of sparring by then so should have a basic idea of how to block and strike resisting opponents (assuming it's a striking style your training)

 

[drop bear]

You see that's my problem....3-5 to even get the basics....that's not much use for self defence is it. I mean hey it's fine for learning an art but say I'm mr average guy who gets beat up in a nightclub and I want to learn self defence and I go to systema class...that means I'll have to prey like hell that I don't get attacked for 5 years of my training.

3 to five years to master the basics. How long does it take to be a successful pro boxer?

 

[Headhunter]

3 to five years to master the basics. How long does it take to be a successful pro boxer?

Depends on the boxer

 

[dunc]

It did look like Vladamir... and the description credited Vladamir...

Anyway here are some looks at your suggestions, to save people time.
Vladimir Vasiliev

Ryo Onishi

Brian Zettler

(if you see him miss the atomic butt bounce in the beginning, keep watching, he does connect the atomic butt bounce at the end... 3:30)

Yeah unfortunately that pretty much encapsulates what I was talking about

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I will conceded 6 months is not nothing, but quality, and mind set are not formed over 6 months, most of us know the really hard work most MA practioners put in, and must understand there are no short cuts.

No, there are no shortcuts, but we don't have to leave all competence for the long path.

 

[drop bear]

Depends on the boxer

On average.

how long to become a pro boxer? - RossTraining.com

 

[Gerry Seymour]

On average.

how long to become a pro boxer? - RossTraining.com

And that’s more consistent and condensed training than most MAists put in.

 

[Gweilo]

this guy is definitely working up to blowing up a fuel depot

Pmsl never seen that video before, he does look like he is going to blow up a fuel depot, we don't use guns where I train